Which BNC 50-ohm cable for NHB-108 and NHB-18NS interconnection

[manjy]

Thanks mike

For the true story of why Herve uses the ‘zeel’ 50 ohm BNC interface; here is an article he wrote in the Sept 2001 issue of Stereophile, page 59 to 69. “Reflections, Echos and Music”.

this article was written prior to the brand 'darTZeel' being launched.

View attachment 95167

Thanks Mike. Would you have the full article? would be an interesting read.

 

[Zeotrope]

Is the 10mm cable stiff or is it reasonably flexible?
Also, what is the retail price on these?

I found the 10mm Zeel cable very stiff and not easy to route. My pre and amp are close to a back wall, and curving the cable was not easy.

 

[Mike Lavigne]

Thanks mike

Thanks Mike. Would you have the full article? would be an interesting read.

i do have the Sept 2001 issue with the article. Herve does clearly (AFAIK) lay out the shortcomings of conventional interconnects, and i've been told it holds water scientifically although it's beyond me. i can get the drift of the points but not the details.

i've done enough A/B cable compares over the years to believe.

 

[Mike Lavigne]

if anyone PM's me, we can work out some sort of way for you to read this article.

 

[marty]

http://www.townshendaudio.com/PDF/Impedance_matching%20deletraz%20paper.pdf

 

[manjy]

I found the 10mm Zeel cable very stiff and not easy to route. My pre and amp are close to a back wall, and curving the cable was not easy.

My preamp is on a rack behind me and the power amp is in front between the speakers. They're about 20' apart and I have a 1.5" diameter conduit going under the floor between the 2. I'm wondering if I will be able to route a pair of the 10mm cables through.

 

[Zeotrope]

My preamp is on a rack behind me and the power amp is in front between the speakers. They're about 20' apart and I have a 1.5" diameter conduit going under the floor between the 2. I'm wondering if I will be able to route a pair of the 10mm cables through.

I think so but you’ll have to manhandle it a bit. The biggest challenge for me was angling the cords at the BNC connections on the amp and pre, since the components are very close to a back wall.

 

[manjy]

I think so but you’ll have to manhandle it a bit. The biggest challenge for me was angling the cords at the BNC connections on the amp and pre, since the components are very close to a back wall.

Thanks.

Has anyone compared the 8mm with the 10mm cable? Is there a significant jump in SQ?

 

[Zeotrope]

Has anyone noticed if the Dartzeel BNC cables are susceptible to increased background noise if in close proximity to an AC cord?

 

[Tabl10s]

In fact, Dartzeel BNC cable are made by huber+suhner.
Their price is much cheaper than dartzeel.

Can you purchase from the company(S+H)?

 

[DasguteOhr]

My tip aircell 7 cable with these plugs.no soldering necessary

Antennenkabel aircell 7

www.air-store.eu

assembly Instructions

Home

Plugs

Antennen Stecker BNC (Male) - (aircell 7)

www.air-store.eu

 

[dandylinpsst]

Can you purchase from the company(S+H)?

Electronic Components Distributor - Mouser Electronics

 

[Rumpole]

Electronic Components Distributor - Mouser Electronics

From the website - is this the correct cable?

 

[MRubey]

There are a lot of choices of Huber Suhner at Mouser. Some are made for offshore petroleum exposure.
It deserves more research than I’m going to do right now but this one looks interesting.
Silver over copper. About 5mm.

https://brand.hubersuhner.com/api/asset/eyJjbGllbnRJZCI6bnVsbCwiaWQiOjExNjQzNiwidGltZXN0YW1wIjoxNjk4NTk5ODA3LCJ2ZXJzaW9uIjoxNjk4NTA5NjQ0fQ:huber-suhnerag:JQRPIypbZYb9j8NMPyWdFunqzLPl00ZZihTxwGwpNhE/download

 

[MRubey]

Product page with pricing.

https://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/HUBER%2bSUHNER/RG_400_-U?qs=sGAEpiMZZMuGxYVy11yKKkl7R9l6PJoa10yBwKkzJ8w%3D

 

[dandylinpsst]

From the website - is this the correct cable?

View attachment 124789

From the website - is this the correct cable?

View attachment 124789

Incorrect!!
SPUMA_400-RS-FR HUBER+SUHNER | Mouser
SPUMA_240-FR-01 HUBER+SUHNER | Mouser

 

[Rob77]

I recently upgraded to the NHB-468 and this thread made me really curious about the Dart to Zeel connection, which I did not consider before, when I owned the NHB-108.
I decided to try building a 50 ohm cable following the indications in this thread.
I used this: SPUMA_400-RS-FR HUBER+SUHNER | Mouser
Connectors are these: https://www.aeco.tw/products/abc-1451?_pos=1&_fid=eb91cf6af&_ss=c

I finished the cable last week and it has been running since then (I am still breaking in the NHB-468).
The conductor is very thick and not easy to fit properly inside the BNC connector. Cable length is 8mt, since I keep my NHB-18NS on the side wall.
As soon as I plugged them in I couldn' t believe the improvement over my Elrod Power systems Statement Gold XLR. Noise level is considerably lower , image is more defined and I heard plenty of subtle nuances I did not know they existed.
I have definitely realised that it is true when they say DartZeel machines are designed to work best with this connection.

A very nice experiment that worked out quite well, and for that I thank you all for the info provided. I will try to demo the original Dart to Zeel cables and compare them. I will report the results.

 

[buzzlulu]

After 25 years as a Naim owner I made a clean break last November and changed my system over to a NHB-108 model 2 and NHB-18NS MK2. At the time of purchase I decided to follow DarTZeel's recommendation and have been utilizing their 10mm ZEEL cables to connect the pre and amp.

Both myself and another friend (also here on WBF) run a dCS Rossini APEX + Clock as our sources. After much experimentation we settled on utilizing the RCA out from our Rossini into the RCA inputs on the DarTZeel preamp. Ultimately it boiled down to which philosophy we wished to follow. dCS has both RCA and XLR balanced output on their streamers - and maintain a preference for XLR out. DarTZeel amps and preamps are inherently single ended by design and the preference is for single ended connection (RCA or Zeel). Ultimately we decided to follow our ears (and Herve's design) and are utilizing single ended RCA out of our Rossini into RCA on the preamp.

My question asks which input others are using to connect their sources to the DarTZeel preamp? We have been tempted to try a Zeel BNC cable between our dCS and pre (with a BNC/RCA adapter on the dCS end). In the Absolute Sounds review of the Vivaldi APEX the author, Jacob Heilbrunn, utilizes this connection (50 ohm cable with RCA/BNC adapter on the Vivaldi end) into a Zeel input on the preamp. Several email exchanges with him confirmed this preference.

What are others doing? Other than those with a Playback designs DAC (which has a BNC out) are people trying the Zeel connection to connect their sources to the pre or are they simply remaining with the RCA inputs on the back of the pre.

 

[Mike Lavigne]

After 25 years as a Naim owner I made a clean break last November and changed my system over to a NHB-108 model 2 and NHB-18NS MK2. At the time of purchase I decided to follow DarTZeel's recommendation and have been utilizing their 10mm ZEEL cables to connect the pre and amp.

Both myself and another friend (also here on WBF) run a dCS Rossini APEX + Clock as our sources. After much experimentation we have settled on utilizing the RCA out from our Rossini into the RCA inputs on the DarTZeel preamp. Ultimately it boiled down to which philosophy we wished to follow. dCS has both RCA and XLR balanced output on their streamers - and maintain a preference for XLR out. DarTZeel amps and preamps are inherently single ended by design and the preference is for single ended connection (RCA or Zeel) over the available XLR input (which was significantly upgraded in the MK2 version of the preamp). Ultimately we decided to follow our ears (and Herve's design) and are going single ended RCA out of our Rossini into RCA on the preamp.

My question asks what inputs others are using to connect their sources to the DarTZeel preamp? While we have settled on the RCA input we have been tempted to try a Zeel BNC cable between our dCS and pre (with a BNC/RCA adapter on the dCS end). In the Absolute Sounds review of the Vivaldi APEX the author, Jacob Heilbrunn, utilizes this exact same connection (50 ohm cable with RCA/BNC adapter on the Vivaldi end) into a Zeel input on the preamp. Several email exchanges I had with him confirmed this preference.

What are others doing? Other than those with a Playback designs DAC (which has a BNC out) are people trying the Zeel connection to connect their sources to the pre or are they simply remaining with the RCA inputs on the back of the pre.

for sources, i think there are variables in cable and plug performance over whether you add a rca->bnc adapter. mostly i use the rca input myself for my connection for sources. but i think that it's best to just try both ways and listen. it's an easy thing to try.

make sure you are switching the toggle for the impedance on the input when you do the compare.

when i had my Playback Design MPS-5 long ago i did use the BNC Zeel.

 

[buzzlulu]

for sources, i think there are variables in cable and plug performance over whether you add a rca->bnc adapter

Agreed. As for cable performance I think Herve's own 10mm Zeel is a good choice. Whenever a plug comes into play things may be compromised. With that said Jacob (Absolute Sounds) was using an adapter, and a quick email with Herve also confirmed the need for an adapter to be used (and he did not mention any potential compromise in performance).

The official Zeel cables appear to be H&S and we searched high and low to see if H&S made a BNC/RCA adapter. We were unable to find one - actually there do not seem to be many of any brand on the market.

Ultimately we found these at a whopping $2.24 cost :

https://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/AIM-Cambridge-Cinch-Connectivity-Solutions/27-8110?qs=dEO1gfb2FsoQhhrXS%2FAHfA%3D%3D