Your comments often make me smile. You are such a character Gian. I like Italian more and more.
Tang
211 valves: please share your experiences
- Thread starter Audiocrack
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Your comments often make me smile. You are such a character Gian. I like Italian more and more.
Tang
This is true,there are very special amp for me,like Kagura,that i haven't the money to buy,CH M1,Lamm M3,Costellation and Dartzeel 458,Audiotekne TM 9502,plus other i don't know
And for the pentode tube i prefer also amp with EL 34 or 84 than 6550 or KT 88
@Tang,try to organize in 2019 a summer holiday with your family in Italy,you will like
And for the pentode tube i prefer also amp with EL 34 or 84 than 6550 or KT 88
@Tang,try to organize in 2019 a summer holiday with your family in Italy,you will like
gian60 has completely lost me... lives on a different planet obviously!
Anyway, yes, is the answer. See STC 4242. It is a 10V, 3.25 amp tube and when biased correctly will work in the Kagura monos.
Now try and find a quad. Not so easy. I've just been looking around and things have been drying up badly since I used to collect 211s. Very badly indeed.
gian60 has completely lost me... lives on a different planet obviously!
Anyway, yes, is the answer. See STC 4242. It is a 10V, 3.25 amp tube and when biased correctly will work in the Kagura monos.
Now try and find a quad. Not so easy. I've just been looking around and things have been drying up badly since I used to collect 211s. Very badly indeed.
Thanks. Any idea in which area(s) these STC 4242 valves might beat the (top notch) 211 tubes and whether the differences for the better are profound, Justin?
Scarcity of good 211s is a real worry for all of us, it seems. I only have real experience of the ‘48 GEs on my NATs and thankfully these seem in “reasonable” supply. But, a few years down the road...?
Nope. But I will say I easily hear the difference between the different types I have. So they will be different. Whether they are different with a blend of qualities you appreciate in your system is another matter. That said I still heard the differences that I hear in my system in that recent 211 compare I linked to earlier in completely different circuits with different speakers. Interesting indeed.
You do need to be a bit careful I think as there's a real temptation to hype the unobtanium. Claiming that something that is super rare is amazing can, to an extent, go uncontested. A sort of cruel wind up, so to speak.
Marc - I suspect the GEs will last longer than you keep your amps. Get a spare or two just in case, but it wouldn't surprise me if I am right.
I agree with your warning regarding hyping the unobtainable. Furthermore I am told that the (quality of the) input tubes (in my Kagura’s anyway) are more important for the sound quality than the (quality of the) 211 valves. Some claim that the same applies for the rectifiers (2 x 4 in my case). Not sure about the latter; have not experienced with various gz34 tubes. The former (input tubes are more important than 211 valves) makes much sense to me.
Personally I've always found power valves make more difference than any other type of valve in a power or integrated (all valve) amp. Markedly so.
Many don't agree with that viewpoint. But TBH I think they're just plain wrong!
It's a hobby. Don't take it too seriously. We need to accept other people's opinions even when we think they're wrong.
Many don't agree with that viewpoint. But TBH I think they're just plain wrong!
It's a hobby. Don't take it too seriously. We need to accept other people's opinions even when we think they're wrong.
Unfortunately there are many forms of unotainium in this hobby, rarity because of obsolescence is just one. One other that is often seen in this hobby is very restrained manufacture, distribution or no public exhibition.
Anyway the problem is not the unotainium hype itself, but the easy temptation of comparative hype. Although I understand and appreciate that hype is part of the fun in this hobby, the often seen need of permanently comparing unobtainium with easily available products, particularly with much more expensive, can be tiresome. All IMHO, YMMV.
If (hopefully a real top) reproduction - see: http://www.monoandstereo.com/2018/01/western-electric-we-300b-electron-tube.html - is possible for 300B tubes, why not for 211 valves?
We can dream, I guess. The q is, are there many more amps using 300B tubes than 211 tubes? If there are, and it’s tight to make 300B production profitable, than what chance high quality new production 211s?
Next on the WE list will be the KT88 or 6550 I reckon as they were going to do one a few years ago. Why? Because American muscle amps take an absolute mass of them.
There are a lot of contemporary 211s available, though. Just search ebay. I wouldn't like to say they were all a disaster. I heard ELROGs in a AN Tomei, followed by a brief switch to the PsVane WE211 repro (which really doesn't look like the original). It really didn't sound any better or worse than the ELROG in the brief comparison I heard. But it was too brief to make any conclusions. The owner thinks they're good, though. I leant him some RCAs and GEs and he didn't want to pursue either any further. He preferred the GE by the way.
So there we are. Really, just buy what you fancy and see what you like.
There are a lot of contemporary 211s available, though. Just search ebay. I wouldn't like to say they were all a disaster. I heard ELROGs in a AN Tomei, followed by a brief switch to the PsVane WE211 repro (which really doesn't look like the original). It really didn't sound any better or worse than the ELROG in the brief comparison I heard. But it was too brief to make any conclusions. The owner thinks they're good, though. I leant him some RCAs and GEs and he didn't want to pursue either any further. He preferred the GE by the way.
So there we are. Really, just buy what you fancy and see what you like.
What might be worth a mention is that the KR 211, like early 211s, uses (very unusually for current production) metal plates. Not the same metal as the STC, though, I'd bet.
It does sound markedly different to all my carbon plate NOS jobbies. Whether you like it or not is another question, but I'd describe it as relatively bright, dynamic (as in alive sounding with very good portrayal of detail and a lively bass). However, the mid range sounds relatively "thin" compared to the Amperex 211s which is tonally an easier listen and arguably a lot more natural.
They are well made and aren't cheap. Worth considering if you feel your system sounds a bit thick and lacks life, and indeed worth considering just to roll in when you want a change in presentation. Fighting the familiarity breeds contempt aspect that afflicts so many in this hobby, and it is one of the reasons I use valves in all stages of my playback system.
Obligatory KR manufacturing video.
It does sound markedly different to all my carbon plate NOS jobbies. Whether you like it or not is another question, but I'd describe it as relatively bright, dynamic (as in alive sounding with very good portrayal of detail and a lively bass). However, the mid range sounds relatively "thin" compared to the Amperex 211s which is tonally an easier listen and arguably a lot more natural.
They are well made and aren't cheap. Worth considering if you feel your system sounds a bit thick and lacks life, and indeed worth considering just to roll in when you want a change in presentation. Fighting the familiarity breeds contempt aspect that afflicts so many in this hobby, and it is one of the reasons I use valves in all stages of my playback system.
Obligatory KR manufacturing video.
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I finally found four Amperex 211s closely matched/tested. They will be arriving this week. I will be running the Amperex in my Kagura mono amps. Also have two RCAs on the way for the Ongaku. I've been running GE's in both the Ongaku and the Kaguras. Looking forward to the RCAs and Amperex.
I also just set up the TW/Red Sparrow on my VYGER Atlantis and it has rejuvenated me
I also just set up the TW/Red Sparrow on my VYGER Atlantis and it has rejuvenated me
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