Magico Q7

[microstrip]

Although I am one of these persons who can not separate the contribution of the sound of speakers from the system that drives them, IMHO two of the best sounding speakers I have listened to are the Alexandria X2 and the TheSonusFaber. Unhappily I we can not find measurements from them anywhere.

BTW, I do not nominate any others as I have not listened to them in good conditions or at all, nothing else. But I love the sound of my SoundLabs and their on axis frequency response, measured at 1m or 2m is horrible.

 

[NorthStar]

That's assuming the cure isn't worse than the disease.

Well Myles, you can ask that to Kal Rubinson from Stereophile for once (Audyssey MultEQ PRO32).
And also Amir right here (JBL Synthesis with ARCO version 3.0).

And you can also ask some professional mixing/recording sound engineers from the biggest studios in Hollywood and from over the world.

* Loudspeakers with digital DSP for Room EQ & Calibration is the only way to go nowadays.
We live in modern times with some of the best sound reproduction from self-automated acoustic correction systems included in the loudspeakers themselves.

The prehistoric ages of loudspeakers are gone; the illusion don't work no more.
Time to adapt to our own rooms with smart loudspeakers. :b

You can have the best pair of Stereo loudspeakers in the world ($2,000,000),
but it cannot compete with a state-of-the-art smart loudspeaker that cost only $2,000 or so.

HDTVs are going Smarter every day, and better too (OLED).
High Res Loudspeakers are also starting to be smarter, and better too (Auto self-acoustically adaptable to each room where they perform).

Professional speaker designers, professional DSP chips programmers & designers, and technically inclined professional acousticians are emerging & working together... Or if not they will ...

** And me, I'm getting smarter too, and I'll be looking at smart speakers that include those sophisticated systems into their systems.
- A pair of loudspeakers is a system; so might is well create the best system within the system. :b

*** Classes. The world is full of them.
But the best classes are not necessarily the richest; to the contrary, they are the smartest.

The use of power is an art, and its equal distribution among the people is its true value of power.
The true business plan is to share, not to control, and profit only few individuals.
Beauty is inside the heart of the matter, not outside on the surface of things & people.

The Best Sound is a Smart Sound. Acoustically Adaptable to Any Room (AAAR).
...Loudspeakers with integrated Auto Room Correction & Home Equalization (ARCHE).

__________________

That's my viewpoint, how I see things properly done and with making total sense (SMART).
After all, its my money ... And I like to spend it the Best way possible and that automatically means the Smartest way. And Enjoy the Best life, with the Best sound, the Best picture, and the Best value money spent, which means the Best smart adaptation. :b

__________________

The times have come ... To be smart, and creative. To be wise, and economical.
To live right!

 

[NorthStar]

Think!

You buy a pair of loudspeakers, and you are FREE to put them anywhere you like in your home.
Without analysing your room's acoustics, buying instrumentations, equalizers, microphones, trying to read the measurements from graphs, etc.
And without even mentioning all the time you wasted on all those experiments, all the room treatments you purchased, the pros you paid to have at your home, the sterile and cold look of that room (if not properly hidden), and the less than satisfactory overall results at the very end which is actually never the end! And your lost of real freedom. Because if you add or substract anything to that room, you'd have to start all over again.
But not with Smart Loudspeakers; you can rerun them as often you like.

And with a name like Magico Q7; indeed give me that Magic Q, that Smart EQ,
that 007 James Bond's mojo! :b

 

[MylesBAstor]

Well Myles, you can ask that to Kal Rubinson from Stereophile for once (Audyssey MultEQ PRO32).
And also Amir right here (JBL Synthesis with ARCO version 3.0).

And you can also ask some professional mixing/recording sound engineers from the biggest studios in Hollywood and from over the world.

* Loudspeakers with digital DSP for Room EQ & Calibration is the only way to go nowadays.
We live in modern times with some of the best sound reproduction from self-automated acoustic correction systems included in the loudspeakers themselves.

The prehistoric ages of loudspeakers are gone; the illusion don't work no more.
Time to adapt to our own rooms with smart loudspeakers. :b

You can have the best pair of Stereo loudspeakers in the world ($2,000,000),
but it cannot compete with a state-of-the-art smart loudspeaker that cost only $2,000 or so.

HDTVs are going Smarter every day, and better too (OLED).
High Res Loudspeakers are also starting to be smarter, and better too (Auto self-acoustically adaptable to each room where they perform).

Professional speaker designers, professional DSP chips programmers & designers, and technically inclined professional acousticians are emerging & working together... Or if not they will ...

** And me, I'm getting smarter too, and I'll be looking at smart speakers that include those sophisticated systems into their systems.
- A pair of loudspeakers is a system; so might is well create the best system within the system. :b

*** Classes. The world is full of them.
But the best classes are not necessarily the richest; to the contrary, they are the smartest.

The use of power is an art, and its equal distribution among the people is its true value of power.
The true business plan is to share, not to control, and profit only few individuals.
Beauty is inside the heart of the matter, not outside on the surface of things & people.

The Best Sound is a Smart Sound. Acoustically Adaptable to Any Room (AAAR).
...Loudspeakers with integrated Auto Room Correction & Home Equalization (ARCHE).

__________________

That's my viewpoint, how I see things properly done and with making total sense (SMART).
After all, its my money ... And I like to spend it the Best way possible and that automatically means the Smartest way. And Enjoy the Best life, with the Best sound, the Best picture, and the Best value money spent, which means the Best smart adaptation. :b

__________________

The times have come ... To be smart, and creative. To be wise, and economical.
To live right!

Sorry but I have to say that if a "professional"j mixing/sound/etc engineers endorse a system, I'm running the other way. Their track record as far a being right is dismal. Worse than weather forecasters. After all, they all jumped on the Dynagroove, solid-state and digital technologies. These guy are techies, not music lovers. Ask them how many of them have actually heard a "real" high-end audio system. More often than not, your answer will be met with derision.

Maybe if you listen primarily to digital, you'll like the "sound" of DSP. You can see Marty's remarks and that the earlier room correction systems was abominable. Why would you want to keep your system in analog, only to kill it at the speaker? Maybe Marty's right since he may have heard more of the newer gen DSP engines out there but I have yet to hear one that is neutral or ...a DSP should be seen and not heard.

Same goes by the way for PLCs. Until very recently, I've never heard one where you couldn't hear its colorations.

And your extreme example of a $2,000,000 vs a $2000 is misleading. If you put the same two speakers in a good room, all things being equal, the more expensive speaker should sound better. Of course, the smaller less expensive speaker might sound better in more rooms than your SOTA speaker, because the less expensive speaker is not capable of exciting all the room problems like your big speaker

Different strokes for other folks.

 

[Ron Party]

Is not the room one of if not the greatest sources of EQ to any system?

 

[microstrip]

Is not the room one of if not the greatest sources of EQ to any system?

Yes, but much worst - delayed EQ as the time path of the reflections is an import part of it. It why you can not completely compensate for poor room acoustics just using simple EQ - some people claim that tools such as wave field synthesis are needed for it.
Happily our brain is very adaptive to room acoustics, otherwise most of us could not enjoy audio systems.But I can imagine that compensating for all the different rooms at CES was a tiresome work!

 

[NorthStar]

Anyway, these are all interesting comments, and a great subject about expensive loudspeaker systems, like the Magico Q7 right here.

We can extrapolate and share all the experiences of the world, but a balance between the sound propagation and the room's acoustics must be realistically achieved.

And it takes more than expensive drivers, sophisticated crossovers, several coatings of vernishes, paints, over exotic wood, and heavy bracing and calculated measurements about enclosure resonnances and all that Jazz to obtain that balance in a realistic ambiance where ALL type of music would be comfortable.
Delays are already in the recordings (quality ones, not those sanitized dodo studio ones), and you certainly don't want to add more on top.

Analog, Digital; yeah right, you know of any sophisticated analog EQs out there?
And who has experience with few digital EQs that are truly worthy of consideration?
Me? Kalman Rubinson, from his various experiments with Audyssey, Arc, Trinnov, ...? Amir (JBL Synthesis) own experience? Meridian's Bob Stuart (and its DSP loudspeakers plus MLP technology)? Chris Kyriakakis from Audyssey? Tomlinson Holman from THX? Harman Kardon's technical sound engineers? Lexicon's technical staff and programmers department? Anthem's (ARC) & Paradigm's facilities and explorations on DSP surround sound room's acoustics integration? Robert Pariseau & his technical team?

I can only speak for me, and my ears tell me that at realistic volume level in a normal room's size, without being live, but semi-live (good enough), a good Auto Room EQ & Correction system like from Audyssey, can do wonders indeed.
And you'd better be good with a microphone! :b

Holy Grail? Why the heck not! At least for now, and until the next higher Holy Grail.
But this one right now sounds feminine enough that it is a nice complement.
And solidly concealed enough to not be so secret, but just right in the revelation of its magical touch.

For me, it cannot be more clear than that. And I'm wide open to any type of comments by anyone.
And if you have some' new to bring from your own experience, bring it on baby! :b

 

[JackD201]

What if Alon and company set things up to sound just the way they did or in other words the sound/balance was intentional? It seems on the last day, he switched amps and they supposedly sounded different.

The problem I see with a manufacturer showing with something with switchable curves in the chain is, if you are displaying your speaker you can bet the attention and lust will be for the EQ device. It kind of defeats the purpose of going to show. If you look at Magico's Q1 display pics, you'll find that visually the Q1s are front and center with the BaLabos off to the side. If I were him I'd do the same. Make the featured product the center of attention, that is. The downside is, you will get people that won't like the balance.

 

[fas42]

Happily our brain is very adaptive to room acoustics, otherwise most of us could not enjoy audio systems.But I can imagine that compensating for all the different rooms at CES was a tiresome work!

That's what I've found. The better the system, the more clearly the acoustic cues are presented, not tainted with excessive distortion, then the more easily the ear/brain can decode what sound belongs to the performance, and what comes from the room. Quite some time ago I made the point that tone controls cease to have a strong subjective effect the better the system is, this was greeted with great derision by some; but it is exactly the same thing as the mind handling room acoustic influences: the better the quality of the sound emerging from the drivers, the less the room matters.

Frank

 

[NorthStar]

Myles, I just wanted to make my point. Of course I was exaggerating. ...And all in the fun. :b

 

[NorthStar]

If the recording material needs EQ, then it's the room that truly needs it,
or simply that the recording ain't good.

* I'm going to make one thing perfectly clear here: It is the loudspeaker system's interaction with the room that needs acoustical balance. Not the loudspeaker itself.

And how do you treat a room acoustically if there is no sound originator?

And because each loudspeaker' 'voice' is different, it requires specific room's acoustical treatments.
From the various sound dispersions and proprieties from its 360 degree dimensional polar response.
Even some specific recording music material sounds best when properly calibrated in the room where it would be played, and by some better matching type of loudspeakers.

Change the music; change the loudspeakers, and recalibrate the acoustical envelope for better musical involvement.

Best is to have several loudspeaker systems in several acoustically calibrated rooms.
{Dedicate the specific music to its best reproducers and its own room.}

Why do you think that at some Audio shows they don't want you to play your own music?

You had it coming, and much more to come ... :b

 

[Roysen]

Sorry but I have listened to several systems where the main focus has been EQ to perfect the speaker/room interaction. These systems all have the same problems. They sound too flat, too dry without life, dynamics and tonality. They sound very similar to an overdamped room. If this is "perfection", then no thanks. I'll prefer a great speaker like the Magico Q-Series in an acousticly untreated room.

 

[Roysen]

BTW, I can see the Q7 shown at CES came with tri-wire speaker terminals while the pair ordered for TWBAS will come with bi-wire speaker terminals.

I wonder if both of these options will be available in the production version as well as normal singel-wire speaker terminals?

Personally I would go with the tri-wire option to have the option to bi- or tri- amplify.

 

[Steve Williams]

Sorry but I have listened to several systems where the main focus has been EQ to perfect the speaker/room interaction. These systems all have the same problems. They sound too flat, too dry without life, dynamics and tonality. They sound very similar to an overdamped room. If this is "perfection", then no thanks. I'll prefer a great speaker like the Magico Q-Series in an acousticly untreated room.

I'm not sure which rooms you have heard with EQ but they are obviously not the same ones to which I listened. What were they using to EQ the room? TacT,DEQX etc

I was never a believer in room EQ until I heard it properly set up in Marty's system with TacT and his room hands down is the best I have ever heard anywhere in 50 years of listening

 

[phillipK]

Sorry but I have listened to several systems where the main focus has been EQ to perfect the speaker/room interaction. These systems all have the same problems. They sound too flat, too dry without life, dynamics and tonality. They sound very similar to an overdamped room. If this is "perfection", then no thanks. I'll prefer a great speaker like the Magico Q-Series in an acousticly untreated room.

I am with you on that. I must say, after learning of some people preferences here (And hearing the Aida...), this thread has lost its luster. I had the pleasure of trying the TacT. It was god-awful. I can’t imagine anyone enjoying such a dry, lifeless music reproduction. But some, apparently, do. I am OK with that

 

[Jeff Fritz]

BTW, I can see the Q7 shown at CES came with tri-wire speaker terminals while the pair ordered for TWBAS will come with bi-wire speaker terminals.

I wonder if both of these options will be available in the production version as well as normal singel-wire speaker terminals?

Personally I would go with the tri-wire option to have the option to bi- or tri- amplify.

I'm not sure what is standard, or if they can be ordered with any of the three configurations. I know Magico does not supply jumpers -- their position is that they degrade the sound due to the added wiring junctions.

 

[Roysen]

I have heard them all, TACT, DEQX and Audiolense.

 

[es347]

Someone way back in this thread said that most of the posters offering opinions on the Q7 had not heard it. Point well taken but I did have the opportunity to audition them at the local dealer back in December. There were driven by the big Levinson monoblocks and the source as I recall was the Naim server. Even though there was a resonance in the sub 100hz range due to the room, you could tell that the Q7 is something pretty special. The fit and finish is superb and the aesthetic likely would appeal to many although for my taste it was just so so. The real question: is there $60K worth of sound there? As good as the Q7 is, I think you can get to that same level of sonics for significantly less. Sonus Faber, Wilson..etc.

 

[Steve Williams]

The Q7 has an MSRP of way north of $100K

Were you thinking of the Q5 which is ~$60K

 

[es347]

My bad Steve...the Q5. Must be this cold medicine.