Home Theater Designer Recommendation in Los Angeles Area?

[NorthStar]

• http://www.areadvd.de/tests/special...r850-mit-dolby-atmos-und-dirac-einmesssystem/
• http://www.areadvd.de/tests/xxl-tes...tmos-ass-mit-dirac-einmessung-fuer-3-300-eur/

Those two Arcam AV receivers (the latest) come with Dolby Atmos, DTS:X and Dirac Live room calibration & EQ system.
They are more expensive than the Japanese/Chinese AV receivers...Denon/Marantz, Onkyo/Integra, Pioneer, Sony...
The Arcam 550 is more affordable than its big brother, the 850.
I used to follow them closely, but it's been a while now...months. The latest news was this: Dirac Live is now effective for all eleven channels, when adding external power amps.
And the Arcam sound is above the other receivers; it's more hi-end quality sound for music listening too. Below that, comes Denon or Yamaha flagship receivers.

We're not talking high-end separates here, but high-end AV receivers, fully loaded like computers with a bunch of apps and Internet connectivity and the latest audio decoders and video processors and 4K true pass thru. And the best room EQs inside receivers...Dirac Live (Arcam), Audyssey MultEQ XT32 latest advancements (offers manual adjust for fine tuning if desired - Denon/Marantz), and advanced YPAO from Yamaha with an incredible amount of manual parameters where you can spend a big part of your life playing with...if you wish.
Yamaha is generally a solid company with good sound reliability.

But yes, Arcam is @ the top, for sound quality.

 

[NorthStar]

• http://gearpatrol.com/2015/02/18/building-perfect-home-theater-at-any-budget/
• http://thewirecutter.com/reviews/the-best-gear-for-your-home-theater/

 

[NorthStar]

Ron, if you're up to it: http://www.avsforum.com/forum/90-re...rs/2194337-arcam-avr-850-arcam-avr-550-a.html

? http://www.avsforum.com/forum/90-re...m-avr-850-arcam-avr-550-a-6.html#post45348977

* Sorry, 7.1.4 is twelve channels total, not eleven (I forgot the sub .1 LFE channel).

 

[Ron Resnick]

Thank you, Bob!

 

[NorthStar]

No sweat Ron, it gives me the opportunity to see where the Arcam AV receivers (AVR850, AVR550 & AVR390) are as of today, with all their firmware updates.

The AVR850 is a Class G amplifier, the others are class A/B. • http://www.arcam.co.uk/products,FMJ,AV-Amplifiers,avr850.htm
And yes, they have Dirac Live for all twelve channels (it's a fact; I was confirmed @ both the USA and the UK forums).
I just came back from the UK forums right now...and reading on the AVR550, and asking few more questions on another thread; the 850 & 550 main thread.

So if you have more questions on Arcam receivers I'll be ready.
You also asked about their latest pre/pro; I will check for that too.
You mentioned that the first room you intended to use was too small and you'll be using another larger room now.
Depending on the speakers you'll be driving, if they are not too demanding, plus if you're using couple subs, then the AVR850 is a powerhouse.
Even the 550 would probably be all you need. And the price is almost twice cheaper.

I used to be quite active @ AFSForum, and I followed closely the latest on AV receivers and pre/pros and Dolby Atmos, DTS:X and even Auro-3D.
But WBF is not the type of clientele for receivers, and even multichannel pre/pros are not playing a big role among the average members.
Sure there are few members that are into it, like Chuck, and couple more.
Kal Rubinson has reviewed most pre/pros on the market, and has extended experience with their 2-channel sound quality, and their Room EQ system.
Kal is using a Marantz AV8802A in his own media room: http://us.marantz.com/us/products/pages/ProductDetails.aspx?CatId=avseparates&ProductId=AV8802A

There is a guy, SteveH, who I highly trust; I will ask him if he knows someone in your area who can help you out.
Give me couple days or so...

 

[bonzo75]

Ron, I wouldn't use the MLs for rear speakers. Rear speakers should either timbre match the front ones or be lower profile than them. The ML character will be too strong compared to anything you use in front. Also the rear wave makes using dipoles, in MCH tougher. I would go with Folsom's recommendation of the Danley as easy to set up, quality speakers for MCH. And if one of your valves in 2ch broke down or you had to and your Gryphon or NAT back to Europe for repairs, you could always listen to music on the Danleys at that time.

 

[trueblue]

Ron, I wouldn't use the MLs for rear speakers. Rear speakers should either timbre match the front ones or be lower profile than them. The ML character will be too strong compared to anything you use in front. Also the rear wave makes using dipoles, in MCH tougher. I would go with Folsom's recommendation of the Danley as easy to set up, quality speakers for MCH. And if one of your valves in 2ch broke down or you had to and your Gryphon or NAT back to Europe for repairs, you could always listen to music on the Danleys at that time.

Gryphon does have a US service centre

 

[NorthStar]

Arcam doesn't have a new multichannel pre/pro. ...Like with Dolby Atmos and DTS:X and Dirac Live. ...Perhaps in a near future, I don't know.
The AVR850, AVR550 and AVR390 are their FMJ line of high-end AV receivers. ...The limousine being the 850.

Anthem has also some interesting new receivers, plus an affordable new pre/pro:
• Specs for their receivers ? http://www.anthemav.com/downloads/MRX-1120-720-520_Datasheet.pdf
• New Anthem receivers and pre/pro: http://www.avsforum.com/forum/90-re...iver-processor-support-dolby-atmos-dts-x.html
• Anthem pre/pro: http://www.avsforum.com/forum/90-re...rs/2004562-official-anthem-avm-60-thread.html

* Anthem uses ARC room calibration and EQ system, using a laptop.
______

? Bonus: SteveH, the guy I mentioned yesterday...his contact: http://www.soundvideo.com/

I PMed him just few minutes ago, to see if he knew someone to recommend in your area. When I get a reply I'll let you know.
Steve knows his stuff, about home theater, good sound, and good friendly business with all classes of people.

 

[NorthStar]

Ron's key post:

"This week we met with Brian of Ahead Stereo and Sunil of Sunny Components. I have known Sunil for several years.

We realize that the current dimensions are too small for the set-up we want. So we will push the viewing position into the audio equipment area of that room. This will allow a home theater room width of 10 feet, a 3 foot deep area on the left side under a staircase for equipment, and a seat-to-screen distance of about 15 feet. The ceiling height is a bit over 7 feet.

It was a bit frustrating that both Brian and Sunil strongly advised us not to use in any way my pair of MartinLogan Prodigys or my pair of MartinLogan Ascents. Even the Ascents (13" wide) might be too wide to stand to the left and to the right of the screen, but I don't see why we cannot use one of those pairs as rear channel speakers.

Brian recommends a Marantz processor and separate amplifier. Sunil recommends an Arcam receiver. I use Arcam integrated amplifiers for two small systems.

I always liked the sound of Arcams for being a bit softer-sounding than typical electronics in that price range. And the new Arcam AVRs have some Dirac DSP whick Kedar would like.

(I think Arcam used to make a well-regarded, standalone home theater processor. Where did that go? Why are they making only receivers now for home theaters?)

Several years ago I experimented with setting up in this space a home theater-type system just with components I had on hand. I aimed an old Sony LCD projector at a portable Da-lite screen. I used the Prodigys for the front channels (powered by the big VTLs) and the Ascents for the rear channels (powered by a VTL Stereo 85). I used a random DVD player I had laying around. I used my REL Stentor III for the subwoofer. I did not use any center channel speaker. I did not use any outboard processor. (The DVD player had some built-in 5.1 function.)

Even with no center channel and no real processor the audio portion of this set-up was absolutely amazing! I loved hearing movie dialogue from the electrostatic speakers!

So it is a bit difficult to now buy new, small, narrow, conventional floor-standing speakers from B&W or T+A when I have these MLs collecting dust -- especially when I know how amazing the MLs sounded in my HT experiment!"
________

You don't want to mix stats with direct radiating speakers for a high performance home theater sound system. And a dedicated center channel speaker...you definitely want. ...And two subwoofers too; the bass has to be well blended/balanced in your room for music and movie heavens.

Ron, what kind of setup are you envisaging? ...5.1, 7.1, 7.1.2, 7.1.4?
Do you have a certain budget? Do you want a 4K front projector? Do you like 3D movies? Have you heard of Dolby Atmos (and DTS:X)?
You mentioned 15 feet from the screen, how many feet behind the main viewing area?
Is this also your main music listening room?

Lol, I'm starting to get serious. :b ...And why not; music and movies are serious fun.

 

[JackD201]

This week we met with Brian of Ahead Stereo and Sunil of Sunny Components. I have known Sunil for several years.

We realize that the current dimensions are too small for the set-up we want. So we will push the viewing position into the audio equipment area of that room. This will allow a home theater room width of 10 feet, a 3 foot deep area on the left side under a staircase for equipment, and a seat-to-screen distance of about 15 feet. The ceiling height is a bit over 7 feet.

It was a bit frustrating that both Brian and Sunil strongly advised us not to use in any way my pair of MartinLogan Prodigys or my pair of MartinLogan Ascents. Even the Ascents (13" wide) might be too wide to stand to the left and to the right of the screen, but I don't see why we cannot use one of those pairs as rear channel speakers.

Brian recommends a Marantz processor and separate amplifier. Sunil recommends an Arcam receiver. I use Arcam integrated amplifiers for two small systems.

I always liked the sound of Arcams for being a bit softer-sounding than typical electronics in that price range. And the new Arcam AVRs have some Dirac DSP whick Kedar would like.

(I think Arcam used to make a well-regarded, standalone home theater processor. Where did that go? Why are they making only receivers now for home theaters?)

Several years ago I experimented with setting up in this space a home theater-type system just with components I had on hand. I aimed an old Sony LCD projector at a portable Da-lite screen. I used the Prodigys for the front channels (powered by the big VTLs) and the Ascents for the rear channels (powered by a VTL Stereo 85). I used a random DVD player I had laying around. I used my REL Stentor III for the subwoofer. I did not use any center channel speaker. I did not use any outboard processor. (The DVD player had some built-in 5.1 function.)

Even with no center channel and no real processor the audio portion of this set-up was absolutely amazing! I loved hearing movie dialogue from the electrostatic speakers!

So it is a bit difficult to now buy new, small, narrow, conventional floor-standing speakers from B&W or T+A when I have these MLs collecting dust -- especially when I know how amazing the MLs sounded in my HT experiment!

Hi Ron can you share pics taken from the rear wall of both options? I can't quite imagine option 2 with the room being 10' wide and sitting a free throw away. It would be like being in a submarine in my mind. Personally, I would prefer a more intimate viewing area, like option 1 where the proportions of the room would allow for a wider field of vision. In the case of the smaller room, I can see you and Tinka happy with a 5.2 or 6.2 system low speakers meant to be placed close to the walls, like 3 pairs of VR-22s or The Clues' and a pair of Rythmiks with a robust HT pre/pro mch amp combo and you get a lot of sound, reclaim a whole lot of expensive real estate and get to have the biggest screen practicable since the front array can be below the screen. Now for a curveball, you could also go all active with say Meyer Sound HD-1s and a Pre/Pro, add subs and you're off to the races too.

I can't help but envision the human "flow" within the room. The reclaimed real estate will allow for more comfortable, seating and lounging which always helps given how movies have been going past 2 hours with greater and greater regularity it seems. Light a candle, pour the bubblies, put your feet up and hit play.

 

[Folsom]

Yes, it's not a large room. Using Synergy horns removes nearly all reflections, where was any typical speaker will not. Plus as you're saying Jack, only a few are meant to be close to a wall (let alone partially in). What are the options for having the electronics in a "closet" type space or something, to save room for the humans? At a guy's place recently he showed me how you could access his rack system from another room, behind it; that was cool.

But the screen size can be plenty big. And there's plenty of room for at least 4 large comfortable movie style recliners/2 love seat recliners.

 

[Mark Seaton]

Now that my wife and I are home I am turning to my listening room and equipment room projects and she is turning to her home theater room project. (The home theater will be enclosed in half of the equipment room which is adjacent to the listening room.)

The home theater room is about 13' long and 11' wide. We are looking to do a basic front projection/fixed screen installation. We want to engage a home theater dealer/consultant to figure out the proper projector and lens throw ratio and screen size for the desired aspect ratio, and to suggest speakers which would make sense for the limited space available.

Have you worked in Southern California with any particular home theater dealer or consultant you have liked for a modest installation and whom you recommend?

Thank you!

My gosh... a home theater discussion on What's Best?!?

This should be a fun evolution to follow as aren't trying to meet both stereo/2 channel desires and a movie watching experience in the same space. Seeing your later comments about making the room longer, could you clarify the dimensions/shape of the space and where the seats will be? The mention of a 15' viewing distance has me wondering if the seating area will be up against the wall?

I don't see any reason you couldn't get things started with your old ML's if you like, especially since the seating area can't be terribly large in the described room. My only caution would be to plan on treating the room much more significantly than you might feel comfortable with for a 2 channel use. The reason boils down to dialog intelligibility. The same qualities that tend to make for a huge, larger-than-life soundstage, are the enemy of clear dialog and comfortable listening to the sounds common in a movie soundtrack. Thick treatments on the front and rear surfaces can help keep such a small space comfortable short of getting a more comprehensive design from someone like Nyal Mellor.

I would be a little concerned about fitting the Ascent's in the rear speaker locations but if you have additional depth as suggested in a later post, you could use your Prodigy's as L/R and set one Ascent behind an acoustically transparent screen, possibly even covering the entire front wall around the screen with a fabric wall. Now you only need to add surround speakers and some subwoofers, and you could even experiment with Atmos in the room.

Some food for thought.

 

[Mark Seaton]

Arcam doesn't have a new multichannel pre/pro. ...Like with Dolby Atmos and DTS:X and Dirac Live. ...Perhaps in a near future, I don't know.
The AVR850, AVR550 and AVR390 are their FMJ line of high-end AV receivers. ...The limousine being the 850.

While Arcam doesn't have a prepro available, AudioControl has related units developed from the same platform and they offer a very impressive looking surround processor which includes Dirac with 7.1.4 capabilities. I got a look at the unit at CEDIA a few weeks back and others who have played with the unit have been impressed. Not a budget piece, but also not in Datasat or Trinnov territory. AudioControl Maestro M9.

 

[Ron Resnick]

Thank you, Jack and Mark!

 

[NorthStar]

While Arcam doesn't have a prepro available, AudioControl has related units developed from the same platform and they offer a very impressive looking surround processor which includes Dirac with 7.1.4 capabilities. I got a look at the unit at CEDIA a few weeks back and others who have played with the unit have been impressed. Not a budget piece, but also not in Datasat or Trinnov territory. AudioControl Maestro M9.

MSRP = $8,900 (AudioControl Maestro M9 multichannel pre/pro with Dirac Live for all 7.1.4 channels...with the latest firmware update)

"The Maestro M9 Surround Processor retails for $8900 and features full support for Dolby Atmos (11 channels) along with 7 HDMI 2.0a (18 Gbps) inputs and 3 outputs. The processor features Burr Brown DACs, full IP control and full Dirac Live room correction."
______

One comment from an audio/video tester on the Maestro M9:
? "After seeing the limitation of either RS232 or IP, not both, and the IOS app not working, I did not go further with the M9, and returned it."
______

I mentioned Anthem before (with Arc) having a new multi-chan. pre/pro and very affordable...AVM 60 ($2,999 MSRP).
Yamaha also has one, and very affordable...CX-A5100 ($2,500 MSRP).
And Marantz too...the AV7702MKII and eventually the AV7703 ($2,199 MSRP).

We are talking three to four times less money than the AudioControl Mastreo M9 pre/pro here. Sure, they don't sport Dirac Live for twelve channels.
But you can add Dirac Live for eight channels from a separate black box and for $999...the miniDSP DDRC-88A.

The Marantz sports AKM DACs, the Yamaha...ESS DACs, and the Anthem also with AKM DACs. The AudioControl Maestro M9...Burr-Brown DACs.