No, the interest on the M1.2R was not higher ...At least you made a bundle selling your hybrid Lamm amps
Lamm ML3 + LL1, at last!
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I would love to hear the ML3s driving the 98dB sensitive Goebel Divin Majestics.
Maybe Elliot can tell us of his experience driving this speaker with SET amplifiers.
Maybe Elliot can tell us of his experience driving this speaker with SET amplifiers.
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Yes, I swapped them many times on the XLF. The ML3 is surely a better amplifier, but listening to the M1.2ref immediately shows that, at less in my long room, the XLF needs better damping and perhaps more power (current?) to have real dynamics.
Do you have an impedance plot of them? I am finding that impedance versus frequency is the critical parameter when using SET's.
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No; Goebel's website says the impedance dips to 3.3 ohms at 100Hz.
Divin Noblesse:
Impedance
nominal 4 Ohm
Impedance minimum in single wiring 3,8 Ohm at 100 Hz
So for bi wirable versions should we expect something different?
It quite similar to XLF's at around 500 Hz. Oliver Göbel referred they are adequate for low power tubes. Maybe they can use the Lamm ML3, but at a cost of almost almost half a million euros ...
I am happy to agree to disagree, but I would not be comfortable driving a 95dB sensitive speaker with only 32 watts. I personally prefer more "headroom" than that.
That's why I suggested the Majestic at 98dB sensitivity.
Fantastic. I knew there was a solution!
It all depends on how they took those measurements Ron, you can't go by posted numbers without knowing what's behind them. Kharma Exquisite Midid Grand is only rated at 91db but it's an excellent match to the ML3, much better than the higher rated Wilson Alexandria & XLF which I find lacking or at best borderline. Francisco is correct;
Wilsons need higher damping and lot more current to get those heavy long throw woofers moving properly.
david
Thank you Francisco. I think I know what you mean. I’ve listened to the ML2 and the M1.1 pretty extensively but on different speakers with very different requirements. They are both superb amplifiers but certainly suited for different speakers.
Most interesting...I have read that the big Wilsons thrive on limitless power and will gladly use whatever amount of high quality current/power you throw at it. I also realize magic comes in different flavors and there is undoubtedly a big amount of magic with Wilson and Lamm by nearly all accounts. Would love to hear XLFs with the mighty Lamm ML1/ML3 some day. Would also love to hear the XLFs with Gryphon monos or even Boulder 3060s.
Micro - are you now decided on keeping the Siegfried IIs with your XLFs? If so, will you move away from your ARC Ref 40 to VTL 7.5 MkIII? I remember how often you have espoused matching preamp/amp. (And another generation of preamp and amp later for me, and I have not done it yet!)
Nothing decided ... Currently the priority objective is reducing the gear stock , I do not want to carry everything with me when I move in a few months!
I appreciate all my equipment, I could easily live with any electronics I own. To be fair at this level, IMHO there is no "better" or "best", just what matches better or I want to prefer ...
Fair enough. BTW, do you prefer your Vivaldi transport with Redbook or the Taiko with the same redbook album? I only ask in case you ever decide you want to unload the Taiko! (Highly doubtful, I am sure!)Nothing decided ... Currently the priority objective is reducing the gear stock , I do not want to carry everything with me when I move in a few months!
I appreciate all my equipment, I could easily live with any electronics I own. To be fair at this level, IMHO there is no "better" or "best", just what matches better or I want to prefer ...
I wonder what it is about Kharma that make them different. They look like average high speaker company that might measure pretty poorly.
I ve never heard this particular combo , but high overall speaker impedance would likely be the answer .
( i ve read somewhere once that kharma uses series filters )
Also i think long throw heavy " out of phase " woofers in general are particularly dificult for Sets to control as david already stated.
I m not saying i think the wilson ( focal audiom) woofers XLF , X2 are bad woofers though
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Thats the US fault
Magazines hate it when a company just makes 1 good product and sticks with that for 10 years.
They cant live/ survive of that
To the extent that what you say is true, I think this tends to be more true with the US print magazines (TAS & Stereophile) than with on-line or e-zine publications. I've said this before: of the very few, pity the designer/manufacturer who gets it right in the first place - he is punished by the absence of reviews for not churning out new products every 5-6 years. Those publications will rarely publish a second review of a piece of gear, though there are occsional exceptions.
Though not a review, both print magazines do have have annual issues where they give ratings and divide equipment into classes of "relative superiority", A, B, C, etc. Stereophile allows older products to appear, identified as "especially deserving". For example, the 2019 Oct. issue of Stereophile lists both the Lamm LP2.1 phonostage and the Lamm M1.2 Ref in Class A for solid-state power amplifiers (actually it's a hybrid but there is no category for that.) I believe those evaluations held true in 2020 as well, but don't have that issue readily to hand. However - the presence of an older piece on their list seems to be at the discretion of an all powerful editor and they drop many gears off their lists claiming: 'has not been reviewed recently'.
As for e-zines, there is greater flexibilty for both the writer and the editor. The now 18 year-old M1.2 Ref remains unchanged since its launch in 2003. I reviewed it for The Audio Beat in 2015:
Likewise the LP2.1 phonostage was reviewed this year at Positive Feedback.
Print and on-line magazines are good at introductions. Great products stay alive because they are great products and the collective audiophile mind will not let them be forgtten. This is part of the genuine value of the WBF forum - a place where, imo, we do not "mostly blindly follow what most US reviewers / marketeers write as the latest greatest thing that has landed on planet earth."
For one I believe that Kharma's sensitivity figures are more honest than some others. Probably the impedance is another factor but one of the main contributors to the magic is Kharma's bass quality. Unlike Wilson's large, heavy slow woofers that without a large amount of current are always slightly behind the mid and high drivers playing catch up Kharma's 11" Omega F Drivers are extremely light and fast. Music happens at high speed big slow drivers will never sound natural.
I spec'd the Midi Grand Exquisites with F Drivers in place of the usual Kevlar drivers they come with.
david