Can I ask which album on Tidal? Also, you might already know of this one, but in case you don't check out Gordon Goodwin's Big Phat Band - Act Your Age, great dynamics, impact, detail. Enjoy!
MSB Select II arrival
- Thread starter Mike Lavigne
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Can I ask which album on Tidal? Also, you might already know of this one, but in case you don't check out Gordon Goodwin's Big Phat Band - Act Your Age, great dynamics, impact, detail. Enjoy!
Not to take anything away from Mike's great thread,but I think what I have read about the advances in DSP and digital audio,in a short time we will experience parity. Only a matter of time. Embrace advances in digital....Enjoy.Hi
Earlier in this thread, I dared to suggest that "Digital had arrived'. My comment were met with what I perceived as annoyance. Not hostility, just a few being somehow annoyed at the comment.
It is becoming clearer and clearer as the thread advance that indeed this is the case for many: Digital has arrived. Someone even spoke of having crossed the Rubicon...
Very interesting and to me welcome development.
Carry on people
FrantzM, In the sense that the phrase can be interpreted as meaning "a point of no return". If I am correct in attributing that statement to a particular member, I think he has not heard his analog gear for nearly a year. To state that he is "crossing the Rubicon" because of his recent experiences with digital, infers to me that he has no intention of going back to his analog, and yet, and yet, I think he is in fact shopping for his next ("last"?) turntable while not having heard his existing gear in a long while. This, to me, indicates a lack of introspection, or, at minimum, a loose use of the phrase.
Sorry, back on topic.
Dear sirs,
I have been reading people commenting sq of digitals comparing to vinyl in their systems. On digitals many mentioned of high res files and use the best files and format to compare with vinyl. But I dont hear many at all talking about using first press or top quality records to listen in their comparison. Good pressing can sometime have even more impact in sound than changing $15,000 cartrigde. This software issue even make it more complicated to get any valid and fair comparison between two formats.
Kind regards,
Tang
I have been reading people commenting sq of digitals comparing to vinyl in their systems. On digitals many mentioned of high res files and use the best files and format to compare with vinyl. But I dont hear many at all talking about using first press or top quality records to listen in their comparison. Good pressing can sometime have even more impact in sound than changing $15,000 cartrigde. This software issue even make it more complicated to get any valid and fair comparison between two formats.
Kind regards,
Tang
I made exactly that point here on 9/6.
we simply cannot make broad statements, there is too much nuance in what we hear. there are only specific cases.
You are in my "not many people" whom mentioned of this issue, Mike.
Kind regards,
Tang
Tango, I made that point earlier too, going from 33s to some of Mike's 45s is one of the biggest upgrades one can make. The bass on a Led Zep Original is so real, and on the reissues is like..like digital
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I don't see it. DSP will never be the answer to great analog. double digitizing will be a step backwards to the advances I am hearing with the Select II in my completely analog signal path. it is trying so hard to overcome the restraints of digital. I think you underestimate what is required to get to where it is now. and it's not all the way there yet.
great systems which don't need DSP will allow digital to attain it's highest form.....which will then get it closest to analog. (of course, i'm viewing the term 'DSP' as referring to some sort of room correction).
we are both speculating, and I could be wrong......
We both could be wrong. The noise floor I hear now with digital will only improve in the recording chain. I could be wrong but I doubt it. I think DSP will also have a positive effect on the recording chain. I don't see much improvement on the analog side. The recording industry is all in on digital,has been for quite some time. YMMV
it's cheap and easy. not better.
which is pretty sad actually.
but there are times the music overcomes digital's limitations. and the best digital approaches can be very good. but it's not typical. again; broad brush strokes don't really work.
Many recording engineers (and musicians) would disagree with you on the reasons for digital.
Digital was not primarily implemented because it is cheap and easy. Recording engineers honestly wanted a better medium, with freedom from tape hiss, wow and flutter, with greater dynamic range, better frequency linearity, freedom from the limitations of vinyl and mastering for vinyl etc.
You can of course argue that they were misguided to a large extent, not recognizing the virtues of analog at its best and the vices of digital at its worst, or in its early implementations in general. I would be sympathetic to that of course from my own audiophile perspective.
Yet I think it would be a mistake for us to judge everything just from our own audiophile experience and perspective, and to assign wrong motives and reasons to those who don't think our way.
Cheap and easy was not the only reason. Digital technology has finally caught up and when I see top analog recording engineers switching over to digital,there's a reason. The noise floor capabilities on digital audio recordings are much lower,the weak link continues to be the digital playback system. If that is optimized,then the playback system needs to be at the same level of resolution. Overall clarity is the key and dynamics follow right a long with it. I am continually amazed by the dynamics revealed in digital recordings and the clarity is right there with it and this is at normal listening levels. The question is which has the greater dynamic range and lower noise floor capabilities. My ear says digital.
everyone has a right to their opinion.
execution can make a significant difference. the margin for error in digital is very small to connect with the music effectively. it can happen. but many times it does not. part of it is that the process to make music is so disjointed compared to the prior approach of recording an event....now it is mostly just so different with pieces here and there. some types of music all seem to have been recorded on the same day. hard to tell anything unique about it.
so there is just so much to it.
there are types of music where digital seems to work. some of the obscure classical you and I like seem to work since they take a simple approach and allow the music to flow. but that stuff is the exception.
my ear says analog.
Anyone who points out advantages of 45 rpm over 33 rpm vinyl of course concedes limitations of vinyl.
Recording engineers saw these and other limitations as well, which was a main driver for the development of digital audio.
Recording engineers saw these and other limitations as well, which was a main driver for the development of digital audio.
well, I view that completely differently. 45rpm vinyl shows just what can be done when the format is optimized. I see it as proof of concept, not a limitation. same with original pressings, or direct to disc. those are the purest form of analog, not any limitation. the rest is to some degree 'money grab' compromising. still very very good, but not optimal.
I have 1200+ 45's, hundreds of original pressings, and a few hundred DTD's. so plenty of optimal vinyl across the board in genre's. those are the peak sonically and many times creatively too.
Yes, but here you talk about implementations of digital in practice, where there is a lot of misuse. As you say, if a simple approach is taken, rather than with pieces here and there, there is more guarantee that digital can be musically satisfying.
Yet we should not forget that the 'bits and pieces' approach has also given us master pieces, including in the analog days. Strawberry Fields Forever by the Beatles or Good Vibrations by the Beach Boys are examples of such an approach, with successive overdubbing on 4-track tape.
just follow the money. the artist and distribution won't pay for the analog approach. and most pro audio guys now have little appreciation for analog. it's ignorance, not preference.
not my favorite cuts, not that I don't like them. multi-track in and of itself is not the problem. it's what it spawned. Lennon and McCartney or Brian Wilson brought enough musically to the table to execute the process and make musical magic. much the exception, unfortunately.
Good night Al.
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