Jadis JA-200 Mk. II Amplifiers

[microstrip]

Micro, i was not specifically discussing you in my post, but as they say...” if the shoe fits”; lol.
Listening to an amp that was manufactured 10 years ago is getting exactly to my point!
Please go out and listen to the new Mk2 if you get an opportunity, and then get back to us...

You misunderstood my point - my interest was in knowing what were the real objective known differences between the Jadis I listened and yours. I will not probably listen to the Jadis in a Guarneri's with a system similar to yours, so my opinion will not be relevant to you.
There is a lot of discussion on the design and operation of the JA80 and its really miserable measurements - even in this forum - this motivated my interest, as well as the good opinion I have on the brand.

I am always happy to give details and facts, I really dislike audio gossip!

 

[analog brother]

anybody ever consider CAT?
or robert koda k-70?
now i understand that ron doesn't want to use ss.

 

[BruceD]

anybody ever consider CAT?
or robert koda k-70?
now i understand that ron doesn't want to use ss.

Good choices--

CAT--Someone mentioned previous dark sounding-- Agree--but power to burn for its size

Robert Koda--Hybrid--so Ron may have ruled it out--70W?--hmmm possible bit lean for the Pendragons--but could be a go?

I've heard the Monos--Wow factor alert!

BruceD

 

[analog brother]

they are a very stout 70w though!
i have heard them as well, and they are definitely not lacking in power.
but yes, they are hybrid, and barely tube at that, so maybe won't meet the criteria.

 

[Tango]

anybody ever consider CAT?
or robert koda k-70?
now i understand that ron doesn't want to use ss.

Robert Koda is very interesting.



Tang

 

[Ron Resnick]

I am reading a lot of smoke, but not seeing much light. May I clarify something?

Is the bottom line that nobody here has compared directly in a familiar system Jadis JA80 Mk. II or JA120 Mk. II or JA200 Mk. II to Ayon Audio Orthos XS or NAT Magma New?

Is there a consensus -- among people who have actually compared these two amplifiers -- that the Jadis JA200 Mk. II is more transparent (e.g., clearer in the midrange) than the VTL MB-750?

 

[bonzo75]

Robert Koda is very interesting.

View attachment 37029

Tang

I heard the 70w Koda amp on Rockport Avior, when I compared the K10 to AR Ref 10. The Koda clearly was the wrong match for the Aviors.

 

[bonzo75]

I am reading a lot of smoke, but not seeing much light. May I clarify something?

Is the bottom line that nobody here has compared directly in a familiar system Jadis JA80 Mk. II or JA120 Mk. II or JA200 Mk. II to Ayon Audio Orthos XS or NAT Magma New?

Is there a consensus -- among people who have actually compared these two amplifiers -- that the Jadis JA200 Mk. II is more transparent (e.g., clearer in the midrange) than the VTL MB-750?

I did say I had the JA 100 and NAT Magma at the same time at home on the Verity. You cannot really make out anything from compare notes. They are different sounds

 

[Zero000]

I am reading a lot of smoke, but not seeing much light. May I clarify something?

Is the bottom line that nobody here has compared directly in a familiar system Jadis JA80 Mk. II or JA120 Mk. II or JA200 Mk. II to Ayon Audio Orthos XS or NAT Magma New?

Is there a consensus -- among people who have actually compared these two amplifiers -- that the Jadis JA200 Mk. II is more transparent (e.g., clearer in the midrange) than the VTL MB-750?

I have heard all the amps you mentioned but the JA120, and the Jadis will all have been Mk 1. Some brief notes on the JA200 here.

TBH I think the only way to find out how good an amp is is to have it driving the set of speakers you own. Matching is all. It's the simple truth and there's no way around it. Amp personalities vary when driving different speakers.

 

[Argonaut]

TBH I think the only way to find out how good an amp is is to have it driving the set of speakers you own. Matching is all. It's the simple truth and there's no way around it. Amp personalities vary when driving different speakers.

I quite agree, and with regard to CLX's btw whilst eliciting virtual conversation regarding potential candidates may be entertaining, and might even translate into some form of shortlist , fundamentally it all still amounts to several pages of diverse recommendation and opinion, which may at worst transform the considered audiophile into a dog chasing the wrong kind of cars!

Specifications and Synergy should always come first, whilst predilection toward a certain Topology, altho a consideration, may prove to be a sonic mute point in the face of a demonstration within ones own room and system.

 

[Audiocrack]

Thank you but you are talking "apples and oranges." The Apogees are much tougher loads than the two meter ribbon in the Pendragons. Imagine if you disconntected the planar magnetic midrange and woofer in a Magnepan speaker and had only the tweeter ribbon to drive.

Historically the Jadis JA200 was considered a super-classy way to drive Infinity IRS V ribbon panels (this is how I heard IRS Vs in the main reference room at Lyric Hi-Fi in 1988).

Audiocrack uses the 40w or 50w Kondo amps (if I remember correctly) on his Genesis 1.1s.

So the two meter ribbon in the Pendragon is easy to drive compared to the multi-way Apogee with big woofer ribbons.

(Put differently, you ain't gett'in me to use solid-state on the Pendragons!)

Actually I play the midrange towers of the Genesis 1.1 loudspeakers with the (nominal) 28-30W Kondo (300B) Gakuoh push pull amps. If I remembert correctly you would have preferred somewhat more power/slam.

 

[microstrip]

(...) TBH I think the only way to find out how good an amp is is to have it driving the set of speakers you own. Matching is all. It's the simple truth and there's no way around it. Amp personalities vary when driving different speakers.

+1!

But we have fun imagining we can guess!

 

[Calle_jr]

Micro, i was not specifically discussing you in my post, but as they say...” if the shoe fits”; lol.
Listening to an amp that was manufactured 10 years ago is getting exactly to my point!
Please go out and listen to the new Mk2 if you get an opportunity, and then get back to us...

I thought it was a discussion regarding reliability
Regarding sonics, there's not much to compete with the Jadis power amps in my opinion.
In any case, your statement is quite far from the spirit of Jadis. Especially regarding JA80.

I realize the OP is not interested in this input, so now I will shut up.

 

[DaveyF]

I thought it was a discussion regarding reliability
Regarding sonics, there's not much to compete with the Jadis power amps in my opinion.
In any case, your statement is quite far from the spirit of Jadis. Especially regarding JA80.

I realize the OP is not interested in this input, so now I will shut up.

Reliability of the new Jadis amps is a little unknown at this time, if for no other reason than they have not been on the market for very long ( however, looking at their build quality, I would be very surprised if they were not reliable now). I’m not seeing your reasoning behind your comment on the JA80? If you are saying that Jadis like to stand on their laurels, I’m not so sure that this is correct. While the JA80 has been a mainstay of theirs since the beginning, I do believe that they have undergone updates throughout the period, albeit mostly undisclosed, but updates nonetheless. The new MK2 line is IMO bringing their products in line ( or surpassing) with the current offerings of their competitors. ( in fact, I believe the new JA30mk2 most likely beats the other amps that are in the same category...and easily....which is why I just acquired one).

 

[Ron Resnick]

anybody ever consider CAT?
. . .

http://www.whatsbestforum.com/showt...II-versus-CAT-JL7-versus-Ayon-Audio-Orthos-XS

 

[microstrip]

Reliability of the new Jadis amps is a little unknown at this time, if for no other reason than they have not been on the market for very long ( however, looking at their build quality, I would be very surprised if they were not reliable now)(...)

The track reliability of of Jadis has two components - breakdowns and serviceability. Breakdowns were mostly due to the use of improper tubes in the amplifiers - Jadis needs properly burn-in and matched tubes, that very few vendors really do. The peak of the horror stories happened during the 90's, when there was a shortage of quality 6550 power tubes and chinese tubes manufactured under very poor conditions and no quality control flooded the market. These tubes were leaky and easily shorted, particularly towards the end of life. Jadis pushes their tubes - something that was not a problem for a NOS General Electric tube - and most of these new tube were inadequate for their amplifiers. Owners of Jadis equipment must be prepared to change tubes frequently - class A asks for cathode current, and tube life is mainly determined by cathode evaporation, that is approximately proportional to charge = time X current!

Serviceability was sometimes an issue due to changes in the distribution and people who did not understand their circuits and needs servicing them. This created a lot of traffic in the net, mostly users reporting and asking for advice.

IMHO reliability of tube equipment is ruled by a simple principle - usually you get what you pay when buying tubes . No one can supply reliable tubes cheap - just think that a good supplier, such as most equipment manufacturer supplied tubes - discards more than half of the tubes they get. Pre-burn-in, measuring, selecting, burning- in, measuring and selecting again takes time and money - but then we are assured that the probability of breakdown is very low.

Just to finish, when in my hands Jadis was always a very reliable brand - I do not remember of having any issue with them.

 

[morricab]

Purely out of curiosity, did you consider the comparable Ayon Audio amplifier to the JA-30?

i compared once the KR VA350i to the Jadis Defy 7 mkIII (with siltech wiring) and they were closer than I would have ever expected. The Jadis was a very good sounding amplifier, rich but not bloated and with good drive. Very musical and one of the better sounding PP tube amps I have heard.

Another very nice sound PP tube amp is older VAC 70/70 (or 140/140) and PHI 70. Also consider the top Canary Audio PP 300B monos (about 80 watts I think).

 

[morricab]

http://www.whatsbestforum.com/showt...II-versus-CAT-JL7-versus-Ayon-Audio-Orthos-XS

CAT JL2 signature is really good. We compared it to the older NAT SE2SE (211 based PSET) and found that it was quite close on a pair of Apogee Grands (being driven passively at that time and without subs) and found that the CAT was very close in quality to the NAT, with the NAT edging it out in coherence top to bottom and a bit of low level resolution...but it was very close...the CAT is one of the other PP tube amps I really like.

 

[bonzo75]

CAT JL2 signature is really good. We compared it to the older NAT SE2SE (211 based PSET) and found that it was quite close on a pair of Apogee Grands (being driven passively at that time and without subs) and found that the CAT was very close in quality to the NAT, with the NAT edging it out in coherence top to bottom and a bit of low level resolution...but it was very close...the CAT is one of the other PP tube amps I really like.

In Joel's review he prefers the Orthos XS to JL2 and JL3 but the JL7 I expect is a big jump up. I expect to soon hear it on a vivid G3 system which I earlier heard with the JL3

 

[microstrip]

i compared once the KR VA350i to the Jadis Defy 7 mkIII (with siltech wiring) and they were closer than I would have ever expected. The Jadis was a very good sounding amplifier, rich but not bloated and with good drive. Very musical and one of the better sounding PP tube amps I have heard.
(...)

And we should remember that Gary Koh once told us that a pair of Defy7, each wired in parallel and used as a monoblock sounded a lot better!