How Good a CD Transport is Required to Sound Better than Streaming?

GSOphile

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I have not heard the Jay’s Audio CD transports. I do not doubt that they are as good as advertised. They consistently garner excellent word of mouth feedback. I have no reason at all to question that.

The Pro-Ject RS2T is by their edict/design)Box series) is diminutive and lightweight , so you are correct. The irony is the sound presentation is large and immersive.

They implemented the wall wart SMPS very well as it sounds terrific! One can take it even further with a good quality external LPS. I believe that the key to its terrific sound has much to do with the Stream Unlimited CD Pro-8 drive utilization.

It is the lowest cost of entry to obtain this excellent drive mechanism. The other brands that also have chosen the Stream Unlimited are 10K (Aqua Hifi) and above.

In my opinion you could not go wrong with either the RS2T or the Jay’s Audio. If you’re bothered by the “shoebox “ design of the RS2T then go with the larger and heavier Jay’s Audio (Especially the CDT3 MK III).

I don’t have anything negative to say about Jay’s Audio as they’ve earned an excellent reputation. I’m just very familiar with the RS2T. It’s both high resolution (And nuanced) and yet very musically engaging for sure. It will do your CD collection justice. Again, I feel you’d be very pleased with either of these two options.

Good luck and best wishes,
Charles
Charles, thank you for your posts on this topic.
 
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Argonaut

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The Pro-Ject RS2T is by their edict/design)Box series) is diminutive and lightweight , so you are correct. The irony is the sound presentation is large and immersive.
I seem to recall a little recent concern about failure rates / build quality of the Pro-Ject products ? It seemed that if one received a good one they are excellent performers at a highly competitive price … However !
 
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charles1dad

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I seem to recall a little recent concern about failure rates / build quality of the Pro-Ject products ? It seemed that if one received a good one they are excellent performers at a highly competitive price … However !
That’s true. It seems that a certain production run of the RS2T were experiencing quality control issues. Pro-Ject acknowledges this indeed was a real problem.

According to them they have identified the issue and subsequently addressed and corrected it. Time will tell. My RS2T is from an earlier production run (Purchased November 2021)

. I have had zero problems with mine (With very frequent and long listening sessions). Other owners who’ve bought around the same time as me (Or earlier) report the same trouble free history of ownership.

I can only attest to 2 things.
I’ve had no reliability problems with my transport.
The sound quality is exceptionally good.
Charles
 

Argonaut

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According to them they have identified the issue and subsequently addressed and corrected it. Time will tell. My RS2T is from an earlier production run (Purchased November 2021)
Exactly how one would wish a manufacturer to respond to such an issue , cudos to Pro-Ject.
By way of re emphasis, from what I have read of the company’s drives they seem to exhibit impressive playback at an attractive price should one wish for a transport only unit :cool:
 

charles1dad

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Exactly how one would wish a manufacturer to respond to such an issue , cudos to Pro-Ject.
By way of re emphasis, from what I have read of the company’s drives they seem to exhibit impressive playback at an attractive price should one wish for a transport only unit :cool:
Yep!! An excellent option for those (Like me) who derive much listening enjoyment via Redbook CD playback.

There’s definitely something right with regard to the Stream Unlimited CD Pro-8/Blue Tiger servo drive unit employed.
 
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morricab

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Heard the Ayon CDT-2 is very good
 
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bozebuttons

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I am very interested in the results of a CDT3-Mk3 survey. I note that Jay's Audio Transports have reported by him as having a plethora of power regulators, hopefully of audiophile quality and not 50 cent computer quality. Although 6 moons reviewed the former unit's transport versus the CDT2-MK2 transport (Philips CDM 4), the current latter models use plastic CDM 4/19 units while many high end units still use the CDT3-Mk3's Philips CDM Pro-2 Pro-LF transports such as Accustic Arts and mbl in Germany (both CD-Pro2LF), Nagra (CD-Pro2LF) and Soulution (Esoteric/Teac) in Switzerland, Métronome (CD-Pro2LF) in France. Jay indicated that the CDT3 is superior. However, the CDT2 also has an optional upgrade Jay's Qsuspension NSE vibration spring/post mounted transport and CD Qstab stabilizer. I appreciate any additional information (the interior of the CDT 2 looked half empty while the CDT3 looked full of parts)...
I listen mostly to Cds I bought the Jays audio CDT3 mk3 recently & qstb bone clamp after my Emm labs cdsd transport crapped for the 2nd time.
I have had other players and transports before .If you are invested in CDs the Jays is the best investment I have made .currently feeding a Pacific
using black cat Spidf
 
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charles1dad

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I listen mostly to Cds I bought the Jays audio CDT3 mk3 recently & qstb bone clamp after my Emm labs cdsd transport crapped for the 2nd time.
I have had other players and transports before .If you are invested in CDs the Jays is the best investment I have made .currently feeding a Pacific
using black cat Spidf
Congratulations!
I bet that the CDT3 MK III and Pacific DAC pairing sounds marvelous! Two questions

What does the Q-Stab clamp contribute to the sound?

Sonically speaking is the CDT3 MK III an improvement to your EMM Labs transport?
Charles
 

bozebuttons

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Congratulations!
I bet that the CDT3 MK III and Pacific DAC pairing sounds marvelous! Two questions

What does the Q-Stab clamp contribute to the sound?

Sonically speaking is the CDT3 MK III an improvement to your EMM Labs transport?
Charles
defiantly a improvement over the Emm labs transport Playing Cds noticeable at first listen no doubt
I never tried the clamp that came with the jays will have to try at some point, just so happy with the performance of the combo
I don't feel
the need to change it
Tom
 
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charles1dad

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defiantly a improvement over the Emm labs transport Playing Cds noticeable at first listen no doubt
I never tried the clamp that came with the jays will have to try at some point, just so happy with the performance of the combo
I don't feel
the need to change it
Tom
Thanks. There’s a Q-stab made for the Pro-Ject RS2T as well so I was interested in your listening impressions.
Charles
 

Bbock

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Thanks. There’s a Q-stab made for the Pro-Ject RS2T as well so I was interested in your listening impressions.
Charles
@charles1dad, do have a link for the Pro—Ject version? Only saw the Jay’s version. Thanks.
 

charles1dad

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spiritofmusic

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Is there a Q-Stab variant that works with front loading/drawer CDPs?
 

charles1dad

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Is there a Q-Stab variant that works with front loading/drawer CDPs?
I could be wrong but I think limited to top loading CD transports.
Charles
 

spiritofmusic

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That's a shame, I believe Montesquieu here who I've visited raves about this.
It would be lovely to have a front loading equivalent.
"Memo to Q Stab people..."
 

charles1dad

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That's a shame, I believe Montesquieu here who I've visited raves about this.
It would be lovely to have a front loading equivalent.
"Memo to Q Stab people..."
Maybe they are addressing this possibility and have something in the pipeline. Given the high satisfaction of Q-Stab users, it seems worth pursuing.
Charles
 

cjf

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I'm a Roon User and QoBuz subscriber. I stream from QoBuz all day while working and very much enjoy it thru my office based system (Benchmark DAC3 connected via USB to an Intel NUC Roon Endpoint using Genelec 8020D Active monitors).

I also stream from QoBuz on my main system, but only when listening passively and or doing other things around the house.

With that said, I have a hard time engaging with the music while streaming from the Internet when using the main system (From QoBuz or Tidal, I have used both) compared to what I hear with locally stored music on my NAS. The large majority of these local media files were all ripped from CD's. The rest were purchased online via the various options.

The streamed music from the Internet, to my ears, is missing something. My best attempt at an explanation of what the streamed versions are missing would be Depth/Width of soundstage and lower (sub) bass output/authority.

I find it almost immediately noticeable if I'm paying attention. I have compared directly a purchased download sitting on my NAS to the same (and only available) album via a stream (just one example being Tool - Fear Inoculum). I find the differences between them large enough to leave the streamed version damn near unlistenable.

But that is just a direct comparison. In most cases I dont even need to compare the same recording/version from the web to the one I own locally. The theme is almost always the same IMO, no matter what I listen to.

It does not surprise me at all to hear others are wanting to hold onto their CD Transports. But I would be curious to know if those in the CD Transport camp have the same opinion when comparing a ripped CD stored on their NAS or other similar local storage media vs that CD Transport?

I have only ever owned one "OK" CD Transport back in the day (Adcom GCD-750) and I know that local streaming sounds better then it did at the time.

All in all, I am a fan of streaming and I am glad its available for us all at our finger tips. I've wanted that option for as long as I can remember and now its here. But for me, I believe its still got some catching up to do before it can better a ripped CD and likely a good CD Transport.

But for Users like myself who have multiple channels, the only feasible option is streaming (locally or via the Web) and the use of a multi-channel DAC. I'm not aware of a CD Transport that can accommodate this scenario and even if one did exist I've grown too lazy to deal with getting up to switch CD's after they were done playing
: )
 

Blackmorec

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All in all, I am a fan of streaming and I am glad its available for us all at our finger tips. I've wanted that option for as long as I can remember and now its here. But for me, I believe its still got some catching up to do before it can better a ripped CD and likely a good CD Transport.
Hi Cjf
By way of advice and not criticism, I would rephrase the above paragraph to read as follows:

“All in all, I am a fan of streaming and I am glad its available for us all at our finger tips. I've wanted that option for as long as I can remember and now its here. But for me, I believe MY IMPLEMENTATION has still got some catching up to do before it can better a ripped CD and likely a good CD Transport.”

The sound quality of streaming is like a piece of string. The string is as long as you want to make it and the sound quality of streaming is exactly the same; as good as you want to make it.

So far I have continued to improve streaming to the point its now better than anything I’ve ever heard in 50+ years of systems, dealer events and shows. and up to now I‘ve not even found the ‘Law of Diminishing Return’s’ inflection point.

Essentially any changes to the network data stream‘s physical layer will change the quality of the sound you get and any improvements to the physical layer will improve the sound quality.

So is your network providing a data stream without noise, jitter, vibration and with perfect square wave bits? If not its the deviation from perfect that is impacting the sound quality of your streaming.

Initially it was thought that anything encoded with a digital pattern was enough for perfect sound. Unfortunately we’ve since discovered that not to be the case and that the quality of the encoding is where the magic actually lies.
 

GSOphile

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Sep 3, 2017
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I could be wrong but I think limited to top loading CD transports.
Charles
I think you are right. The clamp in a front loader is integral to the transport mechanism, which in most cases (I own an Esoteric player) would need to be disassembled to install a different clamp, probably voiding the warranty.
 

charles1dad

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I think you are right. The clamp in a front loader is integral to the transport mechanism, which in most cases (I own an Esoteric player) would need to be disassembled to install a different clamp, probably voiding the warranty.
In the past I used an older generation Esoteric transport with the VRDS clamping mechanism. I enjoy the simplicity and sound of a well implemented top loading CD unit.
Charles
 

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