Lampizator Valve / Tube Rolling Review Thread

[Socrates428]

FWIW, I bought a Puritan 156 based on the hype here yet the PS Audio P12 was much better for my system feeding my Lampizator, various preamps, and other front-end gear (not my bigger Class A amps or tube amps that sounded better straight to my dedicated lines). I sold the Puritan to a local guy who had a PS Audio P15 and he also kept his PS Audio and promptly sold the Puritan. YMMV.

 

[rspyder]

I'll check, but grounding issues are common across a wide variety of conditioners and regenerators where a dedicated electrical box and/or ground rod is not used. Your friend's PS Audio regenerator likely had a fault that needed repair. Nothing new and not the basis for generalizing. I've come across an audio dealer or two that don't like the PS Audio regenerators. Not had enough experience with power conditioners to be able to judge.

There's an interesting discussion comparing the P15 regenerator, which I have, with the Puritan PSM156, which is better built for grounds, at https://forum.psaudio.com/t/power-plant-15-and-a-puritan-156-conditioner/36759/6. One point made is that they serve different purposes. On the recommendation of a dealer last year, I got a good deal on a Wyred power conditioner to feed the P15, and that helped a lot at the time, especially with DC snubbing. Had I known of the Puritan, I might well have gone that way. Now I'm thinking seriously about auditioning the Puritan City Ground Master and Route Master combo (not a fan of substantial importer mark up, but that's how it goes).

To be clear, with the tube adapter ground wires the 60 Hz hum has completely disappeared, while a softer but audible 120 Hz hum remains. It seems to be coming from the Oppo, which my only fully digital component, ATC speakers aside, other than a cable box and TV. It's also to note that the Lampi GG dac is a SET design, which according to Lukasz is inherently noisy.

Thanks for the additional info. Yes, SET is more “noisy” relative to SS, but in SE it should be even-order harmonics (i.e. distortion that is more pleasing to human ears than other forms of inherent distortion).

 

[Designsfx]

Hello All-
I’m looking for impressions on small dual triodes like the ECC81/ECC82/ECC85 or ECC40 when compared directly to the 6SN7 in the Lampizator. I’ve been running a quad of 6SN7’s in my TRP3 for some time now and have read that the ECC’s can perform well also. Has anyone performed a comparison on these?

 

[jonstine]

For about 8 months, I have had a TRP3 with some a la carte GA3 upgrades that I added to it during the production build. It is basically the GA3 w/o the gold finish and flight case.

During those 8 months, I’ve gone through several tube rolling exercises, and thanks to this and other threads on WBF, I was able to shortcut many of the “less than ideal” tube pairings and relatively quickly settle on a Sophia Aqua II rectifier and a matched quad of Siemens F2A output tubes with TP adapters. I run XLR/Balanced to monoblocks, using the Volume Control in the TRP3 as a preamp.

I also swapped the standard fuse for a SR Purple, and then shortly after to a SR Master fuse. THAT was a noticeable sonic benefit as well, for those that are considering the Master upgrade.

Occasionally, and primarily to confirm my current tube choices, I would roll in other rectifiers (EML 274B Mesh, Sophia Princess 274B Mesh, Tungsram PV200/600, and a Svetlana 5C3S) as well as other output tubes (Tung-Sol KT120, Gold Lion KT88, and some cheap 6550 pairs). Without question, the pairing of the Aqua II with the F2As was hands down the best sounding pairing. Until last Friday…

I know that many have opined on the sonic merits of the Telefunken RGN2004 rectifier, but with a price point that outpaced my desired budget I assumed it was out of reach for now. And possibly that it might not be such a jump in sound quality since the Aqua II performed so well.

During conversations with a fellow WBF member, I was asked if I’d ever tried a 4V rectifier, and was followed by an offer to sell me one at a greatly reduced rate with an included TP adapter. Jumping at the opportunity, it was delivered within a week, arriving early Friday afternoon.

My wife has a fantastic ear, and is my constant listening companion. I employ her as my unbiased, blind listening tester, often swapping in new/different cables, fuses, tubes, isolation pieces, etc. without giving her any heads up just to see if she notices anything better or worse (or neutral) with the sound. Her track record has to be in the high 80-90% for detecting those changes. I trust her to detect any new ones, and I mention all that to set the background for what happened as soon as I played music with the RGN2004 rectifier.

My wife was upstairs working at her desk on Friday, which is slightly around the corner on the landing upstairs. It’s not a direct view of the speakers, and definitely not ideal for really noticing any audible changes. I had been playing music at moderate volume (about 35 on the Lampi volume), and simply pulled the Aqua II out while playing and dropped in the new RGN2004. Maybe a second of sound drop before the new rectifier caught up and music returned. Within 5 seconds my wife yelled down “OK, what did you just change!?” and wheeled her chair to the railing overlooking the stereo. That’s how profound the difference was.

We listened for many hours on Friday evening, and had music playing for most of Saturday. She said to me multiple times “you’re there, THIS is the sound I want in our home”, “wow, this is unreal”, “you did good”, etc. lol My 19yo son, also a music lover, said “it’s like a cloth has been taken off the speakers”.

So what does it sound like with the RGN2004 and the quad of F2As (all with TP adapters)? Glorious!! There is an entirely new level of clean and pure tone. New harmonics, texture, sparkle, and a luxurious, velvety analog sheen to everything. The most noticeable and immediate improvement was the bass. It went deeper, had more authority, and waaay more texture than before. Bass lines on many familiar songs now had boogie factor that didn’t exist prior to the swap.

On vocals there is a new richness and new levels of harmonics and micro details. Breaths, lip smacks, growls in the back of the throat, blending of vocals and background singers was superb, all of it was there.

But the high end was the star of the show. I have ribbon tweeters, and I don’t believe I’ve heard what they can truly do until this weekend. There is a purity in cymbal hits, triangles, crashes, and synth noises that is stunning. There is almost no other way to describe it other than PURE. Percussion and small jazz music is in the room. Big brass bands are spectacular. Alternative and rock albums are electrifying. And PURE. There are high frequency sounds in most songs that I’m hearing for the first time. It’s not etched or shrill or bright, just clean and PURE. It’s addicting.

I can’t believe how different music sounds with the RGN2004. It transformed my system to a level that was completely unexpected, and enthusiastically welcomed. Now I just need to ignore how much better the RGN2504 is supposed to be… lol

 

[jonstine]

I’ve also ordered the TP silver star grounding cable from @takacs75 and can’t wait to see what improvement that will bring.

There is no grounding lug on the back of the TRP3, so I was considering the Entreq grounding boxes. Does anyone have any experience with them they can share?

I am thinking either the Entreq Silver Minimus Infinity or the Olympus 10 T with Tungsten. Any collective knowledge on how well these work, or any other preferences? Thanks and cheers!

 

[highstream]

Are you using the TP adapter with the RGN2004? The Valvo 2504 is to my knowledge the only one that is especially liked. My sample of the Telefunken didn’t cut it. For a first try at grounding, the Puritan Ground Master City and Route Master have been recommended as a lower cost option.

 

[highstream]

To pick up on the hum issues I was having with the GG 2/3, the grounding cable from ZenWave solved the 60 Hz one that varied with the volume. The 120 Hz remained…until the other day when I received a new pair of PT-14 chrome base from Laszlo via Blake. Not only 50 hours in do they seem to sound better than the brown base version, the audible 120 Hz hum has disappeared! I have to put my ear to the speakers to hear anything. Loving the silence. The recti is a Telefunken RGN2004 w/TP adapter (for all).

What should I make of that: the construction of the brown base, the state of the tubes delivered, or…? The brown base came from the Italian seller discussed on a different thread.

 

[jonstine]

Are you using the TP adapter with the RGN2004? The Valvo 2504 is to my knowledge the only one that is especially liked. My sample of the Telefunken didn’t cut it. For a first try at grounding, the Puritan Ground Master City and Route Master have been recommended as a lower cost option.

Yes, I am using a TP adapter with the RGN2004 (P8A socket). The Horizon thread on here has quite a bit of feedback on the sonics of the RGN2004.

Thanks for the Puritan info. I hadn’t heard of them before, so I’ll check them out.

 

[highstream]

Yes, I am using a TP adapter with the RGN2004 (P8A socket). The Horizon thread on here has quite a bit of feedback on the sonics of the RGN2004.

Thanks for the Puritan info. I hadn’t heard of them before, so I’ll check them out.

About Puritan, Jaguar Audio has a 45 day return policy (Mike Kay at Audio Archon is also knowledgeable).

 

[rspyder]

For about 8 months, I have had a TRP3 with some a la carte GA3 upgrades that I added to it during the production build. It is basically the GA3 w/o the gold finish and flight case.

During those 8 months, I’ve gone through several tube rolling exercises, and thanks to this and other threads on WBF, I was able to shortcut many of the “less than ideal” tube pairings and relatively quickly settle on a Sophia Aqua II rectifier and a matched quad of Siemens F2A output tubes with TP adapters. I run XLR/Balanced to monoblocks, using the Volume Control in the TRP3 as a preamp.

I also swapped the standard fuse for a SR Purple, and then shortly after to a SR Master fuse. THAT was a noticeable sonic benefit as well, for those that are considering the Master upgrade.

Occasionally, and primarily to confirm my current tube choices, I would roll in other rectifiers (EML 274B Mesh, Sophia Princess 274B Mesh, Tungsram PV200/600, and a Svetlana 5C3S) as well as other output tubes (Tung-Sol KT120, Gold Lion KT88, and some cheap 6550 pairs). Without question, the pairing of the Aqua II with the F2As was hands down the best sounding pairing. Until last Friday…

I know that many have opined on the sonic merits of the Telefunken RGN2004 rectifier, but with a price point that outpaced my desired budget I assumed it was out of reach for now. And possibly that it might not be such a jump in sound quality since the Aqua II performed so well.

During conversations with a fellow WBF member, I was asked if I’d ever tried a 4V rectifier, and was followed by an offer to sell me one at a greatly reduced rate with an included TP adapter. Jumping at the opportunity, it was delivered within a week, arriving early Friday afternoon.

My wife has a fantastic ear, and is my constant listening companion. I employ her as my unbiased, blind listening tester, often swapping in new/different cables, fuses, tubes, isolation pieces, etc. without giving her any heads up just to see if she notices anything better or worse (or neutral) with the sound. Her track record has to be in the high 80-90% for detecting those changes. I trust her to detect any new ones, and I mention all that to set the background for what happened as soon as I played music with the RGN2004 rectifier.

My wife was upstairs working at her desk on Friday, which is slightly around the corner on the landing upstairs. It’s not a direct view of the speakers, and definitely not ideal for really noticing any audible changes. I had been playing music at moderate volume (about 35 on the Lampi volume), and simply pulled the Aqua II out while playing and dropped in the new RGN2004. Maybe a second of sound drop before the new rectifier caught up and music returned. Within 5 seconds my wife yelled down “OK, what did you just change!?” and wheeled her chair to the railing overlooking the stereo. That’s how profound the difference was.

We listened for many hours on Friday evening, and had music playing for most of Saturday. She said to me multiple times “you’re there, THIS is the sound I want in our home”, “wow, this is unreal”, “you did good”, etc. lol My 19yo son, also a music lover, said “it’s like a cloth has been taken off the speakers”.

So what does it sound like with the RGN2004 and the quad of F2As (all with TP adapters)? Glorious!! There is an entirely new level of clean and pure tone. New harmonics, texture, sparkle, and a luxurious, velvety analog sheen to everything. The most noticeable and immediate improvement was the bass. It went deeper, had more authority, and waaay more texture than before. Bass lines on many familiar songs now had boogie factor that didn’t exist prior to the swap.

On vocals there is a new richness and new levels of harmonics and micro details. Breaths, lip smacks, growls in the back of the throat, blending of vocals and background singers was superb, all of it was there.

But the high end was the star of the show. I have ribbon tweeters, and I don’t believe I’ve heard what they can truly do until this weekend. There is a purity in cymbal hits, triangles, crashes, and synth noises that is stunning. There is almost no other way to describe it other than PURE. Percussion and small jazz music is in the room. Big brass bands are spectacular. Alternative and rock albums are electrifying. And PURE. There are high frequency sounds in most songs that I’m hearing for the first time. It’s not etched or shrill or bright, just clean and PURE. It’s addicting.

I can’t believe how different music sounds with the RGN2004. It transformed my system to a level that was completely unexpected, and enthusiastically welcomed. Now I just need to ignore how much better the RGN2504 is supposed to be… lol

Great story! Thanks for sharing. I'm a big fan too of the Tele RGN2004 rectifier in the Lampi's conductor's seat (as i call it) and Laslzo's TP adapters. The F2A output tube is no wilting flower with 2 amps across its filament. Enjoy!

 

[Socrates428]

For about 8 months, I have had a TRP3 with some a la carte GA3 upgrades that I added to it during the production build. It is basically the GA3 w/o the gold finish and flight case.

During those 8 months, I’ve gone through several tube rolling exercises, and thanks to this and other threads on WBF, I was able to shortcut many of the “less than ideal” tube pairings and relatively quickly settle on a Sophia Aqua II rectifier and a matched quad of Siemens F2A output tubes with TP adapters. I run XLR/Balanced to monoblocks, using the Volume Control in the TRP3 as a preamp.

I also swapped the standard fuse for a SR Purple, and then shortly after to a SR Master fuse. THAT was a noticeable sonic benefit as well, for those that are considering the Master upgrade.

Occasionally, and primarily to confirm my current tube choices, I would roll in other rectifiers (EML 274B Mesh, Sophia Princess 274B Mesh, Tungsram PV200/600, and a Svetlana 5C3S) as well as other output tubes (Tung-Sol KT120, Gold Lion KT88, and some cheap 6550 pairs). Without question, the pairing of the Aqua II with the F2As was hands down the best sounding pairing. Until last Friday…

I know that many have opined on the sonic merits of the Telefunken RGN2004 rectifier, but with a price point that outpaced my desired budget I assumed it was out of reach for now. And possibly that it might not be such a jump in sound quality since the Aqua II performed so well.

During conversations with a fellow WBF member, I was asked if I’d ever tried a 4V rectifier, and was followed by an offer to sell me one at a greatly reduced rate with an included TP adapter. Jumping at the opportunity, it was delivered within a week, arriving early Friday afternoon.

My wife has a fantastic ear, and is my constant listening companion. I employ her as my unbiased, blind listening tester, often swapping in new/different cables, fuses, tubes, isolation pieces, etc. without giving her any heads up just to see if she notices anything better or worse (or neutral) with the sound. Her track record has to be in the high 80-90% for detecting those changes. I trust her to detect any new ones, and I mention all that to set the background for what happened as soon as I played music with the RGN2004 rectifier.

My wife was upstairs working at her desk on Friday, which is slightly around the corner on the landing upstairs. It’s not a direct view of the speakers, and definitely not ideal for really noticing any audible changes. I had been playing music at moderate volume (about 35 on the Lampi volume), and simply pulled the Aqua II out while playing and dropped in the new RGN2004. Maybe a second of sound drop before the new rectifier caught up and music returned. Within 5 seconds my wife yelled down “OK, what did you just change!?” and wheeled her chair to the railing overlooking the stereo. That’s how profound the difference was.

We listened for many hours on Friday evening, and had music playing for most of Saturday. She said to me multiple times “you’re there, THIS is the sound I want in our home”, “wow, this is unreal”, “you did good”, etc. lol My 19yo son, also a music lover, said “it’s like a cloth has been taken off the speakers”.

So what does it sound like with the RGN2004 and the quad of F2As (all with TP adapters)? Glorious!! There is an entirely new level of clean and pure tone. New harmonics, texture, sparkle, and a luxurious, velvety analog sheen to everything. The most noticeable and immediate improvement was the bass. It went deeper, had more authority, and waaay more texture than before. Bass lines on many familiar songs now had boogie factor that didn’t exist prior to the swap.

On vocals there is a new richness and new levels of harmonics and micro details. Breaths, lip smacks, growls in the back of the throat, blending of vocals and background singers was superb, all of it was there.

But the high end was the star of the show. I have ribbon tweeters, and I don’t believe I’ve heard what they can truly do until this weekend. There is a purity in cymbal hits, triangles, crashes, and synth noises that is stunning. There is almost no other way to describe it other than PURE. Percussion and small jazz music is in the room. Big brass bands are spectacular. Alternative and rock albums are electrifying. And PURE. There are high frequency sounds in most songs that I’m hearing for the first time. It’s not etched or shrill or bright, just clean and PURE. It’s addicting.

I can’t believe how different music sounds with the RGN2004. It transformed my system to a level that was completely unexpected, and enthusiastically welcomed. Now I just need to ignore how much better the RGN2504 is supposed to be… lol

Nice! Which type and vintage RGN2004 rectifier did you use?


Back from planet Unobtainium tube$ to Joe-Lunchbox tube land, I picked up a thrifty quad of these 6P6S Soviet tubes (no adapter needed as 6V6 equivalents) and have been enjoying their ambient, dimensional, slightly more romantic, and laid-back sound. They were very dark (think older BAT gear) at first, although at about 100 hours they sound much more open. They rank a little higher than the RCA 6J5s for me and not quite as high as the Raytheon 6J5Gs nor Sylvania JAN 6sn7WGTs, which have superior air and a sparkling top end, with a more forward, energetic, crystalline, dense, and detailed presentation. However, with their ambiance retrieval and cozy warm-blanket nature, the 6P6S tubes are hard to remove in any non-critical listening session. It's choosing between Beauty and More Beauty or perhaps Different Beauty here (what is Truth, anyway...)

Up Next: A quad of 1940's National Union / Ken-Rad JAN-CNU-7193s with Frankentube adapters. As grandfather to the 6j5, this should be a fun one in the GA TRP and Poseidon

 

[Wjhen]

Yes, I am using a TP adapter with the RGN2004 (P8A socket). The Horizon thread on here has quite a bit of feedback on the sonics of the RGN2004.

Thanks for the Puritan info. I hadn’t heard of them before, so I’ll check them out.

Hello Jonstine, Is it possible to post a picture of your TRP with F2a tubes with TP adapter and RGN2004 with TP adapter? I am going to order the TP adapters for the F2a tubes as well. And I already have the RGN2004 with TP adapter. Just curious how they look in the TRP dac. Thanks

 

[Blake]

To pick up on the hum issues I was having with the GG 2/3, the grounding cable from ZenWave solved the 60 Hz one that varied with the volume. The 120 Hz remained…until the other day when I received a new pair of PT-14 chrome base from Laszlo via Blake. Not only 50 hours in do they seem to sound better than the brown base version, the audible 120 Hz hum has disappeared! I have to put my ear to the speakers to hear anything. Loving the silence. The recti is a Telefunken RGN2004 w/TP adapter (for all).

What should I make of that: the construction of the brown base, the state of the tubes delivered, or…? The brown base came from the Italian seller discussed on a different thread.

Thanks for the report. We are hearing it the same- for whatever reason, chrome base sounds better than the brown base version (at least that is, your brown base pair I listened to and A/B compared to my Laszlo chrome base). Brown base is still very good, but chrome is just a bit better.

Yes, Laszlo is the ultimate source for tubes!

 

[Blake]

1940's German military-issue Valvo G2504's, a solid plate version in the background, and mesh plate version in the foreground. Construction appears to be otherwise identical.

View attachment 127033

My findings (w/ TP Adapters and TP's top level grounding wires on all tubes, compared in my GG3 and my Pac2, PT14 and PT35 output tubes, and in Pacific, Telefunken C3G and Telefunken EF802 anode):

Solid Plate G2504: Overall, technicalities are a bit superior to the mesh plate- more linear, more overtly dynamic, more organized and buttoned down (a bit more like super high end solid state), but with amazing tube holography. For Pacific users, the sound is more reminiscent of EF802 in the anode position.

Mesh Plate G2504: Comparatively, more romantic and lush, more like super high end tube modern tube amplifier sound, and trebles have some magic sprinkled on them that I struggle to describe. Not inferior to solid plate, just a bit different sonic flavor. For Pacific users, the sound is more reminiscent of C3G in the anode position.

Both are very clearly and unquestionably the best of the best from what I've heard in my systems. This will come down to personal sonic preferences and system matching with downstream gear. I'll definitely be keeping both.

If Valvo G2504 isn't available, Telefunken, large globe RGN2504 of similar 1930's/1940's vintage is the next best I've owned/heard and also highly recommended.

Next rung down for me, but still excellent would be G2004 or RGN2004 1930's/1940's vintage, solid plate or mesh (here, unfortunately I don't have the TP adapter, but I used the plasmod ultimate 2004 adapter, so still very high end). Fivre 5Z3 would be somewhere around this level as well, but I'd peg it somewhat below in performance, unless you wanted to add some heft, fullness to the sound, then Fivre might bump ahead, in my systems, 2004 is better.

Below that would be recti's like RK KR5U4G, Takatsuki 274b, then stuff like the AZ1 mesh, potato mashers, etc., etc. All still good, just at a lower performance level as compared to the vintage Valvo and Telefunken.

YMMV, and I'm not sure how these results translate to non-DHT Lampi models.

Edit: updated to include the Fivre 5Z3.

 

[highstream]

Unfortunately, all the available Telefunken 2504 showing on HiFi Shark right now are $$$$ and listed by the seller in Verona.

 

[jonstine]

Hello Jonstine, Is it possible to post a picture of your TRP with F2a tubes with TP adapter and RGN2004 with TP adapter? I am going to order the TP adapters for the F2a tubes as well. And I already have the RGN2004 with TP adapter. Just curious how they look in the TRP dac. Thanks

I am on business travel, but have this below on my phone. I was considering replacing the rectifier adapter with a matching wood type same as the quad, but with a new automotive paint job coming for the TRP3, I think the Zebrawood(?) will look better. If anyone is looking for a pair or a quad of F2A to EL34 TP adapters in Bubinga wood I’ll be reasonable with the price.

 

[Bbock]

Hello Jonstine, Is it possible to post a picture of your TRP with F2a tubes with TP adapter and RGN2004 with TP adapter? I am going to order the TP adapters for the F2a tubes as well. And I already have the RGN2004 with TP adapter. Just curious how they look in the TRP dac. Thanks

Here’s my TRP3 with the F2a adapters. No longer using the Sophia rectifier. Currently using the Cossor 53KU.

 

[jonstine]

i won’t hijack the thread, but will mention the TRP3 will be getting professionally powder coated by a good friend of mine. This will be its new color, sans logos lol. Going for a super creamy pearl white, and doing the case, front panel and knob all the same. I’ll post when finished in a few weeks.

 

[Designsfx]

Nice! Which type and vintage RGN2004 rectifier did you use?


Back from planet Unobtainium tube$ to Joe-Lunchbox tube land, I picked up a thrifty quad of these 6P6S Soviet tubes (no adapter needed as 6V6 equivalents) and have been enjoying their ambient, dimensional, slightly more romantic, and laid-back sound. They were very dark (think older BAT gear) at first, although at about 100 hours they sound much more open. They rank a little higher than the RCA 6J5s for me and not quite as high as the Raytheon 6J5Gs nor Sylvania JAN 6sn7WGTs, which have superior air and a sparkling top end, with a more forward, energetic, crystalline, dense, and detailed presentation. However, with their ambiance retrieval and cozy warm-blanket nature, the 6P6S tubes are hard to remove in any non-critical listening session. It's choosing between Beauty and More Beauty or perhaps Different Beauty here (what is Truth, anyway...)

Up Next: A quad of 1940's National Union / Ken-Rad JAN-CNU-7193s with Frankentube adapters. As grandfather to the 6j5, this should be a fun one in the GA TRP and Poseidon

Thanks for sharing your thoughts on the 6P6S- I’ve yet to give those a try in the TRP. Looking forward to hearing how your impressions of the 7193’s compare to those of @budburma as he has multiple sets awaiting adapters for use now. I believe he has a set of the Ken-Rads as well.
If you ever come across the Soviet 6C5C tube I would recommend picking them up- I posted pictures here some time ago. It’s the Soviet equivalent to the 6J5 and they really impress!

 

[Wjhen]

For those Interested in Lampizator Golden Gate SE with engine 11-p and many great tubes, check classifieds. I need to sell because we are moving to a new house. My wife does not like the depth of the Golden Gate DAC. I also have Atlantic TRP. That one got through.....