Visit to Henk van der Hoeven -- Apogee Acoustics Re-builder/Restorer

Zero000

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Picked up the Duetta Signatures today, as expected they buzz at higher volumes at certain frequency and the frames have seen better days, they're a nightmare to lug around though....we barely managed to get them upstairs through a spiral staircase.

At least they're usable for now and man do they sound good! I've sent Henk an e-mail to see if he can help me out, I will probably just restore and repaint them, not being crazy about modifications.

You think yours were bad mine have to move on March 12 and they weigh quite a bit more than standard Duettas.

It is just plain scary.

You could use a simple web based signal generator to find out what frequencies they buzz at, but it won't help you at the end of the day.

In all honesty they can be made quite a bit better than stock but if budget is a limiting factor just sort out the bass panels with Henk. It will still be a killer speaker for not much money.

IMHO even standard Duettas will trash the large majoirty speakers out there to this day.
 

martin778

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Oct 2, 2014
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I will try to make them as good as I can afford but without going bananas with different crossover caps etc.
For now I'm waiting on Henk's response, I have a certain budget but it's not a 5 digit number anyways.

Well, next time I think I will just rent a crane or something and get them out through the window :D
 

Zero000

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The front covers are easy just take them to a car paint shop and they will come out looking superb for not much money.
 

martin778

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Correct, and they weight next to nothing. I'm only wondering if they're strong enough, not to crack on the edges a month after getting new paint. One of mine has a 10cm 'tear' at the front edge at the top, feels like the MDF itself has expanded a bit.
I wonder if Henk makes new ones too or does he repaint the old ones. Christiaan's black + wood veneer(?) Diva's looked damn tasty.
 

Zero000

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Henk will do anything for you I am sure. He also charges reasonable prices from what I can gather.

What amps are you using? When you get used to them and try some amps you will realise that finding amps good enough for the speaker is a challenge. Hearing the difference between amps is super easy. Trouble is not many are up to it. Not is terms of power, but in terms of genuinely being good enough SQ wise.
 

martin778

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What I'm hearing now is pretty convincing, I have a 2012 Emitter II Exclusive, full stack with battery PSU which should be up to the task.
The tiny room is the biggest issue, I can get them 1.0m from the back wall but the total width is only 3.0m as it used to be 2 small bedrooms.
 

Zero000

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Is that an ASR?

What you could try is running the speakers with the MRT on the outside. 3m means the MRT will be very close together otherwise.

If you try it, toe them in a lot. Run in the normal configuration they don't need much toe in at all.

That will open up imaging a lot in that space. See if you like it.

In a very small room Duettas will be almost overwhelming. How long is it? 1 metre from the front wall isn't too bad but I really recommend some GIP panels or the like behind them in that case.
 

martin778

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Oct 2, 2014
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It's an ASR amp indeed.
The room is almost 6 metres in length, not much else in it except for audio gear. I will have to experiment a bit with cabling, maybe trying silver jumpers / loudspeaker cables but it isn't bad at the moment but I rarely play bass heavy tracks.
I'm using Nordost Red Dawn IC's and QED Genesis Silver Spiral loudspeaker cables.
 

Zero000

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Use Henk's experience to help you along. For a budget he will advise you on the most effective upgrades for the money.

Phone him up and talk to him. Get to know him. Discuss anything you don't like about the original Apogee design etc etc.

The ASR is a very good start I would say. I have heard it connected to YGs but I have never heard a YG I like, so I can't comment on how good it is with Duettas.

If you PM me I can tell you more than on a public forum.
 

damic

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Apr 27, 2014
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Picked up the Duetta Signatures today, as expected they buzz at higher volumes at certain frequency and the frames have seen better days, they're a nightmare to lug around though....we barely managed to get them upstairs through a spiral staircase.

At least they're usable for now and man do they sound good! I've sent Henk an e-mail to see if he can help me out, I will probably just restore and repaint them, not being crazy about modifications.

Have near mint active Duetta Signatures with slight buzz, on left speaker at 260Hz and right at 290Hz. They are from 1991 but it seems nobody have decent amp to run them properly. Found remedy with use of xo-dsp, applying at those freq very narrow PEQ (Q=20). It is even better if you have dsp with Q=40. Negative gain, as needed. The point is that those freq., are in room modal region, in that area we have a lot of similar peaks and dips, so this correction remains completely unnoticeable. I posted this info, last year on the big DIY audio forum, but it remains without feed back of other Apogee users.
 

Zero000

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Yeah that's right PEQ will work since most issues are narrowband.

There are issues elsewhere with the length of the MRT. These correspond to audible wavelengths i.e. the length from the bottom to the first foam pivot, and the length above the pivot. There is nothing you can do about them apart from using PEQ, which is super effective.

However, the MRT issue is extremely narrowband and rarely heard.

All speakers have some sort of resonance issue. The deeper you dig the more you know. Sometimes ignorance is not such a bad thing. But sometimes a little knowledge just makes things better.;)
 

Zero000

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Just been reading a review of Dan's Relentless monos in Hi-Fi News. A world exclusive apparently.

11.325 kW into 1 Ohm.

It would be a career defining moment to see a video of this amp literally breaking a pair of Scintillas.

Dan's revenge;)
.
 

Zero000

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Well the Duettas survived the move into the new listening room at 35 by 14 feet. The removals company I used were excellent and got them here completely undamaged.

It occurs to me that I have become so used to handling them over the years I actually set them up completely single handedly. A little thought about it goes a long way and the whole process was dead easy.

However, if you're not used to them it can be really worrying as I said above.

Firing them up was curious. All worries that the room might be too big for them vanished straight away. They completely fill the room with sound and what's more the volume is still great even 40 odd foot away in the hall of the studio's entrance.

That makes me think Graz must be right and Full Range would be overkill in there.

And do they sound different in this room? Really quite different. Scale is huge/vast compared to the old 17 by 11 room.

There's work to do though. It is definitely too echoey in there. The floor is a lino type. Some large rugs are required and probably a few GIP panels wouldn't go amiss. I was talking to GIP at a recent show and if you give them high res photos they will print them on the panels. That's cool.

I want to order a Vava 4K short throw laser projector and a 120 inch ALR PET screen from XY Screens but if I do I just think given the current crisis they won't arrive for ages. Chinese shipments are taking a while at the moment.

The ALR PET screen is not acoustically transparent so it's effect on the rear wave of the Apogees is as yet unknown.

When it looks a bit more sorted in there I will post some pics.
 
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Zero000

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Projectors and screens are getting good these days. Considered an 85 inch Sony but after watching this I rejected the idea.

 

spiritofmusic

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Nice Justin. Good you're hearing promise straight away. But w great promise comes great challenge (or is that w great power comes great responsibility? Lol).
 
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Ron Resnick

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Congratulations on getting the system installed in the new room, Justin! I think those dimensions should be fantastic!

Proving once again that the room is the single most important component . . .
 
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Zero000

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Thanks Marc and Ron!

I wouldn't say the system is installed yet. Just the Luxman pre/power and a £100 Xiang Sheng Chinese DAC with a Western Electric 396A valve in it whilst the Lampizator is away. It is a listenable DAC believe it or not.

Very lucky to get in here when I did as moving has basically been banned here now.
 
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Tango

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thazeldean

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Hello Tang,

Graz delivered the speakers the night before last and it took until late to get them set up. We moved them further into the room than we had them originally. I am still coming to terms with the openness of the sound and the increase of treble energy.
The bass is a little light at the moment and I am still experimenting with position and amplification.
The crossover permits different amps to be hooked up to the bass and the MRTW but Graz is cautious about trying this option because of differences in output power levels of various amps for a given input.
I will get back to you when I have spent more time with the speakers and tried different arrangements.

Regards,
Tony
 

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