Sme 3012 R

I know this old arm is good but I don’t know why David,Rockitman,Tang,Ron,Mike
Use or will use having top tonearm like Sat,EliteAxiom,Black Beauty,Durand

Why 3012 is so special?
I never had and I don’t understand
Only to know for my curiosity
Regards
Gian
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Comments

awsmone

Active Member
Apr 7, 2014
1,107
18
38
Canberra Australia
#21
to get the history right the sme V was developed starting in 1982
the 3012R which is different from the series I and II 3012, was developed predominantly for Japanese market in 1981, it had steel arm tube, like series I and not II, and different effective length and mass, and a detachable headshell

so there not different much in time,

the reason for the V, was because of newer MC, in ARA words:
By 1982, with the sudden burst in popularity of the moving-coil cartridge with lower compliances and higher tracking forces, AR-A recalls that, 'cartridge developments precluded a "one size fits all" philosophy. For the next four years, we developed the Series V, an arm of extraordinarily structural integrity dictated to the needs of medium and low compliance moving coils.

This was not because of mechanical superiority, but going in different direction, of not one size fits all
 

awsmone

Active Member
Apr 7, 2014
1,107
18
38
Canberra Australia
#22
Many hundreds of SME 30's and thousands of SME V's are daily playing in great systems. We can not expect them to match every system, but a few of the best sounding systems I know about in my country have SME turntables. However the competition is really hard, there are many brands of excellent turntables that currently represent great value for money. WBF is a an extremely small niche of enthusiastic and knowledgeable people, but IMHO we can not extrapolate from our group findings.
just to be clear Gian/DDK are talking about 3012R, this is different from 3012 series 1 and 2, and developed much later
 
May 30, 2010
14,248
126
63
Portugal
#24
to get the history right the sme V was developed starting in 1982
the 3012R which is different from the series I and II 3012, was developed predominantly for Japanese market in 1981, it had steel arm tube, like series I and not II, and different effective length and mass, and a detachable headshell
We should not for forget the counterweight decoupler, that allows horizontal balance adjustment. It is the easiest way to spot a "R" version. One of the SME3012R's I managed to get was advertised as SME3012, I only spot it in the picture because of this accessory. Unfortunately it was also one of the most expensive, I also had to buy the turntable ...

I have seen 3009R and 3012R advertised in sales at eBay, but I never saw an auction for a 3010R.
 

Attachments

awsmone

Active Member
Apr 7, 2014
1,107
18
38
Canberra Australia
#25
I'm curious about the comparison of the 3012...old vs modern.
3012 series I steel arm tube all precision machined
3012 series II aluminium arm tube, different factory i believe and tooling

3012R thin steel tube similar to series I, but my understanding is they no longer had series I tooling, this was supposed to be 1980s homage to series I
Different length, and mass to series I and II 3012: the 3012R increased the length to 308.8 mm and effective mass to 14g
 

ddk

Industry Expert
May 19, 2013
3,525
42
48
Utah
#26
So Steve mouthed off and is responsible for the exorbitant prices we now have to pay, David kept quiet all these years ;)
Well, it’s Steve’s fault not because he mouthed off but for creating a great forum with such wide reach :)!

david
 

Tango

VIP/Donor
Mar 12, 2017
2,050
239
63
Bangkok
#27
everything is there Tang.
Thank you Christian. I think we are on the same wave length on some aspects of sound we lately have been hearing, although our gears are different. This confirm my decision choosing this arm for carts I intend to use.

Tang
 

awsmone

Active Member
Apr 7, 2014
1,107
18
38
Canberra Australia
#28
Well, it’s Steve’s fault not because he mouthed off but for creating a great forum with such wide reach :)!

david
He he

On a serious note....your right David, there is amazing information on this forum, I find I trust this site more than any Hifi ezine now
 
Last edited:

ddk

Industry Expert
May 19, 2013
3,525
42
48
Utah
#29
I still don't believe that SME would drop the 3012 and then start making inferior arms with no connections between the headshell/arm.
Actually that's not the case at all, as Awsmone pointed out the 3012-r and IV/V are contemporary to one another and the IV/V weren't SME's first fixed headshell arms. The ignorants in Western audio press were knocking the bayonet mount and knife edge bearing in favor of fixed headshell and tight bearing designs for years so to appease them SME made a fixed headshell version of 3XXX Series II arm which few bought and then there was the dreaded Series III prior to the IV/V arms. 3XXX-R series continued until early 2000's, lowest point of turntable sales, when they came up with the M series and then later with the M-R version which is basically the same arm tube/bayonet mount/headshell of the 3XXX-r series transplanted the M gimbal bearing because of demand. The 3xxx Series I/II and II Improved arms sold in hundreds of thousands when they killed it and now they only offer their arms with silver wiring :D! Even successful companies make bad choices when in trouble, remember Apple Performa?

david

(Edit) PS. Bruce, you're welcome to bring your V12 over for a side by side listening sessions, the two arms are very different and share no family DNA.
 
Last edited:

rockitman

Member Sponsor
Sep 20, 2011
6,894
26
48
Northern NY
#30
I recently acquired a 5 gram heavier than stock counterweight for the 3012-R. It allows you to dynamically balance the heavy weight mono spu’s that weigh in excess of 36 grams. Some guy from Australia had them made.
 

ddk

Industry Expert
May 19, 2013
3,525
42
48
Utah
#31
I recently acquired a 7 gram heavier than stock counterweight for the 3012-R. It allows you to dynamically balance the heavy weight mono spu’s that weigh in excess of 36 grams. Some guy from Australia had them made.
Cancel it if you can, the description is misleading, it's the same weight as your stock heavy weight which you already have and his parts don't fit the arm right. There are many aftermarket 3012 parts I've tried most and none of them were any good.

david
 

Stacore

Industry Expert
Feb 23, 2017
429
11
18
Gdańsk, Poland
stacore.pl
#32
Cancel it if you can, the description is misleading, it's the same weight as your stock heavy weight which you already have and his parts don't fit the arm right. There are many aftermarket 3012 parts I've tried most and none of them were any good.

david
I have an aftermarket heavy weight for this wondeful arm and can see how flawed it is but have no choice as finding the original seems impossible. Dave or anyone else could you possibly help?
Thanks,

PS Dave, have you tried the bronze bearings and FD200 damper?
 

ddk

Industry Expert
May 19, 2013
3,525
42
48
Utah
#33
I have an aftermarket heavy weight for this wondeful arm and can see how flawed it is but have no choice as finding the original seems impossible. Dave or anyone else could you possibly help?
Thanks,

PS Dave, have you tried the bronze bearings and FD200 damper?
Call SME they have them.
I have tried the bronze parts, they suck! You loose natural balance of the arm. The FD200 was useful with the Series II and it’s aluminum wand you don’t need it with the R.

david
 

ddk

Industry Expert
May 19, 2013
3,525
42
48
Utah
#36
PS I thought FD was meant to damp the LF arm cart resonance not the arm wand
Isn’t the wand part of the arm? The main difference between Series II & R is the wand, the rest is mostly ergonomic & cosmetic.
david
 

Stacore

Industry Expert
Feb 23, 2017
429
11
18
Gdańsk, Poland
stacore.pl
#37
Of course it is, but the wand resonances are in 100's Hz and up and the arm-cart resonance somewhere 6-12Hz depending on the cart. The paddle cant do anything with the wand resonances but can help damping the arm-cart one.

Cheers,
 

rockitman

Member Sponsor
Sep 20, 2011
6,894
26
48
Northern NY
#38
Cancel it if you can, the description is misleading, it's the same weight as your stock heavy weight which you already have and his parts don't fit the arm right. There are many aftermarket 3012 parts I've tried most and none of them were any good.

david
I weighed both. The one I bought is 5 grams heavier. Useful for that mono spu setup. It's machined to the same quality, gasket and all. I bought the last one I believe.
 

ddk

Industry Expert
May 19, 2013
3,525
42
48
Utah
#40
Of course it is, but the wand resonances are in 100's Hz and up and the arm-cart resonance somewhere 6-12Hz depending on the cart. The paddle cant do anything with the wand resonances but can help damping the arm-cart one.

Cheers,
I know on paper it’s supposed to only affect very low frequencies but sonically it affects mids and highs too, the sound becomes slow and rolled off with steel tube.
david
 

About us

  • What’s Best Forum is THE forum for high end audio, product reviews, advice and sharing experiences on the best of everything else. A place where audiophiles and audio companies discuss existing and new audio products, music servers, music streamers and computer audio, digital to audio convertors (DACS), turntables, phono stages, cartridges, reel to reel, speakers, headphones, tube amplifiers and solid state amplification. Founded in 2010 What's Best Forum invites intelligent and courteous people of all interests and backgrounds to describe and discuss the best of everything. From beginners to life-long hobbyists to industry professionals we enjoy learning about new things and meeting new people and participating in spirited debates.

Quick Navigation

User Menu

Steve Williams
Site Founder | Site Owner | Administrator
Ron Resnick
Site Co-Owner | Administrator
Julian (The Fixer)
Website Build | Marketing Managersing