Gryphon Mephisto Stereo
- Thread starter Thieliste
- Start date
Remember, these comments are about electrical infrastructure. So #5 is about damping panels, boxes and wires.
The hierarchy of influence numbered 1 to 5 are always something to analize and look to feedback on.
To some degree, 1 and 2 are interchangeable. They both have a large impact. But its a little different in what they do and how they voice.
As far as 3, corrosion protection. I have personally heard large positive changes in multiple systems when something is dirty, then cleaned. Lots of people have reported this too. I like Caig Deoxit, but there are other formulations people rave over that are probably very good. If your not using something like Deoxit on your speaker, interconnect, power cord connections etc, your missing out. I like Deoxit simply because it works well and I have never experienced or heard of an arching incident. Even on 900 volt tube pins. I have intentionally been sloppy on driver and power tubes that have up to 600 volts and never noise or arching. I use it on every panel connection. At a minimum it will make bare copper or silver plating resistant to oxidation for many years. When you hear an oxidized comtact that is cleaned properly, its quite profound.
As far as #4 better branch wires. I have installed many different wires from my Torus or from my panel to my rack. I isolate the wire by bringing it directly from the breaker, out the wall, terminated with a Furutech female and directly into a test piece of equipment. No duplex or extra power cord. A direct conection. Many times this was into my Dartzeel NHB 108. I do many back and forth with a piece of #10 romex with the exact same end as a control baseline. I keep the test wire in the system for weeks or longer to ensure its broken in. And back and forth tells one part of a story. Living with something tells another.
That list doesn't include all copper panels. I rate an all copper panel somewhere in the top 3. It shocked me when I took one of my fully prepared copper NQ panelboards and played it head to head with a SqD QO loadcenter that was stock. I simply moved the feeder wire and branch wires with circuit breaker attached from one to the other. I had an audiophile friend here with me. We were both flabbergasted. Speachless. Well, we actually blathered about how impactful it was and sent the tape to Audiolhile Junkie who published it.
If you love your Shunyata or Audio Quest or other filter and refuse a Torus, but want to improve your power, the biggest gain is multiple dedicated 10 awg to the rack and a all copper panel feeding it. Hands down. The only way to get an all copper panel at this time is through me. And I am going to polish and deoxit every contact in it. You can try and special order one with special notes to the plant for specific parts to be utilized. But that can take up to 6 months. And your electrician is not going to take it apart and clean it.
There is Benjamin Electric. Even those panels should be broken down, polished, Deoxit and reassembled. Its not necessary, but it all helps. A Benjamin is twice the price of a SqD NQ and the bolt on AFCI are $350 each, my cost. I have to mark that up. SqD AFCI are $72. Benjamin Electric is special because it is the only UL listed and labeled panel in the US and Canada that can be 120 volt only and follow a single high output 60A to 120A Torus isolation transformer. This allows you to power a room with as many outlets as you want with massive power to the largest amps and subs manufactured. As well as the front end. And everything sees the exact same voltage and ground potential. That is how my system is configured. A feeder from my all copper main panel to a single high power Torus core and a Benjamin panel distributing the power to outlets in my room. Deoxed the whole way through.
Rex
The hierarchy of influence numbered 1 to 5 are always something to analize and look to feedback on.
To some degree, 1 and 2 are interchangeable. They both have a large impact. But its a little different in what they do and how they voice.
As far as 3, corrosion protection. I have personally heard large positive changes in multiple systems when something is dirty, then cleaned. Lots of people have reported this too. I like Caig Deoxit, but there are other formulations people rave over that are probably very good. If your not using something like Deoxit on your speaker, interconnect, power cord connections etc, your missing out. I like Deoxit simply because it works well and I have never experienced or heard of an arching incident. Even on 900 volt tube pins. I have intentionally been sloppy on driver and power tubes that have up to 600 volts and never noise or arching. I use it on every panel connection. At a minimum it will make bare copper or silver plating resistant to oxidation for many years. When you hear an oxidized comtact that is cleaned properly, its quite profound.
As far as #4 better branch wires. I have installed many different wires from my Torus or from my panel to my rack. I isolate the wire by bringing it directly from the breaker, out the wall, terminated with a Furutech female and directly into a test piece of equipment. No duplex or extra power cord. A direct conection. Many times this was into my Dartzeel NHB 108. I do many back and forth with a piece of #10 romex with the exact same end as a control baseline. I keep the test wire in the system for weeks or longer to ensure its broken in. And back and forth tells one part of a story. Living with something tells another.
That list doesn't include all copper panels. I rate an all copper panel somewhere in the top 3. It shocked me when I took one of my fully prepared copper NQ panelboards and played it head to head with a SqD QO loadcenter that was stock. I simply moved the feeder wire and branch wires with circuit breaker attached from one to the other. I had an audiophile friend here with me. We were both flabbergasted. Speachless. Well, we actually blathered about how impactful it was and sent the tape to Audiolhile Junkie who published it.
If you love your Shunyata or Audio Quest or other filter and refuse a Torus, but want to improve your power, the biggest gain is multiple dedicated 10 awg to the rack and a all copper panel feeding it. Hands down. The only way to get an all copper panel at this time is through me. And I am going to polish and deoxit every contact in it. You can try and special order one with special notes to the plant for specific parts to be utilized. But that can take up to 6 months. And your electrician is not going to take it apart and clean it.
There is Benjamin Electric. Even those panels should be broken down, polished, Deoxit and reassembled. Its not necessary, but it all helps. A Benjamin is twice the price of a SqD NQ and the bolt on AFCI are $350 each, my cost. I have to mark that up. SqD AFCI are $72. Benjamin Electric is special because it is the only UL listed and labeled panel in the US and Canada that can be 120 volt only and follow a single high output 60A to 120A Torus isolation transformer. This allows you to power a room with as many outlets as you want with massive power to the largest amps and subs manufactured. As well as the front end. And everything sees the exact same voltage and ground potential. That is how my system is configured. A feeder from my all copper main panel to a single high power Torus core and a Benjamin panel distributing the power to outlets in my room. Deoxed the whole way through.
Rex
@Kingrex - Thanks for your insights Rex.
As far as power treatment, my system is currently composed as follows:
- dedicated AC power line;
- Doepke DFS2 current breaker with silver plated connection terminals;
- the breaker is directly connected to a PLIXIR Elite BAC 3000 power conditioner (fully balanced);
- the PLIXIR is connected in parallel to a FRANK ACOUSTICS PB 25000, which acts as a shunt reactor (absorber of reactive power) thus increasing the energy efficiency of the system;
- the AC power cord from the mains to all outlets is FURUTECH FP-S02N (12 awg);
-all outlets are FURUTECH FT-SWS (rhodium plated);
- an ENTREQ Cleanus (grounded with an Infinity Tungsten groundbox) is connected to one of the outlets where the system is connected in order to further reduce high frequency (pure passive filter);
- finally I also employ a couple of High Fidelity MC 1Pro Double Helix Plus Signature which are plugged into the same wall;
- cabling is Transparent Audio Opus full loom and all digital components as well as the preamps (two chassis) are connected to a Transparent Audio Isolator.
I've cleaned all connectors with this product (https://www.bluehorizonideas.com/products/clean-it/) and applied NPS-Q45T contact enhancer wherever feasible.
I've replaced all fuses with Sharkwire fuses (Vulcan or Genesis).
Pretty happy with all of the above. What do you think?
Thanks,
Franco
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Doepke is not legal in the USA and Canada. But they may be in Asia and Europe. Your consumer units can be all copper which is nice. But you have to make sure the comb bus and terminal strips are indeed copper and not aluminum. And get bare copper. Not tin plated.
Many times your limited to stranded wire in the walls. I like solid better.
You have 1 dedicated circuit. I like many.
You have a lot of filters attached to that single circuit. I find filters can work well with some gear. But you have a lot going on. My guess is your sound is very black and quiet. But it might be a bit compressed and loss of dynamics.
Its always good to at times go back to basics. Remove all your filters. All of them. Play the stereo for a day. Then plug just one in and listen. What do you hear. Give it a day to settle and listen. Then unplug it and try a different filter. Do the same. After you understand what each filter is doing, take the one that did best and put it back in. Then maybe try adding another on top.
I get your filters are suppose to do different things. But stacking them is not usually a recipt for success. It might end up it works well for you. Who knows. Stepping back and reassessing is easy and can be enlightening.
Part of the reason I like multiple circuits is I find amps and digital and analog may want a different filter. Or no filter. Your forcing everything onto multiple filters.
Many times your limited to stranded wire in the walls. I like solid better.
You have 1 dedicated circuit. I like many.
You have a lot of filters attached to that single circuit. I find filters can work well with some gear. But you have a lot going on. My guess is your sound is very black and quiet. But it might be a bit compressed and loss of dynamics.
Its always good to at times go back to basics. Remove all your filters. All of them. Play the stereo for a day. Then plug just one in and listen. What do you hear. Give it a day to settle and listen. Then unplug it and try a different filter. Do the same. After you understand what each filter is doing, take the one that did best and put it back in. Then maybe try adding another on top.
I get your filters are suppose to do different things. But stacking them is not usually a recipt for success. It might end up it works well for you. Who knows. Stepping back and reassessing is easy and can be enlightening.
Part of the reason I like multiple circuits is I find amps and digital and analog may want a different filter. Or no filter. Your forcing everything onto multiple filters.
I'm based in Italy and Doepke is legal here. Why is it not legal in the US?
What specific filters are you referring to?
Thanks.
You mentioned 4. I am referring to all of them. If its anything other than a cord or duplex or wire in the wall, it needs to be investigated. I would not bother with the Doepke. Leave it. I'm sure its fine.
You could try removing the Doepka and replacing it with a good fuse block and fuse. A large fuse, ones the size of a finger, replacing a circuit breaker have a very pronounced sound.
Why should I remove the Doepke? It is the best circuit breaker in the market AFAIK (?).
I think there is a mistake here. Doepke is a Differential Disjuntor and is precisely in the circuit to open it in case of “short circuits”. Gigawatt G 16 A is a Thermal Magnet, which is designed to open the circuit in case of excessive Current Intensity. In this case you can also opt for a device with a fuse to perform the same function as the “/Fuse module AHP 4Gi”, but in my experience the GigaWatt works better.
Note Both the Difference Disjuntor and the Thermal Magnet (or Fuse Module) are mandatory here in my country: The difference Disjuntor so as not to die from a current derivation and the Thermal Magnet so as not to burn the line due to excess amperage.
I’ve had a short circuit in my system and, while the Doepke did not trip, the fuse of the Plixir conditioner paid its duty and blew.
I saw that you also have GigaWatt G-C16A 2P and a Fuse module AHP 4G. Where are they in your system?
I'm sure your right and I confused the Gigawatt for the Doepke. But the point still stands. In the USA and Canada you have to have thermal/magnetic devices protecting all branch/feeder wires. Maybe service too. But I'm not sure what utilities do.
There is no reason to outside investigating what other options bring. I have put a Hifi Supreme gold 20A fuse socket and fuse in a panel and done back to back test. I was shocked how much different it was. It wasn't my panel so I did not have the luxury of fully investigating it. But it was very heard. Many European countries allow you to use a fuse. I wish we could in the USA. If we could I would try it.
Sorry to derail the thread somewhat, but I see that you have a Commander with a Mephisto. Did you previously have a Pandora pre? I currently have a Pandora/Mephisto and am debating making the jump to a Commander, but keeping the Mephisto rather than upgrading to Apex. What are your thoughts on this combo compared to your previous configuration?
Yes, I moved from Pandora + Essence Monos to Commander + Mephisto Stereo. If you ask me, this combo is a completely different game. The Commander works very well with the Mephisto. Pitch black with great control on the bass. Don’t get me wrong, the Pandora is a great amp but IMO the Commander can handle the force and power of the Mephisto way better. Of course, if you can listen to it it would be best.
Thanks Frankie, I rather expected you to tell me it was a good idea! That must have been a big jump to go from Pandora and Essence to Commander and Mephisto in one go. I had Essence before Mephisto and I really liked it, nice amp the Essence.
Good to hear you views on the particular combination of Pandora and Mephisto as most people with Commander also seem to have Apex.
May as well get Apex in the future but for now I’m happy with my Mephisto. Have you A/B compared Apex to Mephisto?
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