Sme 3012 R

I know this old arm is good but I don’t know why David,Rockitman,Tang,Ron,Mike
Use or will use having top tonearm like Sat,EliteAxiom,Black Beauty,Durand

Why 3012 is so special?
I never had and I don’t understand
Only to know for my curiosity
Regards
Gian

 

It’s to set the tracking force. You first balance the tonearm with the cartridge using the large counterweight and once balanced you move the small weight on the side to the desired force. It’s really quite accurate and you don’t need a scale anymore.

david

Yes, but that is a secondary and convenient function. It is necessary as I explained above to ensure the pressure of the knife edge is properly distributed across the saddle, not only because of the tonearm’s J-shape but also because the vertical rotation axis is not parallel to the headshell offset angle. An additional minor downside to the latter is that any change in vertical position of the stylus results in a change in azimuth, such as when tracking a warped disc or playing discs of different thicknesses. This minor disadvantage is not shared by the SME V and all it’s relatives.

 

I appreciate you sharing you knowledge of the history of these arms. I have a few questions: why did SME discontinue the 3xxx Series I/II arms if they were selling in the hundreds of thousands? and do you have any idea why their Model 20/30 turntables with the suspension towers were not designed to accommodate the 3xxx series arms? The rear right suspension tower is too close to the platter to provide enough clearance for the 3xxx counter weight. Seems strange. Do you know if the 3012R counterweight can be modified by cutting the extension/support rod shorter and using a heavier weight. I think if one could shave just 3/8" off the length behind the pivot point, it would clear the suspension tower. We discussed this length issue before, but I have forgotten the exact distances required. Then one could do a proper comparison between the V-12 and 3012R on the bigger SME turntables.

I have no idea why Peter, the only thing I know that it happened at a very low point in tt sales, it’s like Porsche killing the 911. No you can’t modify the arm that way.

david

 

Yes, but that is a secondary and convenient function. It is necessary as I explained above to ensure the pressure of the knife edge is properly distributed across the saddle.

You might be right about it’s design but it’s function is setting the tracking force, that’s what it’s always been there for and the only thing ever mentioned in the manual going back to Series 1.

david

 

Life is short guys forget all this bs and speculation there’s nothing to figure out, stick any cartridge you want in there, set it up correctly and sit back and listen; all will be clear !

david

 

Life is short guys forget all this bs and speculation there’s nothing to figure out, stick any cartridge you want in there, set it up correctly and sit back and listen; all will be clear !

david

Good point David

I think the only take away is the 3012r is not quite the same as the earlier models, and is contemporaneous with the V, not a much earlier model

 

Life is short guys forget all this bs and speculation there’s nothing to figure out, stick any cartridge you want in there, set it up correctly and sit back and listen; all will be clear !

david

David,

What is your opinion about the SME 3009 R?

 

Life is short guys forget all this bs and speculation there’s nothing to figure out, stick any cartridge you want in there, set it up correctly and sit back and listen; all will be clear !

david

David is so damn right. Life is too short.
Get the EMT 927 too and you will know how audio gears can disappear and only music sings.

I am listening to Belafonte's Take My Mother Home on 927 with vintage Ortofon right now and get watery eyes with this song. David said the 3012R is better than the Ortofon in various aspects.

Kind regards,
Tang

 

David,

What is your opinion about the SME 3009 R?

Still excellent, 70% - 75% of the 3012-r, same sound characteristic but falls short of the overall authority of the big arm. You could say it’s a lighter weight 3012-r
david

 

Hello everyone, interesting thread i must say.
i had the SME 2M 12R but as i can tell from what mr DDK is saying, its not in the same league as the 3012R..
i saw a lot of different prices going on....
what you believe is a decent price to buy a good condition 3012R with all original part etc?
thank you.
A

 

Hello everyone, interesting thread i must say.
i had the SME 2M 12R but as i can tell from what mr DDK is saying, its not in the same league as the 3012R..
i saw a lot of different prices going on....
what you believe is a decent price to buy a good condition 3012R with all original part etc?
thank you.
A

Hi byrdparis,
I found the M2 rather lifeless in comparison and on the dark side of things. These days I’m paying from $2200-$3000 for mint copies, depending on condition and what’s included but prices in your market may vary depending on availability and desirability.

david

 

Hi byrdparis,
I found the M2 rather lifeless in comparison and on the dark side of things. These days I’m paying from $2200-$3000 for mint copies, depending on condition and what’s included but prices in your market may vary depending on availability and desirability.

david

much appriciates your reply and help.
thank you!

do you by any chance got the opportunity to sample the SAEC 506 vs the 3012?
any thoughts, in general on the SAEC or in compare?
thank you!

 

much appriciates your reply and help.
thank you!

do you by any chance got the opportunity to sample the SAEC 506 vs the 3012?
any thoughts, in general on the SAEC or in compare?
thank you!

I have the SAEC 506/30 and 308L too, both are very good arms but they fall short of the 3012-r in one key area, the bass and they don’t reproduce space as naturally either but that could be difference between DIN & RCA jacks affecting that.

david

 

Hello everyone, interesting thread i must say.
i had the SME 2M 12R but as i can tell from what mr DDK is saying, its not in the same league as the 3012R..
i saw a lot of different prices going on....
what you believe is a decent price to buy a good condition 3012R with all original part etc?
thank you.
A

The going rate on ebay seems to be around $3000 USD.

 

thanks guys!

David, thanks again for your insight about those arms.

anyone ever had the chance to compare the Ikeda 407 to the SAEC 506?

 

The going rate on ebay seems to be around $3000 USD.

Perhaps it also reflects the strong euro - I got my 3012R's from european countries. Germany was the cheapest country to get them and they do not show in US eBay - you have to go to eBay.de . I was tempted to bid in the last one - a gorgeous looking all black specimen - but resisted!

 

My friend Tom usually has good selection of 3012R's

http://www.topclassaudio.com/web/eng/used_product_search.jsp

BruceD

 

My SME3012R was NOS Came in an unopened box. Cost me $4400 and worth every penny. I think it was found in Germany

 

My friend Tom usually has good selection of 3012R's

http://www.topclassaudio.com/web/eng/used_product_search.jsp

BruceD

Hmmm--no access--anyway the site itself .com is OK-- he usually has good selection I've dealt with him seems straight shooter-- got to be in that picky market there!

Only two current but I've seen NOS ones in original boxes there--

BruceD

 

Sealed NOS audio are collectible. The best I have seen was an auction of a pair of sealed QUAD II tube amplifiers illustrated by X-ray images of the contents with a certificate of a traceable radiologist! It was sold for many thousand usd in a crazy auction.

Fortunately the 3012's I got were well cared, but used. Can you imagine how long will take a stainless steel armwand to burn-in?

 

The best I have seen was an auction of a pair of sealed QUAD II tube amplifiers illustrated by X-ray images of the contents with a certificate of a traceable radiologist!

Well just goes to show there is always something that comes outa left field in this game-- Micro- the Cigar!--that takes the cake

My Doc mate has just such a machine--I'll hit him up next time I find some still sealed NOS stock--!

BruceD