What does it mean when people describe Digital as Sounding like "Analog"? Best term?

[spiritofmusic]

The argument of more info encoded on digital (I'm sure correct) reminds me of the debate in the 80s when it was established cd had a way greater dynamic range than lp. That stat never shut the argument down.

 

[Mike Lavigne]

a serene rain is falling outside.....on this first day of summer.

here i sit on a peaceful Father's Day morning, drinking my ice tea, listening to a wonderful Beethoven Late String Quartet (Quartetto Italiano) on the Saskia-Etsuro Gold--Durand Tosca--EMIA SUT--CS Port phono. it is so intricate and tonally refined, the textures deep and micro-dynamically alive.

you think i'm of a mind to consider that we are going to compromise on how this matches a digital version?

ha!!!!!

never!!!

 

[bonzo75]

a serene rain is falling outside.

here i sit on a peaceful Father's Day morning

Father's day started in 1910. Before that there were no fathers

 

[thedudeabides]

IMHO, this digital bashing has become soooooooo old and boring and its all about self grandizing, congratulations and reinforcement. Yeah me, I listen to analogue versus that terrible, god awful digital. Why do people feel compelled to do this? What's the purpose?

 

[bonzo75]

Its very obvious that its all about self grandizing, congratulations and self reinforcement.

You just described audio ownership

 

[spiritofmusic]

Looking fwds to all those staying digital is superior technically, and thus also inevitably in practice, repeating the claim by staying w Roon on the umpteenth SQ degrading update Lol.

Or are we saying digital slays so comprehensively it outperforms no matter what happens at Roon?

 

[Mike Lavigne]

This digital bashing has become soooooooo old and boring. Its very obvious that its all about self grandizing, congratulations and reinforcement. Why do people feel compelled to do this?

show me one hobbyist forum that is not about this. we celebrate our common experiences and feelings thereof. makes our pathetic lives a little less so.

i'd suggest avoiding thread titles including both digital and analog. it's what happens there. what else would there be?

but also lots of positive stuff about digital too.......from me on many of my posts. all the time.

 

[thedudeabides]

Are you really saying I should avoid A v D threads because I have a different perspective?

 

[Al M.]

but also lots of positive stuff about digital too.......from me on many of my posts. all the time.

Yes, and it often comes with the expected caveat. Which is fine; everyone is entitled to their opinion in this hobby, which is shaped by their personal experiences, perceptions and preferences.

 

[Mike Lavigne]

Are you really saying I should avoid A v D threads because I have a different perspective?

no, not even slightly. your perspective is not an issue, it's you being happy.

i'm saying if you want to avoid reading pro-analog comments reacting to other comments of digital equivalency or superiority to analog, then avoid the threads were THAT IS THE SUBJECT MATTER.

 

[Lagonda]

IMHO, this digital bashing has become soooooooo old and boring and its all about self grandizing, congratulations and reinforcement. Yeah me, I listen to analogue versus that terrible, god awful digital. Why do people feel compelled to do this? What's the purpose?

What bashing ? I see good arguments and proponents of both formats represented ! And Mike loves his digital

 

[PeterA]

Which of course is perfectly fine, Peter. I personally have a less strong preference either way; my perception is that both formats can sound very realistic. At the same time I did question lately the authenticity of some -- emphasis on some -- of the beautiful sounds I have heard from analog.

I think that if the music is beautiful it should sound beautiful through a system. I actually think it is precisely the beauty of some music that is often what is not portrayed by an audio system. I agree with you that it should sound convincing and authentic but that is not important for everybody.

 

[Mike Lavigne]

Yes, and it often comes with the expected caveat. Which is fine; everyone is entitled to their opinion in this hobby, which is shaped by their personal experiences, perceptions and preferences.

only when i'm reacting to a generalization related to digital verses analog i don't agree with. i don't pull analog superiority thoughts out of thin air. they are my viewpoint stated as counterpoint.

there are many hundreds (possibly thousands) of digital rave posts by me on WBF......without any analog content in them.

 

[spiritofmusic]

a serene rain is falling outside.....on this first day of summer.

here i sit on a peaceful Father's Day morning, drinking my ice tea, listening to a wonderful Beethoven Late String Quartet (Quartetto Italiano) on the Saskia-Etsuro Gold--Durand Tosca--EMIA SUT--CS Port phono. it is so intricate and tonally refined, the textures deep and micro-dynamically alive.

you think i'm of a mind to consider that we are going to compromise on how this matches a digital version?

ha!!!!!

never!!!

And Mike, what did your kids get you, the audiophile dad who has everything?

 

[Mike Lavigne]

And Mike, what did your kids get you, the audiophile dad who has everything?

the only thing i really appreciate, their company this afternoon for an hour or two (between protest marches). we will practice social distancing. i'm over it completely on a personal level, but my kids are concerned for my wife and i due to our age. and they are more listening to different views on that than we are.

you choose your battles. i try to avoid anything even slightly political with my kids.

 

[spiritofmusic]

Well, I don't have any kids. But have inherited a half dozen nieces and nephews aged right now 25-35. Politics is the last thing I'll talk about w them. And unsurprisingly, also analog versus digital Lol.

 

[microstrip]

yes; i have..........game, set, match to this analog Mstislav Rostropovitch recording......among many others. digital cannot pull off this level of magic.

https://www.whatsbestforum.com/threads/msb-select-ii-arrival.23302/page-18#post-457567

or this 45rpm pressing of the Peter Maag Mendelssohn Scotch Symphony........string textures, again, digital cannot dream about.

https://elusivedisc.com/mendelssohn-symphony-no-3-numbered-limited-edition-180g-45rpm-2lp/

and i love all the Savall's btw. and agree they are among the very best of digital. i have many of them in high rez.

Thanks, they are in no way comparable to the recordings I was referring. You stick to great orchestral music, with plenty of nuance and easy to follow, relying a lot on the interpretation and glory to create an emotional state in the listener, and pick a specific aspect of it, mainly due to the excellent microphone technique and orchestral performance.

Shostakovitch music is much harder to follow and reproduce. Unless everything is properly recorded and reproduced it becomes a mess, impossible to follow and enjoy. It is simultaneously visceral and melodic, filled with detail and brutal dynamics. I have listened several times to performances of his symphonies, and have listened to reproduction in top LP and digital in great systems. IMHO digital approaches more what I listen in the concert hall. A good friend who his a Shostakovitch expert and has experience with the great european orchestras was delighted to be able to easily separate the digital recordings carried with the Concertgbow Orchestra due the unique string texture and signature of their viola sections.

The Savall has a diversity and complexity behind what is possible to record in the analogue domain. I was at his life final performance of this work and again IMHO the digital recording captures more of the performance than any previous recording I know about of this type of music - and no, it is not an ancient music concert with a small number of musicians!

I am not debating our personal views on "magic" and the capability of gluing us to the seat for half a day or seven days a week - I would not do it, even with real music. Just pointing details for an exchange of views concerning digital and analog media, IMHO an endless subject due to its diversity and richness if properly addressed.

 

[Mike Lavigne]

In no way comparable to the recordings I was referring. You stick to great orchestral music, with plenty of nuance and easy to follow, relying a lot on the interpretation and glory to create an emotional state in the listener, and pick a specific aspect of it, mainly due to the excellent microphone technique and orchestral performance.

Shostakovitch music is much harder to follow and reproduce. Unless everything is properly recorded and reproduced it becomes a mess, impossible to follow and enjoy. It is simultaneously visceral and melodic, filled with detail and brutal dynamics. I have listened several times to performances of his symphonies, and have listened to reproduction in top LP and digital in great systems. IMHO digital approaches more what I listen in the concert hall. A good friend who his a Shostakovitch expert and has experience with the great european orchestras was delighted to be able to easily separate the digital recordings carried with the Concertgbow Orchestra due the unique string texture and signature of their viola sections.

The Savall has a diversity and complexity behind what is possible to record in the analogue domain. I was at his life final performance of this work and again IMHO the digital recording captures more of the performance than any previous recording I know about of this type of music - and no it is not an ancient music concert with a small number of musicians!

I am not debating our personal views on "magic" and the capability of gluing us to the seat for half a day or seven days a week - I would not do it, even with real music. Just pointing details for an exchange of views concerning digital and analog media, IMHO an endless subject due to its diversity and richness if properly addressed.

i've progressed in my classical knowledge and vocabulary these last 25 years, and especially my classical appetite........but those finer points i admit are lost on me still. i'm really just into the experience part. but i respect your perspective here. i do get the density of the Shostakovitch Symphonies.....but not why it's so. i listen to many of them and enjoy them.....when i'm in a mood from 'brooding' music.

so i'm the wrong guy to get into that.

too bad we don't have analog versions of the Savall recordings to compare. i understand the point you are making.

i have heard discrete analog multi-channel recordings from tape. in 4 track. you think that digital multi-channel has some advantage? you have no idea. breathtaking. i only bring this up because analog just has so much headroom in the information it can hold.

 

[microstrip]

The argument of more info encoded on digital (I'm sure correct) reminds me of the debate in the 80s when it was established cd had a way greater dynamic range than lp. That stat never shut the argument down.

The 8 extra bits buried it forever ...

 

[spiritofmusic]

Oh, it settled the truism that cd had better dynamic range than lp. But the debate on what appears most realistic and registers as most enjoyable is still on...37 years later.
And I ask again, if Emile never came up w his TAS, and Roon ruins the SQ experience at every new iteration, as the pro digital brigade listening to their music purely via Roon always gonna claim lp comes a distant second?