Master Built-What are Owners Hearing That They Didn't Hear With Other Cables

[bazelio]

Dup post. Please refer to http://www.whatsbestforum.com/showt...h-Other-Cables&p=508715&viewfull=1#post508715

 

[Steve Williams]

I received loaner Master Built RCA interconnect cables just yesterday from Joe Hakim at Eigen Audio. He sent me the Ultra and the Reference series, 1 pair each. I'm only two records in thus far, and have only tried the Ultra, but I'd already like to share some preliminary thoughts.

The Master Built Ultra is the most transparent cable I've ever heard in my system, and it's not close. The beauty of the Ultras are in how they present nuance. Compared to every other cable I've heard, the Ultra wins in micro detail resolution, absolute perfection in tonal balance, and laser-like precision of imaging and soundstage layering. It does all this with so much finesse, never calling attention to itself, never being the slightest bit analytical or unnatural. It's truly as if they're not even there. Music simply sounds natural (in the best sense of the word), "live", "in the room", add your favorite meme. I literally don't know what else to say other than to say these cables really are THAT impressive. I tried to look for faults... At first I thought they were a tad laid back, but they're really not. It's just that they layer detail better than other cables and as I said, have incredible finesse. Low level bass detail is astounding (and I'm proud of my system itself for being so good ;-) ) but never bloated, accentuated, nor out of place. I also thought maybe they are a tad polite up top, but again, they're really not. My other cables are probably a hair shimmery in comparison. Cymbals sound perfect with the Master Built Ultra, from the wooden strike, to the crash, to the sustain and decay. Just gorgeous and correct. After two records, I just have stopped even trying to find fault and am simply marveling at how my system sounds. So at this point, I would not hesitate to say that these cables should appeal to all tastes, and in any system. That's because they simply do what cables should do, and better than any other cable. Now, with all that said, these cables are not in my personal budget but I won't go down the path of "are they worth the asking price" etc. I will simply say, if these cables are in your budget, if you don't particularly enjoy auditioning cable after cable, then I would not hesitate to whole heartedly recommend simply obtaining Master Built Ultras and never thinking about component interconnects ever again. They might just be perfect, and are certainly in a class of their own. And if you do buy them, color me jealous, and please invite me over to listen to your system. ;-)

Totally agree

For me the addition of a full loom of Ultra in my system transformed the sound to a level I never thought possible. They are the real deal

 

[KeithR]

I received loaner Master Built RCA interconnect cables just yesterday from Joe Hakim at Eigen Audio. He sent me the Ultra and the Reference series, 1 pair each. I'm only two records in thus far, and have only tried the Ultra, but I'd already like to share some preliminary thoughts.

The Master Built Ultra is the most transparent cable I've ever heard in my system, and it's not close. The beauty of the Ultras is in how they present nuance. Compared to every other cable I've heard, the Ultra wins in micro detail resolution, absolute perfection in tonal balance, and laser-like precision of imaging and soundstage layering. It does all this with so much finesse, never calling attention to itself, never being the slightest bit analytical or unnatural. It's truly as if they're not even there. Music simply sounds natural (in the best sense of the word), "live", "in the room", add your favorite meme. I literally don't know what else to say other than to say these cables really are THAT impressive. I tried to look for faults... At first I thought they were a tad laid back, but they're really not. It's just that they layer detail better than other cables and as I said, have incredible finesse. Low level bass detail is astounding (and I'm proud of my system itself for being so good ;-) ) but never bloated, accentuated, nor out of place. I also thought maybe they are a tad polite up top, but again, they're really not. My other cables are probably a hair shimmery in comparison. Cymbals sound perfect with the Master Built Ultra, from the wooden strike, to the crash, to the sustain and decay. Just gorgeous and correct. After two records, I just have stopped even trying to find fault and am simply marveling at how my system sounds. So at this point, I would not hesitate to say that these cables should appeal to all tastes, and in any system. That's because they simply do what cables should do, and better than any other cable. Now, with all that said, these cables are not in my personal budget but I won't go down the path of "are they worth the asking price" etc. I will simply say, if these cables are in your budget, if you don't particularly enjoy auditioning cable after cable, then I would not hesitate to whole heartedly recommend simply obtaining Master Built Ultras and never thinking about component interconnects ever again. They might just be perfect, and are certainly in a class of their own. And if you do buy them, color me jealous, and please invite me over to listen to your system. ;-)

High praise, my friend! I will be curious your thoughts on Zenwave too when the time comes.

 

[bazelio]

High praise, my friend! I will be curious your thoughts on Zenwave too when the time comes.

Keith, that's here: http://www.whatsbestforum.com/showt...4-Interconnect&p=508109&viewfull=1#post508109

Zenwave D4s are very good. Master Built Ultras are a different ball game, however. D4s, in comparison, don't nail the micro stuff... micro detail, texture, etc. I think D4 pushes the treble forward a bit also, which isn't necessarily to say they're a bit bright, just a very different presentation. The D4 has a signature; where the Ultra does not. The Ultra's presentation is flawless. Its low level detail is incredible. I was just listening to a track with bass drums / kick drums, which vinyl in general rarely gets right IMO, and they sound so real, so full, and so clear. At this point, I essentially wish I hadn't heard the Ultras because now I can't unhear them. ;-) .

The jury is still out for me on the Master Built Reference cable. It's a warmer, more veiled sound vs the Ultra with significant comparative deficiencies in the technicalities. The D4 also has better clarity than the Reference, and does micro stuff better.. But I prefer the less forward presentation of the Reference. Pick your poison, I guess. I have to listen quite a bit more, too.

Bottom line, though... I'm amazed by the Ultra cables. How did they do this? What *is* this proprietary alloy they use?!?

 

[mountainjoe]

The jury is still out for me on the Master Built Reference cable. It's a warmer, more veiled sound vs the Ultra with significant comparative deficiencies in the technicalities. The D4 also has better clarity than the Reference, and does micro stuff better.. But I prefer the less forward presentation of the Reference. Pick your poison, I guess. I have to listen quite a bit more.

Give the Reference cables a few days to settle - they should open up and the micro dynamics should improve.

Cheers, Joe

 

[Al M.]

I think D4 pushes the treble forward a bit also, which isn't necessarily to say they're a bit bright, just a very different presentation.

This may be system dependent. Whatever the amount of treble from the D4, if it's right or too much (in my system it sounds right to me), it certainly isn't particularly pushed forward in my system -- and the system in itself can be quite forward sounding, especially the way I have intentionally set it up with listening chair relatively close to speakers.

It may also mean that all the cables need to settle a bit more in your system, as Joe suggested for the Masterbuilt Reference cable as well. I am looking forward to hear your report on the Reference once that cable has settled in.

 

[bazelio]

This may be system dependent. Whatever the amount of treble from the D4, if it's right or too much, it certainly isn't pushed forward in my system -- and my system in itself can be quite forward sounding, especially the way I have intentionally set it up with listening chair relatively close to speakers.

It may also mean that all the cables need to settle a bit more in your system, as Joe suggested for the Masterbuilt Reference cable as well. I am looking forward to hear your report on the Reference once that cable has settled in.

I didn't realize the D4 had this bit of treble push until I started cable rolling. For example, cymbals on many records sound more up front relative to the listener with D4 vs either of the MB cables which place them deeper in to the stage. And in these cases, the MB presentation just comes across as the more accurate sound stage rendition. It's also not a major thing, but I do prefer one vs the other.

I've got a particular Dave Mathews Live LP recorded at concert that I attended in person. It is a good arbiter of sound stage accuracy for me.

 

[PeterA]

I didn't realize the D4 had this bit of treble push until I started cable rolling. For example, cymbals on many records sound more up front relative to the listener with D4 vs either of the MB cables which place them deeper in to the stage. And in these cases, the MB presentation just comes across as the more accurate sound stage rendition. It's also not a major thing, but I do prefer one vs the other.

I've got a particular Dave Mathews Live LP recorded at concert that I attended in person. It is a good arbiter of sound stage accuracy for me.

Thank you bazelio for sharing your impressions with the rest of us. These are two cable lines that seem to have people talking on this forum. Have you listened to some large scale orchestral music with either cable? I am curious to know if the higher pitched brass instruments or even massed violins move forward on the stage relative to the other instruments when heard through these cables. Usually, the violins are not closer to the listener than are the cellos, unless they are specifically arranged that way. If the forward nature of the cable makes trumpets, or flutes or triangles move in front of the string sections, then something is not quite right. The same effect can be listened for with string quartets to see how instruments are laid out on the stage.

Lately, I have been struggling to hear high frequency differences between cartridges, and I find distinguishing between HF extension and linearity/frequency response can be a challenge. Much of it comes down to listener preference, but if the placement of certain instruments on stage is a bit off, then that ruins the illusion for me. Of course, this can be recording dependant and how the engineer chooses to present the instruments in the mix can be a factor.

Another question I have is how does one truly know if the difference he hears is the result of a specific signature of the cable or of a transparent cable allowing the listener to hear a signature of one of the components. I think one would have to know the system, and the individual components, very well to make these distinctions. If one cable seems to have a slightly forward tremble region, does that mean that the cable itself is more forward or that it is just more transparent than another cables which may be hiding a forward presentation from a DAC, amplifier or some other component? I imagine that DaveC has a reference system and testing gear to specifically understand precisely what one of his cables sounds like compared to another one, but for the user in the field, I imagine it is not so simple.

And then, in the end, it may not really matter, as it is the mix of components in the system that one actually ends up hearing, and for which particular mix the listener ultimately has a preference.

 

[Al M.]

Another question I have is how does one truly know if the difference he hears is the result of a specific signature of the cable or of a transparent cable allowing the listener to hear a signature of one of the components. I think one would have to know the system, and the individual components, very well to make these distinctions. If one cable seems to have a slightly forward tremble region, does that mean that the cable itself is more forward or that it is just more transparent than another cables which may be hiding a forward presentation from a DAC, amplifier or some other component? I imagine that DaveC has a reference system and testing gear to specifically understand precisely what one of his cables sounds like compared to another one, but for the user in the field, I imagine it is not so simple.

Yes, very much agreed, Peter. That is precisely the point that I have been making on the D4 interconnect thread as well. It's hard to pinpoint the contributions or sound signature from a single component in a system. Frankly, even though I know my system and room well, I could not confidently make those distinctions too in each case.

And then, in the end, it may not really matter, as it is the mix of components in the system that one actually ends up hearing, and for which particular mix the listener ultimately has a preference.

Also agreed.

 

[bazelio]

Hi PeterA,

My collection of classical is very limited. I tend to prefer Baroque era performed with period instruments, especially Ton Koopman's work. Most of what I have is not large orchestra, and the recordings are not quite "audiophile" in nature. Thus far I've been listening to jazz, blues, and rock with these cables.

I have also brought up the same point about the general inability to pinpoint the contribution of a cable or any component amongst a multitude of system variables in the D4 thread. I have to go by what I've heard in systems similar to my own and the process of elimination. And as I admitted there, I could be wrong. Luckily, in the case of D4's slight sweetness, DaveC also confirmed the same. In terms of presentation, if you've been around a lot of live music then you probably have a sound in your head that you're trying to achieve and know it when you hear it. Based on that, I personally do find the presentation of the MB somewhat better. Today, I am putting the Master Built Reference in the phono to preamp position with the D4 in the preamp to amp position. I suspect this may achieve a nice balance. And Dave is also sending another D4, so I can evaluate it in both positions. What I'd prefer to do instead is just listen to the Ultra for as long as I have it, and ignore everything else. But that'd be unproductive.

 

[NorthStar]

Good morning Bazelio,

Which artists in Jazz and Blues music do you like listening to?

And, do you also listen to digital music?

Cheers,
Bob

 

[bazelio]

Good morning Bazelio,

Which artists in Jazz and Blues music do you like listening to?

And, do you also listen to digital music?

Cheers,
Bob

Very wide ranging, and I should have mentioned that I have quite a bit of folksy stuff as well.

During my recent cable rolling adventures, in terms of Jazz, I've been listening to Bill Evans, Ben Webster, John Coltrane, Grant Green, Jimmy Forrest, Coleman Hawkins, Sonny Rollins. Also Jon Bonamassa, Stevie Ray Vaughn, BB King, Muddy Waters, Peter Gabriel, Van Morrison, Norah Jones, Dave Mathews, Steven Wilson ... off the top of my head .

I listen to digital, but rarely. And not at all with these cables thus far. I do have a EAR Acute III CD player/ DAC that sees occasional duty.

 

[NorthStar]

Do the cables favor one music format over another?
Thank you.

 

[bazelio]

Do the cables favor one music format over another?
Thank you.

I could certainly use the Ultra cables indiscriminately. I need to spend more time with the others.

 

[NorthStar]

Joe Bonamassa, great contemporain guitar bluesman.

 

[mountainjoe]

Hi PeterA,

What I'd prefer to do instead is just listen to the Ultra for as long as I have it, and ignore everything else. But that'd be unproductive.

Oh man, I thought that was the whole point of this hobby! You’re telling me we’re supposed to be productive? ;-)))

 

[Leif S]

Lol

 

[Leif S]

Oh man, I thought that was the whole point of this hobby! You’re telling me we’re supposed to be productive? ;-)))

I would of started with the Reference first lol. Hard to go back after the Ultra's go in.

 

[mountainjoe]

I would of started with the Reference first lol. Hard to go back after the Ultra's go in.

I warned him ;-)

 

[bazelio]

Hahaha. Ahhhhh, well. Now I'm just so confused.