Ron’s New System

Just for fun last night I removed the new production Tung Sol 6SN7GTBs and put in NOS RCAs.

(In this MastersounD PF100 one 6SN7 must function as the input and two must function as the driver for each pair of 845s.)

The first time I turned the amplifiers on last night after installing the RCAs there was a soft but audible "pop" from one of the tubes in one of the amplifiers. I have never before noticed an NOS tube giving off a soft "pop" when it first lights up.

When I turned the system on this morning, one of the three tubes in that same amplifier gave off a soft "pop" in the same way as last night upon power up.

Does this suggest the tube is defective and I should pull out the trio of RCAs from that particular amplifier? Obviously I do not want to take any risk at all of damage to the amplifier. The amplifier weighs 120 pounds, and Italy is far away.
 
Ron Resnick said:
Just for fun last night I removed the new production Tung Sol 6SN7GTBs and put in NOS RCAs.

(In this MastersounD PF100 one 6SN7 must function as the input and two must function as the driver for each pair of 845s.)

The first time I turned the amplifiers on last night after installing the RCAs there was a soft but audible "pop" from one of the tubes in one of the amplifiers. I have never before noticed an NOS tube giving off a soft "pop" when it first lights up.

When I turned the system on this morning, one of the three tubes in that same amplifier gave off a soft "pop" in the same way as last night upon power up.

Does this suggest the tube is defective and I should pull out the trio of RCAs from that particular amplifier? Obviously I do not want to take any risk at all of damage to the amplifier. The amplifier weighs 120 pounds, and Italy is far away.
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Did you play music through them to see if there was sound?
 
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morricab said:
Did you play music through them to see if there was sound?
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Yes, they play fine. No anomalies when actually operating and playing music.

But they don't seem to smooth out/roll off the edginess. I'm surprised about this.

Although it was Phil, 213Cobra, who said that Sylvania brown bases (while unpredictable year by year) are in general smoother/more rolled off than RCAs. This is inconsistent with everything I read about RCA versus Sylvania 6SN7s, but Phil might be correct.
 
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Oooh! I just found a pair of 5692 RCA red bases. I'm going to try them in the input positions.

I just found out the stock Psvanes I have are 845Bs. I assume this is the cheapest, entry-level Psvane 845.
 
AudioLibertarian said:
Least expensive they might be, but these are thoroughly tested at the factory in Italy. Pretty decent tubes actually.
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Do you think Thomas Mayer's Elrog 845 would be more or less pronounced in the upper midrange/lower treble than Psvane 845B?
 
Ron Resnick said:
Do you think Thomas Mayer's Elrog 845 would be more or less pronounced in the upper midrange/lower treble than Psvane 845B?
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I have never tried those T Mayer tubes in my amps, only Psvane premuim 845 from Grant Fidelity in Canada in other audiophile's PFF-100, and those were indeed "better " sounding than the factory Shuguangs, however as I ve no idea how reliable those PSvane might be. PSvane Acme Premium are supposed to be quite competitive with T Mayer's. I have had experience with 4 sets of PFF-100 over the last 17 years, from various production periods, plus few VAIC units OEM by the Mastersound, and your set is the first one that has been having those issues with treble.

I will try to ask my dealer who knows these amps inside out and has modified few of them with the upgraded parts, what the causes could be. Will post here if he replies.
 
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AudioLibertarian said:
I have never tried those T Mayer tubes in my amps, only Psvane premuim 845 from Grant Fidelity in Canada in other audiophile's PFF-100, and those were indeed "better " sounding than the factory Shuguangs, however as I ve no idea how reliable those PSvane might be. PSvane Acme Premium are supposed to be quite comptetetive with T Mayer's. I have had experience with 4 sets of PFF-100 over the last 17 years, from various production periods, plus few VAIC units OEM by the Mastersound, and your set is the first one that has been having those issues with treble.

I will try to ask my dealer who knows these amps inside out and has modified few of them with the upgraded parts, what the causes could be. Will post here if he replies.
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Thank you!
 
AudioLibertarian said:
My dealer has replied and his recommendation was to try red base RCA NOS 5692 in place of the Tung Sols. So I guess all great minds think alike :)
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Cool!

RCA 5692 red base in all three (input plus drivers)?

At this moment I have RCA 6SN7GTB short bottle side getters in the driver positions, and I just put RCA 5692 red bases (I took them out of the Io) in the input positions.

Thank you!
 
Ron Resnick said:
Yes, they play fine. No anomalies when actually operating and playing music.

But they don't seem to smooth out/roll off the edginess. I'm surprised about this.

Although it was Phil, 213Cobra, who said that Sylvania brown bases (while unpredictable year by year) are in general smoother/more rolled off than RCAs. This is inconsistent with everything I read about RCA versus Sylvania 6SN7s, but Phil might be correct.
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I don’t like the sound of the RCA red basses (I think we are talking about 5692s, right?) as they are pretty dark sounding to me. The VT231 Sylvania are not rolled off sounding. It sounds to me like Phil got some wires crossed. That said, VT231 Sylvanias should not sound edgy.

So, either the amps need more break in, but you should hear progressive changes through the break in period, or, for whatever reason, the MasterSound amps struggle with your Clarisys speakers.
 
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morricab said:
I don’t like the sound of the RCA red basses (I think we are talking about 5692s, right?) as they are pretty dark sounding to me.
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One audiophile's "dark" is another audiophile's "perfect.":)

morricab said:
So, either the amps need more break in, but you should hear progressive changes through the break in period, or, for whatever reason, the MasterSound amps struggle with your Clarisys speakers.
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I think I'm about at 90 hours. It's definitely heading in the right direction.

I hear, and Don hears, and I think Phil hears, the Italians are sounding a little more powerful on the speakers than the JA100s.
 
Ron Resnick said:
I hear, and Don hears, and I think Phil hears, the Italians are sounding a little more powerful on the speakers than the JA100s.
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Ron, how does “sounding a little more powerful” translate into what you hear from your favorite girl with guitar recordings? I’m trying to understand how the Italian amplifiers make the music sound?
 
Would anybody like to buy a pair of mint condition Jadis JA100s with sets of rare Yugoslavia EI KT90s?
 
PeterA said:
Ron, how does “sounding a little more powerful” translate into what you hear from your favorite girl with guitar recordings? I’m trying to understand how the Italian amplifiers make the music sound?
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I don't think the "sounding a little more powerful" affects girl with guitar. I hear it on big classical.

I think the Italians are a bit more transparent, a bit more resolving, a bit more extended in the treble. I think I hear on solo vocals something that I want to call slightly greater "purity." Is this the PSET versus push-pull? But I would not bet money on this, because I may just be getting entranced from looking at those DHTs.

The Italians sound more "professional," more like "big boy" amps -- although I appreciate that it's hard to know what I mean by that.

At this stage of break in the Frenchies have a warmer tonal balance, and sound fuller overall. But this is the raison d'être of Jadis -- the musicality and the sonic charm. I don't expect the Italians ever to catch up to even on those particular sonic parameters.

In summary, on girl with guitar, the Italians do a slightly better job of making me believe that there's somebody live singing to me in my room. At the end of the day that is my sole voting issue. Despite the present edginess/brightness issue (which is completely absent with Jadis) presently something is pulling on me to keep the Italians.

For the record, the favorite iteration of the system so far of Don and of and of David Blumenstein and of Jim Yager and of Pat and of Pat's girlfriend had Jadis driving the midrange/tweeter.

I think the aesthetic design of the amp is beautiful (as audio components go). It still puzzles me why this is the only 845 x 4 PSET in the world.
 
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Ron Resnick said:
I don't think the "sounding a little more powerful" affects girl with guitar. I hear it on big classical.

I think the Italians are a bit more transparent, a bit more resolving, a bit more extended in the treble. I think I hear on solo vocals something that I want to call slightly greater "purity." Is this the PSET versus push-pull? But I would not bet money on this, because I may just be getting entranced from looking at those DHTs.

The Italians sound more "professional," more like "big boy" amps -- although I appreciate that it's hard to know what I mean by that.

At this stage of break in the Frenchies have a warmer tonal balance, and sound fuller overall. But this is the raison d'être of Jadis -- the musicality and the sonic charm. I don't expect the Italians ever to catch up to even on those particular sonic parameters.

In summary, on girl with guitar, the Italians do a slightly better job of making me believe that there's somebody live singing to me in my room. At the end of the day that is my sole voting issue. Despite the present edginess/brightness issue (which is completely absent with Jadis) presently something is pulling on me to keep the Italians.

For the record, the favorite iteration of the system so far of Don and of and of David Blumenstein and of Jim Yager and of Pat and of Pat's girlfriend had Jadis driving the midrange/tweeter.

I think the aesthetic design of the amp is beautiful (as audio components go). It still puzzles me why this is the only 845 x 4 PSET in the world.
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This is a much more detailed response to the sonic differences the mirror earlier simple statement.

So are you saying that one configuration is the Jadis on the mid range and tweeter and the Italian amp on the woofer?

Are you conflating brightness with more detail and resolution?
 
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