Usb-x

[Rutgar]

Thanks for the update. My USB-X is being shipped on Monday. Any first impressions?

I’m still working out some kinks. Initially, the sound was just ‘so-so’ because I didn't have Amarra correctly configured. But as I learn more about configuring everything (Thanks Michael!), things are beginning to fall more into place.

I love using the iPad as a remote interface. And is one of the biggest reasons I became interested in doing a dedicated music server. Being able to pick and choose songs from any album with just the touch of a finger from your favorite listening chair, is almost too convenient!

 

[cmarin]

Interesting. When you mention 'configuring', are you referring to the apple notebook side of the equation? Guess I'll be doing my share of 'configuring' myself.

Does the USB-X unit require an extended break-in period as well? Thanks.

 

[Rutgar]

Yes, I am refering to the apple and Amarra side of things. I've been a long time PC user and on a Mac, I feel like Scotty on a Klingon ship, trying to find the "Damn anti-matter inducer.'

 

[cmarin]

Same here. Just got an apple macbook pro. Trying to become familiar with kinks. Did you have to go through a lot of trial and error to optimize the configuration for the USB-X?

 

[Rutgar]

No. It was actually pretty straight forward. The first thing you need, is to update your MPS-5 to ver. 021. The owner manuals for both the USB-X, and the MPS-5 together, provides all info you need to accomplish this, via Playback Designs web site.

 

[manjy]

No. It was actually pretty straight forward. The first thing you need, is to update your MPS-5 to ver. 021. The owner manuals for both the USB-X, and the MPS-5 together, provides all info you need to accomplish this, via Playback Designs web site.

Hello,

I use the MPD-5 and wanted to know if there are any sonic improvements with the 021 firmware upragde. I am presently on 019 firmware.

Thanks

 

[tin ear tim]

Copyright issue?

What does Sony say about this? Since they hold the rights to DSD as well as SACD, there's always been a restriction on piping digital DSD to an outboard device. You can send, without violating copyrights, digital DSD from the MPS-5 to the USB-X because they are within the same family (Playback Designs). Sending the DSD signal to a computer via USB from the USB-X seems like you'll be stepping on Sony's toes.

Sony has restricted DSD to within their own digital pipes; the crappy sounding i-Link for audio and recently HDMI 1.2 or higher. All because they have DTCP (digital transmission content protection). The only other work around was to have the interfaces convert DSD to 24 bit PCM.

If it's as simple as a DSD to USB converter, then anyone could rip SACD music. In fact, you could use something like the ESOTERIC D-07 DAC which converts PCM to DSD internally and then pipe that DSD signal to anything, including recorders. (Huge gasp from the people down in Rancho Bernardo or "Sonyland") essentially making SACDs out of all your old red book CD's. Of course you can't make an SACD physical disc but you could put them on couple of terrabyte hard drive.

Can anyone help me here?

 

[docvale]

I ignore the details of the copyright, but I guess that if DSD files are available to be purchased, the thing is legal.

DSD and SACD are not the same thing: DSD is a mastering standard, SACD is a physical format. Pure Music, for example, can stream DSD files through an USB port, but this is not the same as extracting a DSD file from a physical SACD, tweaking a SACD player in order to output the digital signal to an external DAC.
Even if you can stream a DSD file, also, you cannot generate a SACD disc that could be played by a SACD player.

 

[tin ear tim]

Thanks Valerio,

I understand the DSD is a format and SACD is a medium just as PCM is a format and CD is one of the mediums. The only audiophile recorder that I've used regularly that records in DSD is the TASCAM DVRA1000HD. However, you cannot export that DSD file to another device. It records unto DVD-R's which are only playable in the same product.

I continued to read about the USB-X product and I believe I answered my own question. The USB-X is an input device to the MPS-5, not an output. You can stream DSD files from your PC into the MPS-5 and use it as a DAC. However, you cannot stream DSD data off an SACD from the MPS-5 back into your PC. That would be illegal, according to the Sony legal department. I read this thread with interest when an associate in Brasil asked me how the MPS-5 could send the digital DSD stream from the MPS-5 to the PC or music server. Now I can tell him it works the other way. You can stream legitimately purchased DSD files from your PC into the MPS-5's DAC section.

 

[steve williams]

Tim

first off welcome and secondly your assumption re the USB-X is correct

 

[Rutgar]

Hello,

I use the MPD-5 and wanted to know if there are any sonic improvements with the 021 firmware upragde. I am presently on 019 firmware.

Thanks

Not that I can tell. But according to the manual, you must have 021 to use the USB-X. So possibly, it is specifically to support this unit. Jonathan?

 

[amirm]

What does Sony say about this? Since they hold the rights to DSD as well as SACD, there's always been a restriction on piping digital DSD to an outboard device. You can send, without violating copyrights, digital DSD from the MPS-5 to the USB-X because they are within the same family (Playback Designs). Sending the DSD signal to a computer via USB from the USB-X seems like you'll be stepping on Sony's toes.

Sony has restricted DSD to within their own digital pipes; the crappy sounding i-Link for audio and recently HDMI 1.2 or higher. All because they have DTCP (digital transmission content protection). The only other work around was to have the interfaces convert DSD to 24 bit PCM.

If it's as simple as a DSD to USB converter, then anyone could rip SACD music. In fact, you could use something like the ESOTERIC D-07 DAC which converts PCM to DSD internally and then pipe that DSD signal to anything, including recorders. (Huge gasp from the people down in Rancho Bernardo or "Sonyland") essentially making SACDs out of all your old red book CD's. Of course you can't make an SACD physical disc but you could put them on couple of terrabyte hard drive.

Can anyone help me here?

Some clarifications here.

Sony and Philips invented SACD format. To play those *discs* you need a license from them. That license disallows playback in a PC and ripping of said content into other formats. These are the rights they can enforce.

Copyright is about the content on SACD. Those rights remain with whoever created the disc and has nothing to do with Sony unless Sony provided the music.

As noted, if you purchase DSD content, you are free to play it however you want. You don't need a license from Sony/Philips because you are not using their disc format. And you certainly won't be violating any copyright if you paid for the music.

Now if you took the content without paying for it, it is copyright violation no different than any other piece of music and the owners of said music can have recourse with you, not Sony (again, assuming it is not Sony music who owns that music).

 

[ciamara]

Hi everyone. For those who have had some time with the USB-X, did you find it improved the sound of music coming off of the computer vs. what you were doing before? I have only now had a chance to set up the new firmware on our MPS-5 and configure the USB-X. Previously, we were using a Weiss INT-202 connected via Firewire, which in turn fed AES/EBU to the MPS-5. Initial impressions are good. We are using iTunes and Amarra. There does appear to be a delay of 3-5 seconds when switching sample rates before music will begin playing. But at least it is a delay before the music starts, as opposed to cutting off the first few seconds of the song.

 

[chrisr]

Has anyone tried the Signalyst HQPlayer with the usb-x for DSD playback? It is a PC player that plays native DSD (dff and dsf) without converting to PCM. It also plays PCM up to 32/768. DSD playback uses ASIO. I asked Signalyst but they have not tried their software with the PD.

In any event, my usb-x should arrive in a few days and I'll report back on whether the HQPlayer works for native DSD playback with the usb-x.

 

[steve williams]

I'd like to know about Signalyst HQPlayer. Sounds very interesting

 

[chrisr]

I received my usb-x yesterday and tried it out. Using a PC, I was able to play PCM up to 24/384 using JRiver, and up to 24/384 as well as native DSD using Signalyst HQPlayer (free 30 day trial period). The DSD worked like a charm and sounds great.

 

[ted_b]

On the MAC side, Pure Music has worked with Jonathan, Andreas and team to do pure DSD playback (i.e no PCM conversion). Any USB-X users doing that?

 

[wizard]

From a review of MPS-5 at HifiLive

 

[Bruce B]

Thanks Valerio,

I understand the DSD is a format and SACD is a medium just as PCM is a format and CD is one of the mediums. The only audiophile recorder that I've used regularly that records in DSD is the TASCAM DVRA1000HD. However, you cannot export that DSD file to another device. It records unto DVD-R's which are only playable in the same product.

You have been able to stream pure DSD data for years now. That's how we 'rip' SACD's. All the EMM Labs, Esoteric and Playback Designs can output a pure DSD data stream. We have the Tascam DV-RA1000HD as well that can capture this pure DSD data stream from an EMM labs transport. You can use the .diff file that it creates in the Korg units and now out of your own computer.
Right now we are using our Playback Designs MPS-5 as a transport into our Sonoma to capture this data. We will be demonstrating this at RMAF.

 

[tailspn]

You have been able to stream pure DSD data for years now. That's how we 'rip' SACD's. All the EMM Labs, Esoteric and Playback Designs can output a pure DSD data stream.

It's my experience that the EMM CDSD is the only Meitner transport that outputs non encoded DSD data. The later CDSD SE version, with a much more reliable and still available Sony disk mechanism outputs encoded DSD, which is then decoded in the EMM DAC6 SE. The SE version of the transport can not input a Sonoma, or EMM DAC8. However it's pretty easy to tap and buffer decoded DSD in several universal players that play SACDs as DSD, and input that data along with, derived Word Clock, to any device that accepts SDIF.