When he was talking about possibly rebranding I told him he should name the company ‘Brass n Mass’.
The spikes on the platforms face upwards and the coupling caps go on top. This allows transfer of energy without damaging gear.
Wilson Audio announces The Pedestal isolation pod.
- Thread starter tima
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When he was talking about possibly rebranding I told him he should name the company ‘Brass n Mass’.
The spikes on the platforms face upwards and the coupling caps go on top. This allows transfer of energy without damaging gear.
Wilson's frequency test/comparison graphs are on page 4 of the June Stereophile (copied below). They claim virtually full isolation, but don't describe the test conditions. My lower priced favorites are two that haven't been mentioned yet in this thread: AV Roomservice EVP's (frequency test graphs and videos on their site) and Marigo Mystery feet. Under speakers and components, the EVP's are outstanding. They provided far better isolation under 68 lb actives than Gaia III's, -- piano runs went from smudged to hearing every note. They come in three densities and the 2" square version goes for $45 each, while the 4" is $105. The Marigo are also very good (as is its somewhat pricey Aida CD mat, which is currently 20% off at Music Direct). While a three-set of the Marigo's lower priced model goes for around $900, the previous model can be had from them for a little over a third of that.
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You can see larger charts and an account of Wilson's testing if you read page 4 of The Pedestal press release, available in the opening post of this thread.
All of the "test results" provided by Wilson to sell its magical material product are useless without transparency regarding the actual process/testing parameters ("Wilson's Modular Exciter" - is someone actually paid to make up this bullshit) and identifying the other products they are claiming they compared their product to.
I can't wait for the next Stereophile review of a Wilson product where Wilson saves JA the trouble and provides him with Wilson certified test result charts using Wilson's Modular Exciter and three mystery "competing products".
Your point being what exactly since your reply didn't actually add anything to the discussion
Cost aside, their test claims to mimic the vibrations an audio component might encounter. Even if their substrate-exciter test is valid for common real world audio setups, the question is valid for what exactly. What’s not clear is what weight or weights they tested, that is, to what degree their results are true across the weight range the devices are made for, up to 75 lbs for three. As I found with the EVP’s under a 9 lb tube preamp and its 17 lb PSU next to each other on a bottom shelf, each needs the right amount of firmness and give, and it’s not necessarily the same; otherwise, the purpose is defeated. That’s why, for example, Isoacoustics makes three versions of the Gaia for speakers. Wilson doesn’t help us there.
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Interesting thought. Wilson does not show test sample weight in their anonymized graphs.
Because a different product works in a certain way it does not follow that the Wilson product works in the same way as that other product. Your 9lb preamp and 17lb psu may each need "the right amount of firmness and give" in terms of an EVP product. Apparently an EVP is a product that has firmness and give and can be used under any component. Wilson says each Pedestal is rated for weights up to 25lb but it is not for speakers. The press releases does not suggest the Pedestal has firmness or give within certain ranges. From looking at pictures of each the Pedestal appears to be a wholly different type of product from the EVP. I'm not questioning that either product works, just stating that they may not work the same way, or the requirements of one may not apply to the other.
What sort of help are you looking for?
Which brings up the question of off-the-shelf isolation and/or vibration control products. Each component that is unique across a wide range of dimension, weight, material, build, etc, is also likely unique in resonance frequency, the way vibration moves within it and the way its resonance frequency changes when put in contact with some other product or material. Even with small, medium, large, it is nearly impossible to predict which off the shelf iso-products will work optimally with a given component. It's likely that any product will change the sound of whatever component you put on top of it in some way.
Obviously,, the Wilson and EVPs (and Marigo feet and most every isolation device) work differently, and finding what works right for each component and physical situation is a matter of trial and error. The question I raised about the Wilson seems one that needs addressing, whether to show different weight graphs or why with the Pedestal’s construction it doesn’t matter. The cost for a user to find out is rather steep (and more than I’m able to handle).
Of course that's your interest and that's fine. I don't know if Wilson feels a need to prove their product assertions after indicating their product works in a certain weight range. However, the press release includes an e-mail address and invitation for contact if there are questions. If you write, please let us know what you learn.
Hi everyone
First let me say that I have no affiliation with the Wilson feet and I have not tried the Wilson feet myself but my local hifi dealer has them in stock. Here is something I found very interesting. One of his customers took home a set of three to try. This customer uses the CMS feet under ALL of his electronics and loves them, as I do under my electronics. He told the owner of the store that the improvement he heard with the Wilson feet when compared to the CMS feet was like the difference between no feet at all compared to the CMS feet. That's how good he felt the Wilson feet were. The very next day he traded in all 20 CMS feet and is buying the Wilson feet!
Now I personally have not heard the Wilson feet yet, and I remain extremely skeptical because I think the CMS feet are the absolute best vibration control devices I have ever heard and I love them. You better believe I'm going to take home a set of three to hear them for myself. If there half as good as this customer says they are I have to hat least hear them.
First let me say that I have no affiliation with the Wilson feet and I have not tried the Wilson feet myself but my local hifi dealer has them in stock. Here is something I found very interesting. One of his customers took home a set of three to try. This customer uses the CMS feet under ALL of his electronics and loves them, as I do under my electronics. He told the owner of the store that the improvement he heard with the Wilson feet when compared to the CMS feet was like the difference between no feet at all compared to the CMS feet. That's how good he felt the Wilson feet were. The very next day he traded in all 20 CMS feet and is buying the Wilson feet!
Now I personally have not heard the Wilson feet yet, and I remain extremely skeptical because I think the CMS feet are the absolute best vibration control devices I have ever heard and I love them. You better believe I'm going to take home a set of three to hear them for myself. If there half as good as this customer says they are I have to hat least hear them.
I am curious as to what the actual sonic differences were and under what components the customer of your dealer friend compared these two sets of footers. I have heard the Center Stage footers. I suppose that is what you mean by the CMS feet.
I think much depends on the component, the supporting shelf, and the tastes of the listener. Sometimes less is more, but not always. I look forward to reading what you think of the Wilsons after you have had a chance to try them.
Perhaps this customer of your dealer friend can post his listening impressions.
I think much depends on the component, the supporting shelf, and the tastes of the listener. Sometimes less is more, but not always. I look forward to reading what you think of the Wilsons after you have had a chance to try them.
Perhaps this customer of your dealer friend can post his listening impressions.
Hi Peter A
Yes, I was in the store and I was telling a friend/customer about the CMS center stage feet and how much I liked them and that I had them under my cd transport, preamp & dac and I thought they were the best vibration control devise I had ever heard and believe me, I’ve tried them all. That’s when the owner of the store told me about this customer who had them under all of his electronics. He told me that this customer who took home a set of the Wilson feet and was just like me, he thought the CMS feet were amazing, until he tried the Wilson feet. He was so blown away by the Wilson feet that he wanted to trade in his CMS feet that he has and replace them all with the Wilson feet.
I am sorry but I didn’t speak to the actual customer so I don’t know any of the details. The store owner did tell me that this customer has a very nice high resolution system consisting of the Wilson Alex speakers ($109.000.00) for the pair and he named some of the electronics but I don’t remember the other equipment, let’s just say it was all expensive gear.
The bottom line is simple. You have to try them for yourself in your own system. I’m going to remove the CMS feet from under my cd transport, the theory being that this component has the most vibration of all the other pieces of gear in my system, and listen to discs I’ve heard hundreds of times. I will then put back the CMS feet and wait the 5 - 10 days for the CMS feet to “refocus” and see which I like better.
Like I said in my original post, I remain very skeptical because I think the CMS feet are simply amazing. However, I’m going to keep an open mind (and ear). I’ll
let you all know what I hear. Take care.
Scot
Yes, I was in the store and I was telling a friend/customer about the CMS center stage feet and how much I liked them and that I had them under my cd transport, preamp & dac and I thought they were the best vibration control devise I had ever heard and believe me, I’ve tried them all. That’s when the owner of the store told me about this customer who had them under all of his electronics. He told me that this customer who took home a set of the Wilson feet and was just like me, he thought the CMS feet were amazing, until he tried the Wilson feet. He was so blown away by the Wilson feet that he wanted to trade in his CMS feet that he has and replace them all with the Wilson feet.
I am sorry but I didn’t speak to the actual customer so I don’t know any of the details. The store owner did tell me that this customer has a very nice high resolution system consisting of the Wilson Alex speakers ($109.000.00) for the pair and he named some of the electronics but I don’t remember the other equipment, let’s just say it was all expensive gear.
The bottom line is simple. You have to try them for yourself in your own system. I’m going to remove the CMS feet from under my cd transport, the theory being that this component has the most vibration of all the other pieces of gear in my system, and listen to discs I’ve heard hundreds of times. I will then put back the CMS feet and wait the 5 - 10 days for the CMS feet to “refocus” and see which I like better.
Like I said in my original post, I remain very skeptical because I think the CMS feet are simply amazing. However, I’m going to keep an open mind (and ear). I’ll
let you all know what I hear. Take care.
Scot
Please be aware that the Pedestal that you will be trying is speced to work with loads between 8lbs and 25lbs per Pedestal (Component Weight: 24lbs to 75lbs). If your transport is under 24lbs, you will want to wait until your dealer receives the lower weight version which is speced at 3lbs to 9lbs per Pedestal (Component Weight: 9lbs to 27lbs).
Peter, my guess is that the customer doesn't frequent forums. His is a very long time audiophile and a very busy and successful guy. FYI, I think the dealer was actually sandbagging about what's in his system. I don't think it is Alexx.
Hi metaphacts
I didn’t know they were coming out with another version for lighter weight equipment, good to know. My cd transport weighs 33 lbs so I think it should be ok.
The three salespeople at the store all seem to be convinced that the Wilson feet are something special. All I can say is we’ll find out. Stay tuned......
Scot
I didn’t know they were coming out with another version for lighter weight equipment, good to know. My cd transport weighs 33 lbs so I think it should be ok.
The three salespeople at the store all seem to be convinced that the Wilson feet are something special. All I can say is we’ll find out. Stay tuned......
Scot
High end audio is indeed expensive and getting more so. But in isolation per device, Wilson are surely not alone n this price bracket. Stillpoints U6s with the Base cost in excess of 800/each...and you will need 3 or 4 per device. Silent Running Audio shelves run 3K-6K each, HRS M3X shelves run around 3K, plus they often come with damping plates on top which add a few hundred. And these manufacturers have had these prices for 5-7 years or longer. And I will say, each of these manufacturers make incredibly good products...i have bought pieces from each of them myself (all 2nd hand and/or deeply discounted) and been really impressed.
I imagine Wilson are pricing to the result and the market...if the market will pay for a given result in that range, and Wilson are able to achieve that result (whether with more expensive materials or less expensive...its the result that matters)...then they are pricing to that level.
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