Horns with SS amp instead of Tube (se)!?

byrdparis

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Nov 24, 2015
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#1
So it’s been a few weeks with my new hORNS Universum mk4 and I was playing them with a few tubes amp - SE, PP etc.
My own set is a PP tube amp and I don’t miss a thing, actually it’s a very good combo I’ve got, to be honest.

I ordered a parallel SE 211 based amps for the kick of it, to go along my PP kt120 amp.. hope I did the right choice... (I was curious how it will sound and nowhere to be found for audition so I pull the plug on one) but anyway, I was thinking along my growing CH Precision set up to get the A1.5 also, but was wondered what you guys think about high end SS amp coupled with a 100db horn speakers.. anyone heard something like that or give it a try at his own home/set up? I always read and heard horns with tubes... (except inky AVANGARD with they own amp I didn’t care for much)

thanks!
 

bonzo75

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Feb 26, 2014
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#2
You should try first watt type or Berning quadrature or just biamping with low watt SETs and a higher watt SS or class D to the bass
 
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wil

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Jul 22, 2015
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#4
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spiritofmusic

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Jun 13, 2013
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#5
+1 on Bakoon. Cessaro Liszts horns on Bakoon some years back still rates in my top 3 demo experiences.
 
Feb 15, 2019
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#6
Vincent of TotalDac now makes/uses a fairly high powered SS amplifier with his horn speakers. I haven't had a chance to listen to it though, I was hoping to visit him in March/April but the lockdown in France interfered. I think there are a few users on WBF who can comment on it though.

David Whistance
 

ddk

Industry Expert
May 19, 2013
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#8
I don't have any experience with your speakers but over the past 25 years I tried SS amplifiers on many horns and the results were pretty horrible except one, JBL.

david
 
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wil

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Jul 22, 2015
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#9
I was told many times that SET was the only way to go with Avantgarde Horns. I went through MasterSound 845's, Lampizator GM 70's, Luxman 300b, LTA MZ3... and it wasn't until put in the Bakoon 13r did I hear the right balance of body, resolution, imaging, and flow -- and with none of hassles of tube amp space heaters.

The valve amps definitely deliver more weight and bass bloom but for me they sound exagerrated next to the Bakoon. I've heard the low powered Pass and Sits are a good choice also.
 
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CKKeung

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Jun 18, 2011
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#10
Vincent of TotalDac now makes/uses a fairly high powered SS amplifier with his horn speakers. I haven't had a chance to listen to it though, I was hoping to visit him in March/April but the lockdown in France interfered. I think there are a few users on WBF who can comment on it though.
David Whistance
Agree!
Other than First Watt SIT3 bi-amping, both Totaldac and Lampizator designed their hybrid poweramps with horns in their mind.

http://www.totaldac.com/amp-1-en.htm

https://www.lampizatorpoland.com/metamorphosis-hybrid-mono
 

ddk

Industry Expert
May 19, 2013
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#11
I was told many times that SET was the only way to go with Avantgarde Horns. I went through MasterSound 845's, Lampizator GM 70's, Luxman 300b, LTA MZ3... and it wasn't until put in the Bakoon 13r did I hear the right balance of body, resolution, imaging, and flow -- and with none of hassles of tube amp space heaters.

The valve amps definitely deliver more weight and bass bloom but for me they sound exagerrated next to the Bakoon. I've heard the low powered Pass and Sits are a good choice also.
Don't know which AV's you have but the Trios aren't efficient enough for a low powered SET and I don't think they're very easy load either. The other issue is their active bass, it wont blend with tube amps probably why you prefer the overall balance with your Bakoon amp.

david
 
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marslo

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May 2, 2014
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Poland
#12
I was told many times that SET was the only way to go with Avantgarde Horns. I went through MasterSound 845's, Lampizator GM 70's, Luxman 300b, LTA MZ3... and it wasn't until put in the Bakoon 13r did I hear the right balance of body, resolution, imaging, and flow -- and with none of hassles of tube amp space heaters.

The valve amps definitely deliver more weight and bass bloom but for me they sound exagerrated next to the Bakoon. I've heard the low powered Pass and Sits are a good choice also.
I tried several SS integrated amps with AG, for me the best options were Vitus SIA 025 and ASR Emitter II battery pack. And Avantgarde XE power plus pre.
On my short list I have Devialet to listen to.
Did not try Bakoon though.
 

morricab

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Apr 25, 2014
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#13
I tried several SS integrated amps with AG, for me the best options were Vitus SIA 025 and ASR Emitter II battery pack. And Avantgarde XE power plus pre.
On my short list I have Devialet to listen to.
Did not try Bakoon though.
We tried Devialet on my Odeons and it was rather painfully obvious the flaws in three dimensional image and lack of bass weight (overdamped for this kind of design).

I would look at the Reimyo KAP-777 as one of the few SS options that could work well on a horn.
 

byrdparis

Well-Known Member
Nov 24, 2015
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#14
Thank you all...
It’s truly an enigma what will work for different ears, room and cross overs :)
I could try several amps (non of which you offered In This thread though) and get a feeling v.s tubes...
no one tried with CH I gathered...!?
 
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asiufy

Industry Expert/VIP Donor
Jul 8, 2011
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#15
I tried several SS integrated amps with AG, for me the best options were Vitus SIA 025 and ASR Emitter II battery pack. And Avantgarde XE power plus pre.
On my short list I have Devialet to listen to.
Did not try Bakoon though.
I wouldn't even try Devialet on horns... Clearly not ideal... Do try the darTZeel, the 108 specially. I tried the LHC-208 integrated on my old Duos, and it was great.
 
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byrdparis

Well-Known Member
Nov 24, 2015
292
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Israel
#17
I also get stunning results with my 95db efficient Speakers powered by a nagra classic amp. The Nagra plays in Pure Class A until 5 watts or so.
thanks, i think 95db and 100db although it seems close, are a bit different(?). also with my long years' experience, and a short while with my hORNS. it seems that all my initial thoughts and assumptions, for what will work goes to "sh!@#"...

i was almost sure that my own PP 120W tube amp will be over gain, and not so suitable to my "new" horns... and now it's seems that they play superbly even against some SE sets and amps i brought in for audition.


i remember that Gian says he had Kondo and others.. Now he got a full CHP system with very efficient speakers. ?
 

byrdparis

Well-Known Member
Nov 24, 2015
292
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Israel
#18
I don't have any experience with your speakers but over the past 25 years I tried SS amplifiers on many horns and the results were pretty horrible except one, JBL.

david
Hello david and thanks

I was waiting for your inputs about it.

Can you elaborate about what was so horrible with SS and horns in your book?

I know also you play with full horns system and bi Amping them?!
 

bonzo75

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Feb 26, 2014
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#19
Efficiency and horns can sometimes be confused. Some horn drivers require more drive than others to get them moving. The top two drivers of Universum work brilliantly on teeny watts. The bass requires some shove. The question is will SS reduce the SQ of the midrange and the highs of your speaker. If yes, then biamping should be the next try

In some like Altec, SS drivers will overdamp the bass and make it sound choked and rolled off, but that will not happen with uni.
 
Oct 14, 2018
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#20
Back on June 2019, I had the chance to listen to Avantgarde Uno XD paired with a Gryphon Diablo 300 integrated.
the sound was horrible and torture for the ears.
 
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