Tad reference 1

[jbrrp1]

I owned the R1. Tried a heap of amplifiers but the end of the day the loudspeaker was not enjoyable for long listening sessions in my experience. The mids/highs too coarse. Music selection shrank due to some recordings being unlistenable.
I have had a negative opinion of beryllium since and only this year I heard the Beryllium tweeter from Von Schweikert and it changed my opinion again.
they have damped the beryllium (with ceramic I think) and the results are stunning. Have a listen to this tweeter to hear how beryllium can sound realistic whilst presenting a non fatiguing long term listening experience.
When I have the R1 I went away for a weekend, I spent a few days with another speaker which cost $27k. Far less than the R1 and I got much more from it. I promptly sold the R1 and never looked back.
No need to mention the name of the other speaker but to say R1 are competitive up to 400k is a bit of a stretch.

I would absolutely agree that the TAD beryllium drivers are demanding and tough to match well with amplification, but I have found that to be a revelation of the amplification. My CR-1's really sang well with the D'Agostino Momentum S250 + HD preamp. No fatigue, listening sessions that went on all day just absorbed in the music. I think the slightly "warm" sonic palette of the D'Ag gear suits TAD well, and the amp has plenty of drive to keep the woofer up to speed with the mid/tweet.

I have since moved to CH Precision 10 series amplification, and I have to say that these were not immediately natural partners with the TAD. I have since upgraded my system cabling to Elrod Master Diamond throughout and the TAD's are singing like I have never heard from any other stereo that I have experienced. Simply the purest, most natural sounding presentation, very informative, but always pulling me in to every piece, even on crappy recordings. They're incredibly truthful, and that might not be great for some upstream equipment. I think the TAD's won't please those that want a bit of euphony to enrich everything that comes through the system, and I get that. I used to be in that camp for 30+ years. But, IME, sort out the upstream stuff, and the TAD's simply reveal the beauty. In the past year I have started to enjoy fairly unlimited funds to apply to my audio hobby, and I plan to do so. I've been prepared to change speakers, if need be, as I elevate my system. I'm not sure I will be doing that, because the TAD's are holding their own. (OK, with CR-1's I plan to add well-sorted subwoofing, at the very least!)

 

[Flamenko]

I listened in Munich to Tad 700 s with evolution speakers, and the sound seemed too warm. It would probably be more so with cr1tx?

 

[jbrrp1]

I listened in Munich to Tad 700 s with evolution speakers, and the sound seemed too warm. It would probably be more so with cr1tx?

I would be surprised if the CR-1's are warmer sounding than the Evolution One, but I have not heard them in the same system. Interestingly for me, it was hearing the Evolution One in the Zesto Audio room at RMAF that got me looking into TAD and winding up with a pair of CR-1's. The E1 just simply delivered Count Basie big band with so much clarity and heft at the same time that it was ear-opening to me. That system had KT88 tubes driving the speakers, and it did sound warmer than my CR-1's, but I would guess it should! Don't have any experience with TAD's 700's.

 

[Amir]

I owned the R1. Tried a heap of amplifiers but the end of the day the loudspeaker was not enjoyable for long listening sessions in my experience. The mids/highs too coarse. Music selection shrank due to some recordings being unlistenable.
I have had a negative opinion of beryllium since and only this year I heard the Beryllium tweeter from Von Schweikert and it changed my opinion again.
they have damped the beryllium (with ceramic I think) and the results are stunning. Have a listen to this tweeter to hear how beryllium can sound realistic whilst presenting a non fatiguing long term listening experience.
When I have the R1 I went away for a weekend, I spent a few days with another speaker which cost $27k. Far less than the R1 and I got much more from it. I promptly sold the R1 and never looked back.
No need to mention the name of the other speaker but to say R1 are competitive up to 400k is a bit of a stretch.

I think over 95% of audiophiles judge a component (like Speaker) in wrong setup/condition and decide to change their system.

low performance speakers like sonus faber or gryphon are better in wrong setup/condition because those speakers are not transperent.

TAD R1 is very very Real and Transparent , It needs :
- high performance upstream
- high quality AC power
- mid to low RT room
- good speaker placement
- good CD/LP Records

 

[Amir]

I would be surprised if the CR-1's are warmer sounding than the Evolution One, but I have not heard them in the same system. Interestingly for me, it was hearing the Evolution One in the Zesto Audio room at RMAF that got me looking into TAD and winding up with a pair of CR-1's. The E1 just simply delivered Count Basie big band with so much clarity and heft at the same time that it was ear-opening to me. That system had KT88 tubes driving the speakers, and it did sound warmer than my CR-1's, but I would guess it should! Don't have any experience with TAD's 700's.

TAD is not warm
TAD is not cold

TAD is very transparent

 

[Avidlistener]

Regarding Bobbi’s post, TADs are simply not a set it and forget it kind of speaker.

When I got my CR1s 12 years ago there were several shortcomings in the sound, but I knew what was there was the most lifelike sound I heard from a speaker. (I used to hear live acoustic Un amplified music several time a week, so that was my benchmark, not other Hifi rigs)

It took years - better amps (that didn’t exist at the time) and several years of upgrades of the software OS in my Directstream Dac to sound better.

Still something was off (as far a digital) and only the EtherRegen reclocker/galvanic isolation really helped digital to sound natural. Also power conditioning (Niagara 7000) was a big help.

A high precision instrument like an electron microscope will deliver blurry images unless it’s in a proper, vibration free environment with no movement. (My turntable sits on one of these active vibration tables) I feel the TAD (at least the Reference Series) is the same. One weakness or source of distortion and the whole presentation goes out the window.

 

[kimurastanley]

I have listened to TAD evolution and reference series speakers extensively with difference amps such as Accuphase, Nagra classic and HD series, TAD evolution and reference.

IMHO, the magic happens when matched with TAD electronics, which even the costlier Nagra HD pre/power could not deliver. The music flow, balance, engagement are spot on with TAD electronics.

And I have experienced different tweaks such as ground box etc. I found that more tweaks would sway the balance.

 

[kimurastanley]

I should add that personal taste matters too. I know someone who prefers matching with accuphase for coloured warm tone. To me TAD is more truthful to music and I prefer this.

 

[Ron Resnick]

low performance speakers like sonus faber or gryphon are better in wrong setup/condition because those speakers are not transperent.

Generalizations masquerading as fact, rather than as mere personal, subjective preference.

TAD R1 is very very Real and Transparent ,

One audiophile’s “real and transparent” is another audiophile’s analytical and fatiguing.

 

[Amir]

Generalizations masquerading as fact, rather than as mere personal, subjective preference.



One audiophile’s “real and transparent” is another audiophile’s analytical and fatiguing.

Let me explain what "real and Transparent" means:

please read Peter Qvortrup Audio Note UK article about Comparison by Contrast method:

Are You On The Road To... Audio Hell? Article By Leonard Norwitz And Peter Qvortrup

Are You On The Road To... Audio Hell? Article By Leonard Norwitz And Peter Qvortrup

www.enjoythemusic.com

Peter says "transparency" meaning is how your speaker shows you the difference of two records two cables two preamplifiers two dacs and ...
if you test two dacs in your system and you hardly detect the sonic difference then your system is not transparent.
high performance speakers like TAD R1 needs high performance upstream.

I think no high end system is "analytical and fatiguing" and no company designs a "fatiguing" speaker.
the "analytical and fatiguing" sound come from worse system setup :
- Bad AC Power Quality
- wrong AC polarity
- wrong signal polarity
- worse CD/LP Record quality
- worse acoustics
- Acoustic to speaker mismatch
- worse speaker placement
- Bad Amp/Speaker Matching
- ground loops
- components mismatch in both impedance or sound
...

No high End System is "analytical and fatiguing"

 

[Ron Resnick]

Thank you for your reply.

I think you and Peter are selecting subjectively one of our four main objectives of high-end audio, and making the mistake of thinking it is the only valid objective.

If you believe that no high-end system can be found subjectively to be analytical and fatiguing, then I am afraid that further discussion will not yield mutual understanding. But, again, I appreciate your reply.

 

[bonzo75]

One audiophile’s “real and transparent” is another audiophile’s analytical and fatiguing.

Analytical and fatiguing is analytical and fatiguing, and can be colored too.

Nothing to do with real and transparent which is more objective. If changing upstream components shows easy to hear change in sound for everyone, then its transparent. If changing records shows differences in sound easily, that is transparent. Whether this is important to someone or not is a separate question, but it can be easy to show lack of transparency vs transparency..

 

[Mike Lavigne]

Analytical and fatiguing is analytical and fatiguing, and can be colored too.

Nothing to do with real and transparent which is more objective. If changing upstream components shows easy to hear change in sound for everyone, then its transparent. If changing records shows differences in sound easily, that is transparent. Whether this is important to someone or not is a separate question, but it can be easy to show lack of transparency vs transparency..

i think a big issue on this subject is......the.......music.....you.....choose.....to.....play.

a system can be a little over the edge, but your musical choices are limited enough for it not be a problem. progressing past girl with guitar gets painful....and you blame the music. you stay in a comfort zone. and sometimes this is mostly the room, the gear might be good to very good.

hopefully one's hunger to musically explore drives system improvements. and once your mind is open to that musical pursuit and you make system improvements......girl with guitar is better too.

there is no doubt that as my system has improved my musical horizons became unlimited, and that is not an accident. the music can require true fidelity to work. don't blame the music.

 

[Amir]

Many Audiophiles think they know where is the problem but they do not know. They are changing their amplifiers speakers dacs ... every 6 month and finaly the sound is not good. They think the problem is audio components but it is not.


I can show you how speaker placement could affect on sound.
In place A the sound is forward aggressive compress with worse bass.
In Place B the sound is wide, open, dynamic and music has life and energy.
Jim Smith and Bob could tell you more about how speaker placement is important.

I can show you how bad AC quality destroy the sound and how good electricity could change tone, harmonics and emotion of music.

In my 20 years of listening to high end I never seen any harsh/fatiguing/analytical product (even at low prices).

 

[Stef]

I should add that personal taste matters too. I know someone who prefers matching with accuphase for coloured warm tone. To me TAD is more truthful to music and I prefer this.

Fully agree. I also know someone driving the R1 with the flagship preamp & mono blocks from Accuphase. I honestly feel it's a really nice setup as long as you don't benchmark it against the TAD C600 / M700 combo which brings you to the next level of transparency, control and speed

 

[bonzo75]

In my 20 years of listening to high end I never seen any harsh/fatiguing/analytical product even at low prices.

There are many low priced products that are good. Both emotional and transparent

 

[kimurastanley]

Fully agree. I also know someone driving the R1 with the flagship preamp & mono blocks from Accuphase. I honestly feel it's a really nice setup as long as you don't benchmark it against the TAD C600 / M700 combo which brings you to the next level of transparency, control and speed

Totally agree with this. Before I pulled the trigger on M700S, I was comparing accuphase A250 and M700S driving R1, and the rest is history

Below was my impression

New TAD M700 & M700S

That picture is from Singapore (where I am). The R1s are (paradoxically) easier to drive than the CR1s, since the R1s are much more sensitive. Listened to the system in the picture, the R1s are definitely great speakers, very relaxed and powerful sound, with the TAD power amplifier. Like you...

www.whatsbestforum.com

 

[Flamenko]

TAD is not warm
TAD is not cold

TAD is very transparent

...but compared 700s to a Boulder 1160 is probably 'hotter'?

 

[Smokin' Joe]

@fleetowner123

 

[fleetowner123]

@fleetowner123

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