Horns with SS amp instead of Tube (se)!?

[Solypsa]

... Having to add more subs to a system that already has 2 massive subs seems unattractive!

There isn't much to say about subs being attractive , however for a dba system you can get away with fairly small sub enclosures. This is because high power amps and high-xmax low-fs drivers are common these days. They are not taking the place of your main woofers rather they are helping in modifying room response.

 

[ACHiPo]

There isn't much to say about subs being attractive , however for a dba system you can get away with fairly small sub enclosures. This is because high power amps and high-xmax low-fs drivers are common these days. They are not taking the place of your main woofers rather they are helping in modifying room response.

Yep. Between subs and bass traps, frequency reproduction below 60Hz takes up a whole lot of real estate in my relatively small listening room!

 

[Chrispb1]

Congratulations,
Duo Mezzo XD is one of the very finest of speakers that I have heard. You should consider installing REW-software (free/donation) and getting a UMIK-1/UMIK-2 (~100-200€) measurement microphone to be able to get full benefit of the DSP function of the speakers. Just to identify where to biggest issues in low frequency range are located if any.
I recently purchased a second hand Burmeister 051 integrated amplifier and quite frankly I'm awed how nice it sounds with my Duo XD's and by nice I mean really nice. Considering the price I paid, it's almost ridiculous. Just goes to show that with great speakers if the amplifier compliments the speaker requirements, no matter the price, the end result is very satisfying.

Hi, Thanks. Yes, I’ve got the mic along with the MiniDSP/Dirac and I’m pleased with the results. However, I do indeed intend to use REW and apply its results to the AG’s onboard DSP, then hopefully dispose of the MiniDSP assuming all above the bass frequencies are pleasing without it. Though it would be interesting to run the Dirac after the REW changes.

 

[Atmasphere]

I find there's a peak low down then a bit of a trough that I'm sure could be resolved by the XD software.

That trough is likely the sort of thing I'm talking about. You may be surprised at how much amplifier power is needed to correct it- in that the amps might actually clip and yet the trough is still there.

A couple of subs placed elsewhere (asymmetrically) in the room and operating below 80Hz will likely take care of this problem, as well as the peak. The Swarm subs from Audiokinesis are designed to be placed as close to the wall as possible so as to be inside the room boundary effect (which imparts a +3/octave boost as you go down from 100Hz). This allows the subs to be smaller and as out of the way as possible. Regular subs might have a bit of boom placed against the wall like that. Once the standing waves are broken up your room correction will be much more effective, although you may find that there is no longer any need for it.

 

[Chrispb1]

Standing waves are a common reason why the bass isn't right. You can use room correction if there is reinforcement at a particular frequency but if you have cancellation you won't be able to fix it. The room correction will ask the amp to make more power at that frequency but if its being cancelled you could have a 1000 watts or more and not be able to fix it.

A more elegant approach is to creat a Distributed Bass Array by adding a couple of subs asymetrically placed in the room to break up the standing waves. As long as the additional subs do not have any output above 80Hz or so they will not attract attention to themselves.

That’s good informationl. I’ve got an SVS ultra 16SB that I use for cinema and wire that in but I like it’s between the speakers (centre) so unsure of outcome

 

[Jono]

I just heard my Bakoon AMP 5521 mk3 with Avantgarde Duo Omega speakers and the sound was sublime.
What the Bakoon brings is wonderfully detailed and sophisticated treble and very precise ,rhythmical and textured bass.If you read reviews of Bakoon amplifiers this sophisticated and detailed treble is discussed.Even the wonderful word tintinnabulation is used.
Soundstage size and depth and precise placement within that soundstage was also quite astonishing.
Also there was a very relaxed,composed and unforced presentation .The kind of presentation you would normally associate with a really good SET rather than SS.As an owner of big Tannoys I am used to that sort of presentation but was surprised to hear it from a big dynamic horn like that.

 

[dleed]

Wondering why no one has suggested the Pass XA25. 25w class A, doubles down to 2 ohm. Very accurate and pleasing sounding to me. Just real natural. The price is reasonable.

 

[Hear Here]

Wondering why no one has suggested the Pass XA25. 25w class A, doubles down to 2 ohm. Very accurate and pleasing sounding to me. Just real natural. The price is reasonable.

I bought an Accuphase A-36 a while back that has very similar spec to the XA25 - Class A, low power, happy with 2 ohm loads, etc. The Accupgase was one of a dozen SS amps I was home trialing with my Duo XD speakers, after I decided to move from SETs if I could get SS sounding at least as pleasing as the tube amps.

Although the A-36 was the best of the Class A amps I tried, in the end I found it a little soft at times when the music called for a more robust sound. I would think the XA25 may have a similar sound presentation, but I've never compared the 2.

The best of the amps I tried with the AGs were the GamuT D200 Mk III (now discontinued and presenting an unacceptable thump on power-up and power-down) and the NAD M33. The Mark Levinson 5805 was good but lacked so much that was included with the NAD that it seemed over-priced with no benefit, apart from the ML brand name! I rejected the Bakoon 13r because it got so hot, it was envirnmentally unacceptable (for me) and the disappointing Valvet e2se that I had greater expectations for than it delivered.

Very happy with the modestly priced NAD M33 despite it being far too "cheap" for my AG speakers with its 1:8 price ratio. Could I improve on the M33? Yes, but it'd cost around £15K to do so I suspect. Peter

 

[Bergm@nn]

Wondering why no one has suggested the Pass XA25. 25w class A, doubles down to 2 ohm. Very accurate and pleasing sounding to me. Just real natural. The price is reasonable.

Until recently I had a Pass XA30.8 power amp running with Duo XDs and it was very nice indeed. However the addition of a Dartzeel preamp meant that the total gain in front of the speakers produced too much hiss.

The Pass was regrettably sacrificed and replaced with a pair of very nice SIT amps will little to no gain - perfect.

 

[Dasmania]

Well this thread has prompted some experimentation on my part. I am driving my hORNS Symphony 13 with a full blown CH precision chain L1,P1,C1.2, X1 , M1.2 - SUBLIME. all the virtues of horn dynamics, tone, transparency, dynamics, emotion, tone, etc. Who knew? Enjoy! The M1.2 is set at zero negative feedback

 

[rooze]

About a decade ago I was running a pair of stacked (2 horns per side, rated around 106dB) Oris150 horns with custom bass cabs. I rolled through about a half dozen low-powered amps including 2A3, 45, 300b, etc. All good amps from reputable manufacturers. It wasn't until I switched to a 200w Lyngdorf TDAi2200 that those speakers actually started to sound good, actually very good. I had the TDAi2200 on the horns, digitally linked to a TACT power amp driving the bass cabs, and it sounded great. Don't be afraid to experiment with SS amps, they'll need to be dead quiet though, as the Lyngdorf unit was/is.
More recently I've used a Lyngdorf TDAi 2170 on Altec Valencias and VOTT A7s, and it has worked very well, particularly using its crossover function and of course the room-perfect software.

 

[Atmasphere]

^^ My experience with horns is similar- they seem to really benefit from a bit more power. The result is cleaner and more musical.

 

[Wavetouch]

I, Wavetouch audio, mod/sell SCL (Bakoon Japan) AMP-5521 mk4 ($9,000). It sounds good with good horn speakers. Here's 5521's sound.

Alex/Wavetouch

 

[Low325]

I, too, like the performance of SS with my horn speakers. Granted they are not ultra efficient (94db 1w/1m) but as sort of mentioned my Bakoon AMP 51R (probably other Bakoons too) is sublime with them.

I might have a couple 300bs amps coming but that’s way far out. And primarily getting them for low level listening in the dark so I ‘need’ the glow to tell me it sounds good ;-)

 

[Thieliste]

Next winter I plan to visit my Odeon distributor with my Vitus SIA-025 and audition both Semper and Carnegie with my amp.
Should be interesting.