to see more photos, please follow this link My System.
I suggest you to start with 4 or six Wings (4 near the speakers like into my system) and 2 behind your listening point
Krelles system with SMT room treatment!
- Thread starter Krelle
- Start date
to see more photos, please follow this link My System.
I suggest you to start with 4 or six Wings (4 near the speakers like into my system) and 2 behind your listening point
Paolo, sure, I have seen yr room photos, beautiful.
At present I have three GIK 242 absorbers spaced over a 2.5m span on central front wall. This sounds better than bunching them together over 1.8m.
Suggesting that six to eight Wings (they're half as wide as GIKs) could directly substitute.
Six on each side wall to cover the expanse of first and second reflection points.
But a bare minimum of seven Wings, plus corner bass traps could be a good "starter kit" LOL.
At present I have three GIK 242 absorbers spaced over a 2.5m span on central front wall. This sounds better than bunching them together over 1.8m.
Suggesting that six to eight Wings (they're half as wide as GIKs) could directly substitute.
Six on each side wall to cover the expanse of first and second reflection points.
But a bare minimum of seven Wings, plus corner bass traps could be a good "starter kit" LOL.
Behind the Wall Of transparent wings I have a space for the TV. I use the Varitune 6 as a TV -stand. And a little stereo
sorry for delay Marc,
I suggest you to start with 6 Wings:
- 4 Wings in front of you near your loudspeaker (2 side to the speakers, (1 for each speaker), 25 to 30 cm away from the side, to cover the first lateral reflection point- and 2 and 2 behind the speakers (always 25 to 30 cm away from them) ),
- 2 Wings behind your listening point
You can use the absorbers you have for minimize the effects on bass region of your corners.
Flyer has a great experience on SMT panels.
Paolo, I've found that three GIK absorbers centrally on the front wall spread over a 2.5m span, plus GIKs at first and second reflection pts on side walls, makes a noticeable difference. I probably could do a like for like replacement of these w Wings, so seven in total.
I could certainly then add to these progessively in time until law of diminishing returns kicks in
Re behind me, there is 5m clear space to rear wall, so I don't think I need to worry there.
The additional consideration is front corner bass traps. Choose from Daad2s, ASC Tube Traps, SMT Varitune Traps or AVAA active units.
I could certainly then add to these progessively in time until law of diminishing returns kicks in
Re behind me, there is 5m clear space to rear wall, so I don't think I need to worry there.
The additional consideration is front corner bass traps. Choose from Daad2s, ASC Tube Traps, SMT Varitune Traps or AVAA active units.
Jazzhead does similar, but he also puts two small wings on the floor, first reflection points which help a lot. You can easily hear the difference picking them up and putting them down. They are inclined slightly to face the speaker.
At flyers I remember trying with 4 at the back, and taking them off. Soundstage collapsed when taken off. Same at elberoth, where we tried with the side positions you mentioned.
Ked, there's a little bit of that here w the GIKs. When Barry visited after my GIKs had been out of my room for months, he detected some phasiness and vagueness in my sound.
After we introduced the three GIK 242s to my front wall, 0.3m apart, and at side wall reflection pts, there was a definite solidifying of the soundstage and less haziness.
I'm now thinking I can go one better w diffusers, choice ranging from cheaper Thomann De diffuser panels and GIK Gotham quadratics, to pricier RZAcoustics Cz stuff, Acustica Applicata Daads and these SMT Wings.
After we introduced the three GIK 242s to my front wall, 0.3m apart, and at side wall reflection pts, there was a definite solidifying of the soundstage and less haziness.
I'm now thinking I can go one better w diffusers, choice ranging from cheaper Thomann De diffuser panels and GIK Gotham quadratics, to pricier RZAcoustics Cz stuff, Acustica Applicata Daads and these SMT Wings.
Marc,
I started my journey on acoustic treatment with 8 Realtrap absorber panels (for reflection points and corners). Then I discovered the diffuser panels and the difference is substantial ... even with an empirical test you can hear that the absorber panel causes a death of the sound while the diffuser panel keeps it alive eliminating distortions from reflections. However, I still use some Realtraps for the corners.
Everything said above is about what happens in my room, obviously I don't have the perception of how your room could respond. I only know that Wing panels have been one of the most important experiences in the growth of my system
Paolo, I actually have a good, quiet basic sound in my room. Slap echo moderate. Speech v intelligible up here. And my eaves, despite my reservations, have helped, maybe breaking up standing waves. Maybe my protruding steels (0.3m x 3m x 0.1m every 2m, 6 sets in total over the depth of my room) also act as natural "break ups" again aiding SQ.
So, I want to boost things, but keep it subtle. My main reservation of the rooms I see featuring SMT, ASC Tube Traps and Acustica Applicata Daads (and to be fair, GIK to some extent too), is that the listening rooms are plastered flr to clg and along side walls w these expensive panels.
I've seen rooms w 12 SMT Wings on front wall plus 12 Flower Petal panels above, and both side walls fully fitted w SMTs. 50 SMTs before you even talk about clg treatments and corner bass traps.
Ditto Acustica Applicata rooms. The UK dealer advised 20 Daads plus 32 EcoDaads on ceilings plus Volcano Helmholtz Resonator.
It's rare to see this seriousness of treatments not run into dozens of panels and a total cost equivalent to a major component purchase.
So, I want to boost things, but keep it subtle. My main reservation of the rooms I see featuring SMT, ASC Tube Traps and Acustica Applicata Daads (and to be fair, GIK to some extent too), is that the listening rooms are plastered flr to clg and along side walls w these expensive panels.
I've seen rooms w 12 SMT Wings on front wall plus 12 Flower Petal panels above, and both side walls fully fitted w SMTs. 50 SMTs before you even talk about clg treatments and corner bass traps.
Ditto Acustica Applicata rooms. The UK dealer advised 20 Daads plus 32 EcoDaads on ceilings plus Volcano Helmholtz Resonator.
It's rare to see this seriousness of treatments not run into dozens of panels and a total cost equivalent to a major component purchase.
Thanks for your feedback. Interesting. Your comments re: an uneven granite feature wall make sense. In that case I might stick to proven room treatments for the front wall in my future audio room. Cheers.
Hi Marc,
My room definitely corresponds to your description of a full furbished SMT room.
What Calia.. (sorry too complicated a name
) said is correct, with 4 you have a minimum, with 6 you are not looking back, with 8 you wonder how did you ever live without them...Now, as with many things in life: the more you have, the more you want!
As for the cost of a totally equipped SMT room, the equivalent of a very pricey preamp? Yes, but I can assure you the effect cannot be obtained, not even with the most expensive preamp, amp and speakers at the same time!
Now some good news, you can buy SMT panels either in MDF (prices you mention above) but also in hard cardboard. And the latter are only half the price, I think even less. You can spray the cardboard (like Marten did in its room in Munich where they had 210 cms high wings) in a certain non-obtrusive color or you hide them between a painted or printed acoustic transparent cloth like Jeroen did after i recommended him to take away all his absorbers he had on his side wall making his room sound very dead with all the drawbacks that entailed. The Wilson and Magico rooms all have these nice cloths as well in Munich since a number of years, to hide... a whole bunch of SMT wings!
Of course you also have the acryl wings, but they are expensive and I only recommend them if they need to stand alone or need to be visually unobtrusive.
For the front wall I would recommend the flowers effectively or the V-wings but since you have experience with absorbers in the front, the crystal panels (also much cheaper than the wings) would maybe the way to go! If you don't like it (enough) or want to 'upgrade' to wings afterwards, you can always hang them against your ceiling.
Best.
Flyer, all I see on the website is variations on the same type of panel, designated 10, 20, 30, 40.
No reference to anything else.
No further descriptions.
I've emailed Matts but no reply yet.
No reference to anything else.
No further descriptions.
I've emailed Matts but no reply yet.
For me the flower-wings work perfectly for the first reflection on floor. In the right angel to the speaker the voices get so centrated and natural that it sounds like the reall thing
. I got help from my friend Gurkan (Cucumber) to get the voices just right!
What has been your experience with the adjustable bass traps? How difficult is it to make the adjustment to absorb an offending frequency?
Krelle, how far does your ceiling treatments extend to?
I sit about 14-15' from my spkrs, which stand 8' back from front wall. How much of the ceiling over the 23' from wall to listening position should I be considering treating?
I was aiming for the zone directly over/btwn speakers, and right over the listening position.
I sit about 14-15' from my spkrs, which stand 8' back from front wall. How much of the ceiling over the 23' from wall to listening position should I be considering treating?
I was aiming for the zone directly over/btwn speakers, and right over the listening position.
Hello Ron! In my old room (5x5 m) It was quite easy because I had big problems with 80,60 and 31.5 Hz due to the room measurements. Now in the new room (8x4.6 m) its less power in my problem areas but more Of them. IF you know the problem areas its no problem to adjust them. I use 8 varitunes4 and 3 varitunes6. I use pink noise to notice the problemareas, and then I adjust just the offending frequency.
I would recomend that you get the first reflection from the speakers in the ceiling first. I use a mirror to point Out the first reflektion, with help Of a friend that moves the mirror to right position. ( when the mid shows in the mirror from listeningposition) That I would say its the most important to get the first reflection in the ceiling.
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