Lampizator Valve / Tube Rolling Review Thread

[Zero000]

Actually I think of all the 45s I own, EML Globe Mesh 45 is the best.

Mine aren't Lampi Anniversary branded, but they were part of the same project. A precursor probably, and absolutely indestinguishable visually from a keen eye looking at both editions. Or the same edition. I can't vouch for what happened.

After all that I don't rate any 45 or variant thereof in the top crop.

The EML is beautiful but as I have said many times I think EML and KR tubes are a mess when hit with volume. They just resonate and they need to learn how to make tighter tubes.

Granted KR RK tried to do better.

 

[K3RMIT]

While all tubes do this all globes make it worse. I think it’s because there is no attachment to the glass. So to me the very thing we are told makes them better is not. eml real mesh not stamped bottle head are much quiter tubes I feel.

 

[cpcat]

While all tubes do this all globes make it worse. I think it’s because there is no attachment to the glass. So to me the very thing we are told makes them better is not. eml real mesh not stamped bottle head are much quiter tubes I feel.

Not sure if I completely agree with this. I see what you are saying but I suspect it is dependent on design as well. I have a quad of TJ 300b mesh globes in right now and they aren’t very microphonic at all -compared to some of the older tubes I have, both ST and globe types.

Also I think it is important to define microphony noise. To me that means
a tube’s propensity to produce noise resulting from external vibrations.

Another type of noise is that inherent to the tube itself (or circuit) and independent of external vibrations. Some tubes may be very microphonic but quiet as a mouse just sitting there.

 

[MOME]

Actually I might have .
I do believe I have in the basement EML 45 Mesh and solid plate as well as EML 45 Globe mesh Ann, some NOS NU 45s and a few more of other variants of ST shape 45s. I've heard CX345 and UX245 in my system but unfortunately I don't own them. One which stands proudly above all 45s in my book is the EML 45 Globe Mesh Anniversary which is unfortunately unobtainable. Phenomenal tube by any means. One after that one is CX345 which again is not easy to source matched and not cheap...Except 45 Globe ann which shines across the board majority of 45s terrain where they excel is mids centric music (imho).

Thank you for your feedback.
At the moment I have the following 45 pairs: EML 45 Globe Mesh Anniversary, two different RCA, RK and Sylvanias are on the way.
Unfortunately, I have not yet been able to find reasonable CX345, UX245.

Regarding Recti, a combination with 5Y3 is often recommended. I have tested this with a Sylvania. The result is modest.

Has anyone ever had the opportunity to test a pair of PERRYMAN PA-245s?

 

[ctydwn]

The EML is beautiful but as I have said many times I think EML and KR tubes are a mess when hit with volume. They just resonate and they need to learn how to make tighter tubes.

Granted KR RK tried to do better.

I guess I do not follow this. I run quad KR RK 242s and absolutely love their dynamics, pace, detail and smoothness when called for. i do not experience any resonance or noise and often listen in the low 90s db-c across a few genres. I have not heard the earlier versions though

 

[Zero000]

The RKs are better. At least the RK 300B I had a while ago and sold.

But it's easy to follow. Whack up you gain with no music playing to a high level and tap your tubes by hand. A good firm tap with one finger.

You will hear it coming through your loudspeakers.

You are listening to this effect to a greater or lesser extent depending on the tubes in your DAC. Some are much better than others.

Record players suffer from the same effect.

When you play loud, this is fed back into what you hear. It part of the signature of the sound of a Lampi.

With resonant tubes many use tube dampers to cut down on this effect.

You know it's not too bad when you play music with sharp stop, start transients like an electronic drum beat loud and you don't hear any observable echo in the silence between the beats.

 

[ctydwn]

Hm Yeah that is what I mean. I have zero sound / echo after loud drum beats w quick transients. I am amazed by its quickness. In this way, the Pacific w the tubes I have added no color/resonance/echo in such passages as compared to the SS dac I transitioned away from. I guess that is my reference point. Not sure how the rest of system/shelving could play into that as well perhaps.

 

[cpcat]

You also know it’s bad if you turn it all the way up with no signal playing and you get runaway feedback- I’ve had that happen with my Cunningham 01a’s.

My ambient room noise is around 30db -I suspect that triggers it.

 

[Zero000]

Hm Yeah that is what I mean. I have zero sound / echo after loud drum beats w quick transients. I am amazed by its quickness. In this way, the Pacific w the tubes I have added no color/resonance/echo in such passages as compared to the SS dac I transitioned away from. I guess that is my reference point. Not sure how the rest of system could play into that as well perhaps.

The Pac chassis will have significant mass damping in your favour.

But you won't survive a full gain tap test no matter what. You WILL hear it through your speakers.

 

[highstream]

This is something I’ve been wondering about for some time. Does it require full gain? On my preamp I can hear the tap through the speakers well before full gain, although different tubes respond a little differently and depending on where it’s tapped — and maybe even the angle of my finger nail.

 

[Zero000]

No it doesn't require full gain. But try different tubes and some will be much better than others.

Tesla AD1n has the lowest acoustic feedback of anything I have ever come across in a triode based Lampi.

 

[ingemar]

Hi all.
To many tubes to useSo i,ve to sell of some of them.A pair Kr 242 with approx 100 hours on them 450 euros and a pair of visseaux ,just tested 300 euros.
Have a great sunday/Ingemar
The visseaux tubes are sold,thanks for passing by!!

 

[ingemar]

Hi all.
To many tubes to useSo i,ve to sell of some of them.A pair Kr 242 with approx 100 hours on them 450 euros and a pair of visseaux ,just tested 300 euros.
Have a great sunday/Ingemar
The visseaux tubes are sold,thanks for passing by!!

The 242's are reduced to 400 euros

 

[banpuku]

Hi guys - hope all is well. I am using the EML 45B as output tubes in my 2-stage mono-blocks. I am considering a few different tubes to replace the 45B, as I want to experience / try something new in hopes of achieving a more lifelike sound. 99% of the time, I listen to classic chamber music (violin, piano, cello, viola), so tonality is most important. Here is where I would like to improve my sound:

1. Need wider dynamics and improved transients, especially at lower listening levels. Most of the time I listen at 85-90db
2. Improve the lower bass when playing piano. Currently, it does not have any weight. The tonality is very good, but the weight is absent
3. Improve 3D depth

So, I am considering the following tubes to replace the EML 45B:
EML AD1
EML 50
EML 300b-XLS
Elrog 50
Elrog 801A
Other?

The EML and Elrog tubes both have some attractive features: 1) The EML tubes have center tap filaments, which lowers hum when using AC filament supplies. 2) Elrog tubes have thoriated Tungsten filaments which are supposed to enhance clarity and speed, both of which I could use.

So, if you were in my shoes, which way would you go and do you have any experience comparing the EML 45B (not 45, but 45B) to these tubes?

 

[bonzo75]

Hi guys - hope all is well. I am using the EML 45B as output tubes in my 2-stage mono-blocks. I am considering a few different tubes to replace the 45B, as I want to experience / try something new in hopes of achieving a more lifelike sound. 99% of the time, I listen to classic chamber music (violin, piano, cello, viola), so tonality is most important. Here is where I would like to improve my sound:

1. Need wider dynamics and improved transients, especially at lower listening levels. Most of the time I listen at 85-90db
2. Improve the lower bass when playing piano. Currently, it does not have any weight. The tonality is very good, but the weight is absent
3. Improve 3D depth

So, I am considering the following tubes to replace the EML 45B:
EML AD1
EML 50
EML 300b-XLS
Elrog 50
Elrog 801A
Other?

The EML and Elrog tubes both have some attractive features: 1) The EML tubes have center tap filaments, which lowers hum when using AC filament supplies. 2) Elrog tubes have thoriated Tungsten filaments which are supposed to enhance clarity and speed, both of which I could use.

So, if you were in my shoes, which way would you go and do you have any experience comparing the EML 45B (not 45, but 45B) to these tubes?

In terms of 300b the Elrog is very good and better than the EML 300b-XLS, Tak, and KR. However the Elrog 801 is quite poor and you will do better to have RCA 801a (which you will eventually find if you keep looking around, I also have spares somewhere). I have compared various 10ys and 801as in the Mayer 10y preamp, which is my favorite valve preamp. I also own a 4watt 801a amp which I have never heard yet but will do at some point. I can't tell you in your amp how 300b will compare to 801a etc. 801a in general is more linear and neutral, you can read Thomas Mayer page on the valve.

 

[christoph]

You also know it’s bad if you turn it all the way up with no signal playing and you get runaway feedback- I’ve had that happen with my Cunningham 01a’s.

My ambient room noise is around 30db -I suspect that triggers it.

You guys should listen to music, not going up the volume full blast without signal and then tap on the tubes

 

[Zero000]

You guys should listen to music, not going up the volume full blast without signal and then tap on the tubes

Nah. No fun.

Tapperty tap tap.... tap!

 

[jbrrp1]

Well, with all of the clear enthusiasm expressed here for the KR 242 tubes in a Lampi Pacific, I bought a pair of them plus the RK PX25's to try for tube rolling in my Pacific. I started with the 242's, and holy man! They really upped the Pacific vs. my previous favorites. Previously, I have tried:

1) PX4's that came with my DAC (totally "meh" to my ears, just under-dynamic and bland overall)
2) Takatsuki 300B's (too polite, not robust enough in the bass register for my system and tastes, but lovely tonality elsewhere)
3) Psvane WE 101D 1:1 replicas (legacy from my GG, and too bright, brash sounding - - just not a good coherent presentation)
4) KR T-100's (very "300B-like", but with a revved up vividness that can excite, but is too much of a good thing a lot of times)
5) KR RK 300B's (these were the tubes I heard in a fellow audiophile's system when I visited him to evaluate the Pacific vs. GG to make my upgrade decision. They just have served the music best overall in my system, so I have ridden with them for 1½ years. Good robust bass registers, "fleshier" harmonic presentation, which my TAD's benefit from.)

These KR 242's give up none of the RK 300B strengths, but wow, do they ever add a livelier microdynamic expression that unravels the musical lines more, which results in greater palpability, space, and harmonic expression - - all adding up to a greater sense of the breath of "life" in the musical reproduction. I'm lovin' 'em! I have ~60 hours on them now.

With the 242's in the Pacific, I'm definitely riding volume on the lower end of the dial, but I have not heard signs of overload distress. I may have the gain out of my Pacific adjusted to suit the 242's, if I resolve upon them in the end.

I will next put in the RK PX25's to hear how they present. I'm guessing I should have started with these, based upon Ked's comments! They may have trouble shining after the 242's....

 

[marty]

Some thoughts of possible interest:

1) I have done extensive A/B/A between the KR 242 and the RK KR 242 on my GG2. I find the RK KR 242 superior in every way. Whether this is due to the thicker glass, higher vacuum or better anode material, or just "system compatibility" I do not know. Nor do I care. Better control and finesse and equally impressive dynamics. Of course, YMMV.

2) If you are using any of these DHTs or an EML 274b recti (as I am) without Herbie's tube rings, you have not heard these tubes at their best, especially if you play at volume. The Lampi's are very susceptible to microphonics due to the high gain of the DHTs as has been previously discussed. Herbie's tube damping rings help reduce this significantly! (as does damping the top and side plates of the GG2).

I strongly recommend their UltraSonic Rx tube dampers (65mm) for the RK-KR 242 output tubes. (Mildly spring-tempered titanium C-ring holds three modified PTFE isolation pads. Each pad holds a specially formulated polymer O-ring against the tube glass).

However, for the EML 274b regulators, which run very hot, the HAL-O III stabilizers (also 65mm) are the way to go, (spring-tempered titanium C-ring and annealed titanium isolation pads).

Tube Dampers

Virtually all vacuum tubes are prone to distortion caused by microphonic vibrations. To overcome audible distortions, a titanium C-ring holds microphonics-absorbing pads against the vacuum tube bulb. The tube's sound is made more clear and precise, less fuzzy and less harsh. Tonal qualities are...

herbiesaudiolab.com

By the way, don't hesitate to play with ring position on the tubes. The sound can vary significantly with ring placement (although the middle of the tube is a good place to start and may work best).

 

[jbrrp1]

O. M. G. I just performed the "tap test" on my new KR 242's, and I've never heard a tube sing as long as these do. They have a clear tail of resonance for easily over 10 seconds! And it is rather pronounced in level, I'd say. I searched through my Herbies stash, and, alas, I have nothing of suitable diameter to try. [Always a bit shocking to trundle through one's accumulated stash of tweaky things, collected tubes, etc. Makes you feel a bit sheepish at times...] I will have to add some appropriate dampers for these tubes. I have some for my RK 300B's, and they made a clear difference upon installation.

I have the top of my Pacific well controlled with mass/elastomeric dampers (I'm a rubber engineer, so I've got to do it my way, you know). The outer structure of the DAC passes the "tap test" very well with these in place, but not at all with them absent. This need was evident all along with the B7, GG, and Pacific DAC's that I've owned.

What astonishes me is the level of revealing clarity that these 242's already bring relative to all other comers, even with this level of microphonics. It will be very interesting to tame the tubes appropriately, as much as I can with external applications. It is quite clear that the resonance is the plate structures inside the tube, so external applications can only go so far.