Introducing Olympus & Olympus I/O - A new perspective on modern music playback

For those who just started reading up on Olympus, Olympus I/O, and XDMI, please note that all information in this thread has been summarized in a single PDF document that can be downloaded from the Taiko Website.

https://taikoaudio.com/taiko-2020/taiko-audio-downloads

The document is frequently updated.

Scroll down to the 'XDMI, Olympus Music Server, Olympus I/O' section and click 'XDMI, Olympus, Olympus I/O Product Introduction & FAQ' to download the latest version.

Good morning WBF!​

We are introducing the culmination of close to 4 years of research and development. As a bona fide IT/tech nerd with a passion for music, I have always been intrigued by the potential of leveraging the most modern of technologies in order to create a better music playback experience. This, amongst others, led to the creation of our popular, perhaps even revolutionary, Extreme music server 5 years ago, which we have been steadily improving and updating with new technologies throughout its life cycle. Today I feel we can safely claim it's holding its ground against the onslaught of new server releases from other companies, and we are committed to keep improving it for years to come.

We are introducing a new server model called the Olympus. Hierarchically, it positions itself above the Extreme. It does provide quite a different music experience than the Extreme, or any other server I've heard, for that matter. Conventional audiophile descriptions such as sound staging, dynamics, color palette, etc, fall short to describe this difference. It does not sound digital or analog, I would be inclined to describe it as coming closer to the intended (or unintended) performance of the recording engineer.

Committed to keeping the Extreme as current as possible, we are introducing a second product called the Olympus I/O. This is an external upgrade to the Extreme containing a significant part of the Olympus technology, allowing it to come near, though not entirely at, Olympus performance levels. The Olympus I/O can even be added to the Olympus itself to elevate its performance even further, though not as dramatic an uplift as adding it to the Extreme. Consider it the proverbial "cherry on top".

 

...my Microsoft Word docs have never sounded better on this fully-optimized network.

 

Ah, but what if you fed your Microsoft Word document to a text-to-speech converter. Would it sound better?

 

Done and discarded, nothing works as expected in an environment where even nV or fA increases in noise are very audible.

Emile, my bad. Sorry I used the wrong word "daisy-chain" (b/c I had no tech knowledge). My "translation" went wayward. The two guys PARALLELLED chips (in their case the vintage Philips R2R chip). The paralleling of chips vastly reduced noise (SERIAL wiring, or daisy-chaining, would greatly increase noise). I talked to the guy who paralleled 8 chips. He said that such paralleling would work only with chips that use current, not voltage. Hope you experimented with the proper paralleling way (that also requires proper power regulation). If you did serial wiring, could you experiment again? I'll discuss with the other, more advanced, guy who currently paralleled 36 chips (and will eventually do 48 chips or so based on his computation). One reported "night-and-day" improvement; the other very significant improvement. Understand that their way of paralleling so many chips would be commercially unviable; they did to their own self-made carbon-battery-powered DACs for themselves. They would not have kept paralleling unless they heard huge improvement. Thanks anyway for your open-mindedness.

 

This is in essence how the Aries Cerat DACs are designed by paralleling 16 R2R ICs (the Analogue Devices AD1865N-K). It’s a hugely heavy DAC, weighs as much as the Olympus (130 pounds).

Kassandra II Reference Product Page – Aries Cerat

It boggles my mind the lengths to which high end audio designers are going in the world of digital.

 

This is in essence how the Aries Cerat DACs are designed by paralleling 16 R2R ICs (the Analogue Devices AD1865N-K). It’s a hugely heavy DAC, weighs as much as the Olympus (130 pounds).

Kassandra II Reference Product Page – Aries Cerat

It boggles my mind the lengths to which high end audio designers are going in the world of digital.

My Modwright modified Sony SCD-777ES player back in 2004 or so had several paralleled and stacked DAC chips. Definitely not a new thing

 

Yes, in fact it goes back far earlier. Check out this 35-year old review of Sony’s top transport and DAC that used stacked DACs by the founder of Stereophile, J. Gordon Holt.

Sony CDP-R1/DAS-R1 CD player

Two of the most cherished terms in the lexicon of high end are "no holds barred" and "cost no object." These are usually applied, together, to the most expensive version of something currently on the market. But is either term really appropriate for an audio product? The answer is a flat...

www.stereophile.com

I think Accuphase and Esoteric have long used stacked DACs as well.

 

Ok, here’s a question for Olympus owners: is it possible to use the Olympus as a Roon server with local file storage? In essence that’s what the Extreme was designed to be. Or is the Olympus to be viewed as a battery-powered Roon endpoint? Does making it a server impose too many demands on the battery charging system that compromise its sonic performance?

 

Of course it can be used with local file storage. It comes stock with 3 TB’s. Having said that we Taiko munchkins have always sought out the best sound quality and Taiko gives the option of ordering it without local file storage as Emile in his due diligence found that local library might not sound as good as files coming from an NAS.

You asked me the same question a few days ago. Answer hasn’t changed AFAIK

If you read this very long thread from its start you will glean from it all of Emile’s recommendations based on his incessant due diligence

There are many users here who ordered theirs with a large storage capacity

 

Right, that’s who I was hoping to hear from. But I hear you loud and clear. Store media files elsewhere is the recommended route, meaning a NAS or another Roon server.

 

I first ordered mine with 12 TB and as things got closer to taking orders Emile continued to tweak and fine tune the Olympus. It seemed with members’ suggestions he had time to do the testing in house and one of those debates was local files as good as NAS. Personally I was surprised by his finding but IME he’s always been correct and he did give a percent as to how much benefit one could squeeze out. It was not a lot IIRC but we are fanatics here as all of us chase the best SQ. I opted to leave out storage and transferred my Extrene library to an NAS which was initially in my downstairs bedroom hard wired into my home router which is easily 100 feet from my Sind room upstairs. I can say in all honesty the SQ was indistinguishable to my ears from local storage. I kept it downstairs until my wife asked me politely to move it back to the sound room where it is now. It is powered by the Taiko DCD via a DC cable into the NAS. The DCD, Taiko router and Taiko switch are powered via an Uptone Audio JS-2. In both places there was no difference in SQ. My guess is those who have internal storage with their Olympus are eternally happy as I’m betting not many of us could pick out the difference in a blind test. As I said the uptick was but a few percentage points different

 

Or is the Olympus to be viewed as a battery-powered Roon endpoint?

Hi @godofwealth ,

Neither the Olympus nor the Extreme are Roon Endpoints, strictly speaking.

They are indeed servers.

To be more precise, both the Roon Core and the Roon Endpoint are located on the same machine.

This is the structure chosen by @Taiko Audio , which allows for the performance you know.


Currently, you can store your music on:

• The Olympus Server
  or
• A NAS connected to your network

One of the standout features of the Olympus, and not a minor one, is its ability to run Roon (which is very resource-intensive) without impacting sound quality.

I am not aware of any other server/streamer capable of achieving this feat.

It’s fair to say that the Olympus is probably the best Roon server currently available on the market.

This is precisely why I ordered the Olympus + Olympus I/O XDMI combo as soon as Emile announced it.


As @steve williams mentioned, the information regarding the Olympus is gathered and organised in the user manual and FAQ available here:

Taiko Audio Downloads – Taiko Audio

taikoaudio.com

Hope this helps and clarifies things a bit.

Cheers,

Thomas

 

Emile, my bad. Sorry I used the wrong word "daisy-chain" (b/c I had no tech knowledge). My "translation" went wayward. The two guys PARALLELLED chips (in their case the vintage Philips R2R chip). The paralleling of chips vastly reduced noise (SERIAL wiring, or daisy-chaining, would greatly increase noise). I talked to the guy who paralleled 8 chips. He said that such paralleling would work only with chips that use current, not voltage. Hope you experimented with the proper paralleling way (that also requires proper power regulation). If you did serial wiring, could you experiment again? I'll discuss with the other, more advanced, guy who currently paralleled 36 chips (and will eventually do 48 chips or so based on his computation). One reported "night-and-day" improvement; the other very significant improvement. Understand that their way of paralleling so many chips would be commercially unviable; they did to their own self-made carbon-battery-powered DACs for themselves. They would not have kept paralleling unless they heard huge improvement. Thanks anyway for your open-mindedness.

No worries, I assumed you meant paralleled.

In the Olympus/XDMI environment we appear to have to reinvent everything. Every single component matters, significantly.

Can I get out of delving into the benefits vs drawbacks of paralleling DACs by just going with the following? :

In the “V2” (RCA) analogue stage we’ve so far reduced the component count from 100 to 70 while adding a second DAC chip turns that 70 into 108. The 70 components version sounds better then the 108 components version.

 

No worries, I assumed you meant paralleled.

In the Olympus/XDMI environment we appear to have to reinvent everything. Every single component matters, significantly.

Can I get out of delving into the benefits vs drawbacks of paralleling DACs by just going with the following? :

In the “V2” (RCA) analogue stage we’ve so far reduced the component count from 100 to 70 while adding a second DAC chip turns that 70 into 108. The 70 components version sounds better then the 108 components version.

Emile
Can you tell us of those parts removed, how many were dedicated to the connections between v1 and daughter board?
If not, can you comment on the effect of removing those connections on the overall sound in v2?
Marc

 

Emile
Can you tell us of those parts removed, how many were dedicated to the connections between v1 and daughter board?
If not, can you comment on the effect of removing those connections on the overall sound in v2?
Marc

I think not one part is removed which was dedicated to the connections between v1 and daughter board.
Btw the connection is very well chosen and has an extremely low resistance and has a good reason to be there.

I think what Emile is saying that with our (Taiko) approach it is to use as less components as possible. (With more parallel dacs/chips you need more parts.) And every part/component is audible.

The Olympus/XDMI is developed to shortcut the most possible, to bypass all kind of conversions to 'normal standards'. With as a result a very clean environment. Even more helped with everything battery powered. In this ultra clean environment you can hear every component what is used.

 

I think not one part is removed which was dedicated to the connections between v1 and daughter board.
Btw the connection is very well chosen and has an extremely low resistance and has a good reason to be there.

I think what Emile is saying that with our (Taiko) approach it is to use as less components as possible. (With more parallel dacs/chips you need more parts.) And every part/component is audible.

The Olympus/XDMI is developed to shortcut the most possible, to bypass all kind of conversions to 'normal standards'. With as a result a very clean environment. Even more helped with everything battery powered. In this ultra clean environment you can hear every component what is used.

My take away is you're suggesting the v2 is a daughter board.
If Taiko is trying to remove any and all bottlenecks -
is there a possibility that a dedicated xdmi analog card without well chosen bits (the connection between main board and the daughter board) be better?

 

...I plugged in "Default" based on someone's guidance at the time, and left it alone. That was great at that time.

Having never used Roon before, I had no relationship to the DDC manual guidance re: Roon vs. XDMS and filter selection.

But, I moved the DDC output cable to Alt2, per above. I am not sure how much this workflow has to "burn-in" since it was never used, but I would say initially, this would be a better sonic choice in this system.

Emile, I appreciate you mentioning the filter choices. In this system, the Alt2 option provides a bit more sonic meat. I do not find any loss of detail or speed/pace. But the sound is not so sharp or hygienic in nature.

I should still probably putter around with the speaker toe-in, which is minimal here, to see what's up, but I will let things settle for another week or so. Multiple changes usually end up being confusing to sort out.

It will be interesting to hear about other MSB users and their options and opinions.

Thanks again, Emile. Happy New Year and Happy Listening to all.

Remember that each DCD output requires its own burn in period, so patience on final tweaking.

That being said, I was very surprised how much of a difference the different dcd outputs had to each of the switch and router. Some combos were too much of a good thing, others were relaxed bliss

As I changed the energizing power supply, my preference changed as well. I have a couple new energizing supplies coming through over the next couple months and looking g forward to hearing g the impact (the effect of power on the network side was quite sigbificant…enough the persuade me to order an I/O and bring more BPS’s to the party)

DCD is a chance to do “filter rolling”, so good to have all the outputs burned in before making final decisions, but the character of the different filters is very easy to hear here.

 

One of the standout features of the Olympus, and not a minor one, is its ability to run Roon (which is very resource-intensive) without impacting sound quality.

I am not aware of any other server/streamer capable of achieving this feat.

I have certainly gotten the impression that the Wadax Server/DAC combination has also achieved this feat a few years back now. It does seem to be a feat, and I'm glad that Taiko has done so, as the Roon UI is pretty desirable. I'm looking forward to experiencing this myself, hopefully soon.

 

My take away is you're suggesting the v2 is a daughter board.

Yes.

If Taiko is trying to remove any and all bottlenecks -
is there a possibility that a dedicated xdmi analog card without well chosen bits (the connection between main board and the daughter board) be better?

Nah.

 

...I plugged in "Default" based on someone's guidance at the time, and left it alone. That was great at that time.

Having never used Roon before, I had no relationship to the DDC manual guidance re: Roon vs. XDMS and filter selection.

But, I moved the DDC output cable to Alt2, per above. I am not sure how much this workflow has to "burn-in" since it was never used, but I would say initially, this would be a better sonic choice in this system.

Emile, I appreciate you mentioning the filter choices. In this system, the Alt2 option provides a bit more sonic meat. I do not find any loss of detail or speed/pace. But the sound is not so sharp or hygienic in nature.

I should still probably putter around with the speaker toe-in, which is minimal here, to see what's up, but I will let things settle for another week or so. Multiple changes usually end up being confusing to sort out.

It will be interesting to hear about other MSB users and their options and opinions.

Thanks again, Emile. Happy New Year and Happy Listening to all.

Yes it’s more than likely revisiting your loudspeaker positioning will be rewarding.

 

Remember that each DCD output requires its own burn in period, so patience on final tweaking.

That being said, I was very surprised how much of a difference the different dcd outputs had to each of the switch and router. Some combos were too much of a good thing, others were relaxed bliss

As I changed the energizing power supply, my preference changed as well. I have a couple new energizing supplies coming through over the next couple months and looking g forward to hearing g the impact (the effect of power on the network side was quite sigbificant…enough the persuade me to order an I/O and bring more BPS’s to the party)

DCD is a chance to do “filter rolling”, so good to have all the outputs burned in before making final decisions, but the character of the different filters is very easy to hear here.

I find this illuminating especially the DCD aspect. I don't have the Olympus yet so I wouldn't want to wrap my ears and brain around anything more until the O arrives...