Should Audiophile Power Cords Be UL-Listed?

[Ron Resnick]

Should audiophile power cords be listed with Underwriters Laboratories?

Are most audiophile power cords UL listed or not?

Which ones are UL-listed and which ones are not UL-listed?

Do we care if a power cord is UL-listed?

Should we care?

 

[Bruce B]

Well if not, then most municipalities will not allow them per code. What happens if there is a fire and insurance denies the claim?

I made sure my audiophile in-wall cable was UL listed.... otherwise it would not have passed inspection!

 

[Mike Lavigne]

i use 12 Absolute Fidelity power cords; none of which are UL listed. they are delicate and not meant to be stepped on. and that is essentially what UL Listed is about; step-on ability.

my 2 Evolution Acoustics TRPC's (triple run power cords) you could drive a truck over and not hurt. OTOH unlikely they went to the trouble of UL listing them.

in my completely dedicated room (and building) with zero casual activity (no kids or pets) i have no issue with using delicate power cords. no one will be stepping on them. maybe in Beverly Hills the tourists could complicate things.

agree technically i'm exposed without the UL listing. i also removed the (noisy) GFI switches from my power grid circuits in my Equi=tech which could be considered not code. i accept these risks.

i would not run a heater, refrigerator, or other home appliance without the UL Listing; but audio is mainly quite low voltage stuff......even my amplifiers. and my Equi=tech does protect things especially well from outside surges.

YMMV.

 

[microstrip]

Should audiophile power cords be listed with Underwriters Laboratories?

Are most audiophile power cords UL listed or not?

Which ones are UL-listed and which ones are not UL-listed?

Do we care if a power cord is UL-listed?

Should we care?

The answer will depend a lot on local, due to regulations, and technical common sense - if some one needs to ask it, most probably the answer he should be given should be "do not use non UL listed power cables". ...

 

[microstrip]

(...) agree technically i'm exposed without the UL listing. i also removed the (noisy) GFI switches from my power grid circuits in my Equi=tech which could be considered not code. i accept these risks.

i would not run a heater, refrigerator, or other home appliance without the UL Listing; but audio is mainly quite low voltage stuff......even my amplifiers. and my Equi=tech does protect things especially well from outside surges.

YMMV.

Mike,

IMHO removing the GFI switches from a 10 kW balancing transformer is a very serious risk - I think our readers should know about it.

And no, sorry but your audio is not low voltage stuff ... Remember your Equi=tech protects the equipment, not thepeople!

 

[Al M.]

Well if not, then most municipalities will not allow them per code. What happens if there is a fire and insurance denies the claim?

I made sure my audiophile in-wall cable was UL listed.... otherwise it would not have passed inspection!

Well good to know. Another reason not to use audiophile power chords. I don't have any in my system.

 

[DonH50]

UL certification is about a lot more than "stepability". Flexibility and resistance to abrasion is part of it, but so is insulation voltage rating, fire resistance and behavior, resistance to chemical/liquid attack, etc. People love to disparage standards but sometimes they are actually pretty good and useful things to have.

 

[microstrip]

Well good to know. Another reason not to use audiophile power chords. I don't have any in my system.

The great majority of audiophile power cords are certified to obey the regulations. IMHO those which are not are exceptions.

BTW, even swapping normal use certified power cables will have a sonic effect in our systems - price is not an excuse to not try it.

 

[ack]

The great majority of audiophile power cords are certified to obey the regulations.

Really? Can you name a few?

 

[microstrip]

Really? Can you name a few?

Shunyata, Nordost, Transparent Audio, Kimber, Audioquest, Cardas, ...

 

[Johnny Vinyl]

Would there be insurance issues without either a UL or CSA ( Canadian Standards Association) imprint?

 

[Mike Lavigne]

Mike,

IMHO removing the GFI switches from a 10 kW balancing transformer is a very serious risk - I think our readers should know about it.

my General Contractor who installed my Equi=tech agreed to remove the GFI's for 3 reasons; (1) no sink or water in the room, (2) it's a dedicated studio/listening space and not a general use area, and (3) there are separate outlets with GFI's in the room for use for any sort of tools or items that would have cords being moved around.

this does not make his decision right; but it was good enough for me.

i've never seen GFI's on any dedicated lines in any system. but maybe everyone uses them unbeknownst to me.

And no, sorry but your audio is not low voltage stuff ... Remember your Equi=tech protects the equipment, not thepeople!

i respect that my approach is not right for everyone else. which is why i added the YMMV.

 

[ack]

Shunyata, Nordost, Transparent Audio, Kimber, Audioquest, Cardas, ...

I specifically checked my Shunyata before responding to you, and I see no UL Listing; neither does their website say anything about that. So where did you get that information? I also just checked Transparent and MIT

 

[Bruce B]

Would there be insurance issues without either a UL or CSA ( Canadian Standards Association) imprint?

You better believe it. Insurance companies will find any loophole to get out of claim!

 

[sefischer1]

You better believe it. Insurance companies will find any loophole to get out of claim!

This assumes that an investigation determined that a power chord was the source of a fire. I had an audiophile power chord which became alarmingly hot at the connector at the amplifier end. I sent it back to the manufacturer and they promptly repaired it. For this reason it's probably a good idea to have access to all connectors and wall warts so they can be routinely examined for excessive heat. Such heating can be caused by a loosened or compromised connection due to oxidation, etc. Wall warts are often switching devices with no transformer, and as such are directly connected to the AC, making them vulnerable. Hopefully, most wall warts are certified and designed for fail safe operation and failure modes. In other words, if an internal component fails, it fails open and not shorted.

 

[DonH50]

We've had several bad power cables at work and the problem was internal crimps were not done properly causing them to overheat (and melt, in one case, a little scary). Company got a run of bad power cords... Vexing to find on a half-million dollar piece of test equipment.

I have limited experience with insurance and power cords. Unless the power cord causes a fire chances are nobody will say anything as it's irrelevant. But see above...

 

[Speedskater]

i use 12 Absolute Fidelity power cords; none of which are UL listed. they are delicate and not meant to be stepped on. and that is essentially what UL Listed is about; step-on ability.

The UL Standard 817 which is only about line cords is 180 pages long. That's a whole lot more than just being stepped on.

Any and all audiophile products sold should meet all the required safety standards.

 

[microstrip]

I specifically checked my Shunyata before responding to you, and I see no UL Listing; neither does their website say anything about that. So where did you get that information? I also just checked Transparent and MIT

I am referring to CE certification that is considered more rigorous than UL - the cables that are sold in Europe must go through this certification. I named those who here come with a certificate and a label in the box. The CE label states the cables meet European health, safety and environmental standards.

 

[Ron Resnick]

I think that the absence of a UL listing is not an issue as long as it is an intermediate power conductor and not the wire going into the wall. For example, if you use a non-UL listed power cord from your component into a power conditioner or a regenerator then that intermediate connecting power cord does not have to be UL listed. (Of course I am assuming here that the power conditioner or regenerator itself is UL listed.)

 

[Speedskater]

I think that the absence of a UL listing is not an issue as long as it is an intermediate power conductor and not the wire going into the wall. For example, if you use a non-UL listed power cord from your component into a power conditioner or a regenerator then that intermediate connecting power cord does not have to be UL listed. (Of course I am assuming here that the power conditioner or regenerator itself is UL listed.)

I think that 'UL' and others responsible for safety have the opposite view-point.