Ron's Speaker, Turntable, Power and Room Treatment Upgrades

[Hi-FiGuy]

Hardwood floor finishers use the sawdust from the floor they are laying, mixed with glue to fill joints and get the right color. Hopefully your wood guys are using that technique.

And while I love black walnut, I must admit I was a little skeptical of your choice for the walls if the goal was acoustics. Particularly with your open floorplan and high ceilings. In my own home I’d love to have some absorption on the upper walls where the room has high ceilings. Hardwood floors, granite surfaces, lots of glass—when we throw my wife’s office Christmas party and put 50+ people in the house it gets incredibly loud. Something to reduce the echos would be great. Personally, I am pretty fond of the fabric + track system. You can hid absorptive layer behind the fabric, and fabric choices mean you can design to suit traditional, transitional, or contemporary. And, like with paint, you can make a change pretty easily. What goes behind the fabric is up to you and your acoustician. Besides the blue jeans insulation and noise-out behind the sheetrock, in my case behind the fabric are essentially custom BAD panels. I think in my room that keeps the sound from being over-damped.

I hope you get it sorted Ron, you deserve to be in your home, enjoying music and the view.

I agree with this to a point. In my "Old Kentucky Home" we had a family room that the ceiling went all the way up to the second floor + attic height, all the way to the roof. Think Steves house before he added a second floor for his listening room. In our room it was difficult for even two people the have a conversation let alone watch a TV or more than two people conversating.

I also agree with Ron in that you need to find the liveliness balance.

Ron and I both like panels and I routinely see most people over damp a room with panel speakers and that kills their purpose entirely. Makes me wonder why they didn't buy box speakers in the first place.

 

[Bobvin]

Liveliness balance, I agree. I’ve only had a single visit to Mike L’s place, and was not in critical analysis mode — just there to hear the Etsuro and enjoy Mike’s spectacular rig. Perhaps I’ll enjoy another visit and pay some attention to differences in liveliness vs my own room.

There is also another aspect of a room, equally important now that I’ve experienced it — and that is the “feel” of a room. i was struck when Bonnie described wanting to create a room that feels good. My wife loves to be in the listening room, not always for the music, but for the calm peacefulness of the space. You notice it immediately upon entering, and the Portland Audio Club members often comment on the overall feel of the room, besides the sound.

 

[Ron Resnick]

Subjectively, just as a matter of "feel," I also like damped rooms, because they seem to me to be quiet and peaceful and relaxing. I'm just not sure there is a one to one identity between that calm feeling and the acoustics I want in the room for the stereo.

 

[PeterA]

Subjectively, just as a matter of "feel," I also like damped rooms, because they seem to me to be quiet and peaceful and relaxing. I'm just not sure there is a one to one identity between that calm feeling and the acoustics I want in the room for the stereo.

Ron, what did ddk's voice sound like in your empty room? How did you assess the relative damped/live sound of the room? I assume it was by talking to each other as you walked around. Is a "hand clap" even valid for such an evaluation?

 

[Bobvin]

If you are hearing all the cues of the acoustic environment (that are in the recording) then does the extra energy of a lively room add to or subtract from that?

I suppose there are some who’d say my room is (over?) damped, but when listening I’ve not had anyone say so. I am going to imagine, not having heard Steve’s room (yet) but knowing he has acoustically lined curtains along the walls, our rooms probably share a similar acoustic. (Bonnie, SoundSense)

Not putting anyone on the spot—but is Steve’s room considered over-damped?

 

[PeterA]

If you are hearing all the cues of the acoustic environment (that are in the recording) then does the extra energy of a lively room add to or subtract from that?

Bob, that is the question, IMO. But, it reminds me of that other thread which asks if we can ever know what is on the recording. How do we know if we are hearing all the cues of the acoustic environment that are on the recording? We can only judge if we hear more or less with various changes we make. If we keep hearing more, and they sound real, then it would seem we are moving in the right direction. But I don't think we can know if we hear them all. Perhaps someone who was at the recording session might know, assuming he knows if they were captured in the first place.

I think a good indication of progress is that we hear more ambient cues, and that recordings sound more distinct from each other, as we move along with changes.

 

[Ron Resnick]

Ron, what did ddk's voice sound like in your empty room? How did you assess the relative damped/live sound of the room? I assume it was by talking to each other as you walked around. Is a "hand clap" even valid for such an evaluation?

I don't know what David's voice sounds like well enough to be able to evaluate the room with David's voice.

I did not find the room as it currently is to be over-damped, but David thought it was on the verge of being over-damped. Other than carpet with regular carpet pad underneath, David advised against additional absorption treatments at this time.

 

[Lagonda]

I don't know what David's voice sounds like well enough to be able to evaluate the room with David's voice.

I did not find the room as it currently is to be over-damped, but David thought it was on the verge of being over-damped. Other than carpet with regular carpet pad underneath, David advised against additional absorption treatments at this time.

Did you follow his voice into the
light ? And did you wake up next
morning with a strange desire to
buy Lamm amps, like Tango ?

 

[Ron Resnick]

Did you follow his voice into the
light ? And did you wake up next
morning with a strange desire to
buy Lamm amps, like Tango ?

Vladimir does not believe in high power, all-tube, push-pull topology.

Lamm ML3s were always the right answer for Tang.

 

[Lagonda]

Vladimir does not believe in high power, all-tube, push-pull topology.

Lamm ML3s were always the right answer for Tang.

But Ron, does Lamm not make a nice
hybrid amp that would fit your
requirements ?

 

[Ron Resnick]

But Ron, does Lamm not make a nice
hybrid amp that would fit your
requirements ?

It sure does, and I am a huge fan of those hybrid amps. Lamm M2.2, along with the Aesthetix Atlas Mono Eclipse, are my standard recommendations for Magnepans (if someone does not want or can't afford ARC Ref750 or VTL Siegfried II), Apogees, YGs and MBLs.

but I prefer all-tube for my non-woofer (200 Hz and up) application.

 

[Lagonda]

It sure does, and I am a huge fan of those hybrid amps. Lamm M2.2, along with the Aesthetix Atlas Mono Eclipse, are my standard recommendations for Magnepans (if someone does not want or can't afford ARC Ref750 or VTL Siegfried II), Apogees, YGs and MBLs.

but I prefer all-tube for my non-woofer (200 Hz and up) application.

I am getting my Io back from Aesthetix tomorrow and hope
the all tube preamp/phono will
be a good match for the MBL 9011
amps.

 

[Joe Whip]

When you choose wood for walls and ceilings you are going to have this issue. We have two intricate wooden ceilings in the house and two wooden walls so I know. We have one ship lap wall in the master bath as an accent wall. It fit like a glove when installed in the fall but in the winter with dry interior air, not so much. When the humidity returns in the late spring bingo, it expands and fits perfectly nice again. I realize that we have more humidity here back east, but not much you can really do about it with wood. Just have to live with it or use other materials.

 

[Kcin]

I am getting my Io back from Aesthetix tomorrow and hope
the all tube preamp/phono will
be a good match for the MBL 9011
amps.

Congratulations.... it will be painful for about 400 hrs. It will get better after 100 or so but needs 400 hrs.

Let us know how you make out. Granite audio RIAA break in CD may be a good idea.

 

[Lagonda]

Congratulations.... it will be painful for about 400 hrs. It will get better after 100 or so but needs 400 hrs.

Let us know how you make out. Granite audio RIAA break in CD may be a good idea.

Painful ? Oh shit
Thank you for the tip !

 

[christoph]

I am getting my Io back from Aesthetix tomorrow and hope
the all tube preamp/phono will
be a good match for the MBL 9011
amps.

Finally
After how long?

 

[Lagonda]

Finally
After how long?

A little over 6 months
I just hope it never breaks again. I had all upgrades done, and a phono
stage can’t get homesick for
America

 

[christoph]

A little over 6 months
I just hope it never breaks again. I had all upgrades done, and a phono
stage can’t get homesick for
America

That is really horrible
I keep my fingers crossed for you!
Sorry Ron for this OT insertion

 

[Lagonda]

Congratulations.... it will be painful for about 400 hrs. It will get better after 100 or so but needs 400 hrs.

Let us know how you make out. Granite audio RIAA break in CD may be a good idea.

It’s been running for a couple of hours now and sounds great already.
Maybe because i had no capacitors
changed.

 

[Folsom]