Curious, how do you know your grid quality is bad? Does it sound a lot better late at night than during the day? Or have you done any measurements? Thanks
Battery Power
- Thread starter Kingrex
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There are also LTO batteries (Lithium Titanate) which are considered safer than Lithium Ion batteries. This is what Taiko uses in their Olympus server.
I did a bunch more digging. Its not hard to find ststistics on Perplexity. Anyone can confirm data if you prod it 4 or 5 times to confirm results.
It looks like fires with EV cars is 18% to 30% heppen when charging. It appears 25 EV per 100,000 catch fire. Compare that to about 1200 gas cars per 100,000 catch fire. In comparison, per 100,000, there are like 2300 kitchen fires and 600 dryer fires. So EV on the surface seems safe. Buy, you can not put a Lithium battery fire out. Its a blow torch that runs for a long time. I watched a EV burn down the street from my home. I have seen multiple gas cars carch fire that are extinguished quickly. I had one catch fire myself. I tured off the car and it went out
Yes bikes and power tools cause all sorts of fire. I know 2 people who lost their houses due to a Dewalt charger fire. I charge all my battery tools on the concrete floor, away from walls and other stuff. I charge the trolling motor in my boat outdoors.
If a system can be powered by a in room battert/Inverter power supply, it could very well be a much better solution than reworking your electrical. A lot less expensive. It depends on the complexity of getting power to the room.
Remember, you can take your Battery/Inverter with you. And you don't need to change anything with your existing power. And the inveter puts out a more clean, stable and accurate voltage than the wall. And its relatively unlimited in power. Sort of. Easy to have 50A power in your room. Configurable to have 300A outside the room.
After researching I'm still unsure. I don't make money like Taiko. I can't afford a lawyer. If a battery blew and burned a house down, the owner would sue everyone, including me. I don't want the risk when I'm only doing the work as a hobby.
It looks like fires with EV cars is 18% to 30% heppen when charging. It appears 25 EV per 100,000 catch fire. Compare that to about 1200 gas cars per 100,000 catch fire. In comparison, per 100,000, there are like 2300 kitchen fires and 600 dryer fires. So EV on the surface seems safe. Buy, you can not put a Lithium battery fire out. Its a blow torch that runs for a long time. I watched a EV burn down the street from my home. I have seen multiple gas cars carch fire that are extinguished quickly. I had one catch fire myself. I tured off the car and it went out
Yes bikes and power tools cause all sorts of fire. I know 2 people who lost their houses due to a Dewalt charger fire. I charge all my battery tools on the concrete floor, away from walls and other stuff. I charge the trolling motor in my boat outdoors.
If a system can be powered by a in room battert/Inverter power supply, it could very well be a much better solution than reworking your electrical. A lot less expensive. It depends on the complexity of getting power to the room.
Remember, you can take your Battery/Inverter with you. And you don't need to change anything with your existing power. And the inveter puts out a more clean, stable and accurate voltage than the wall. And its relatively unlimited in power. Sort of. Easy to have 50A power in your room. Configurable to have 300A outside the room.
After researching I'm still unsure. I don't make money like Taiko. I can't afford a lawyer. If a battery blew and burned a house down, the owner would sue everyone, including me. I don't want the risk when I'm only doing the work as a hobby.
Good question. Unfortunately, concerning mains audiophiles love to believe in magic and voodoo and seem to hate measurements or technical quantifiable debates.
Fortunately statically most people have adequate mains and do not have problems with mains. But without diagnosing mains and analysing our specific equipment characteristics and system topology, it is hard to recommend anything.
I put a scope on maybe 30 different mains and maybe 10% or less had distortion levels lower than a Victron inverter. Non have a stable 120 volt without fluxuation. Some have a 59 to 59.5 hert sine wave. I don't think I have ever seen a sine wave in a home with the creast of the wave not distorted on the leading edge. Many have a DC component but that is much harder to measure when coupled to the AC. You need special probes on the volt meter to idolate and accurately measure it. But a humming toroid transformer is a pretty good indicator its there.
In short, its very easy to measure the power at your wall and power from a inverter to know which is better. A good inverter gives a near perfect sine wave that is rock solid stable at 120 volts.
Clear and interesting claim. Since long inverters were on my interests in the highend audio, we had a long and inconclusive debate in WBF triggered by Steve Williams comments on his solar power system, but I have not need able to find the technical data needed to discuss it. At that time I asked several inverter manufacturers for more complete datasheets on their performance and could not get it. Can you point us to such data?
Accurate and stable voltage - easy to debate. But "clean" is mainly a word to be used in washing machines ...
Victron data sheets publish their inverters are less than 3 percent THD. Same for Exeltech. Exeltech publishes they are closer to 1 8% under load. If you look around the off grid community, there are plenty of videos where people have a scope attached to their setup. Plenty of video show prople loading and overloading inverters. Usually with a bunch of space heaters A overloaded high frequency inverter sine wave looks highly distorted. But then again, I measured a branch wire at a home on utility power with 2 Shunyata Denali on the branch and the wire had 18%THD and was very distorted. Part of the reason I advocate multiple branch wires to the rack. Part of why 2 inverters and 2 batteries to 2 power strips would be a good way to feed a stereo.
Victron has a 20,000 switching FET that turns the DC to AC, then a large copper core step up transformer boosting the voltage for 24 to 120 volts. 20,000 is right in the sweet spot of a Puritan filter and I assume most any other filter. I don't see any reason you can't have a absolute distortion free 120 volt power supply at the rack.
A battert with a 100A DC fuse on the DC cable to inverter. A AC cable, less than 3 feet with a female plug from the inverter going into a filter with a CB or fused IEC inlet.
A single 100AH battery at 24 volts is 2400 watts. Run to 80% thats 1900 watts reaerve run time. Constant draw of 500 watts is a solid 3 hours. Add a secod battery its 6 hours. If you got desperate, turn the charger back on. Run indefinitely.
Inverter is about $1500. each. battery about $1400 each. Chargers $500 each. Cables about $500. Your done. Take it with you when you move.
Well, I address proper measurements, not a scope. We would need at less a measurement of distortion spectra, a wide band spectra of RF noise and measurements of transient behaviour.
And sorry, for me amateur videos are not proof of anything.
IMO percent THD only shows how poor are some inverters - not how good they are.
If it shows how poor a inverter power supply is. Isn't it then showing how poor your utility power supply is when that has worse performance.
Buy an inverter and battery and do all the measurements you want. While you're at it, you should probably measure your QSA duplexes and fuses. And all the fancy power cables in your system.
You could also just plug it in and listen to it. You could also buy a Goal Zero and listen to it. Use the Goal Zero as emergency power or for taking to the park if you need it.
Sound quality of my system has declined dramatically over the last year and I have not changed a thing. Yes, there is a difference between daylight and late in the night.
Bass definition, depth and articulation, instrument separation, detail, microdinamics, presence, soundstage, holography and overall musicality and enjoyment has reduced dramatically.
Sound is now harsh and piercing, can't turn up the volume.
My system is pretty modest but it was super good, I could sit for hours non stop at high volumes.
I have not done any measurements but I live right in the middle of a big city.
PS: Forgot to mention. From 9pm it began to open up in a big way and it continued to get better and better until it's peak at 12:30 am. Sundays it sounded good all day. Now it's horrible pretty much all the time and in the evening it's unlisenable. I'm not imagining things I know what i'm hearing!!
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I have done it all at that time - the inverters I could test had poor performance. I could not get the same inverter Steve was using in his house, I forgot about it.
Currently I am happy with my mains, it is good quality. Besides I now retired and do not have access to a RF spectrum analyser anymore. BTW, power cables show differences in RF measurements but I could not correlate it with sound attributes.
@Kingrex - again, there is a very low fire risk from LiFePO4 batteries. I would be more worried about the inverter quality in the battery. The HOBOTECH youtube channel does a very comprehensive review of solar generators/batteries. At 12:40 minutes into this video he checks the inverter quality for audio and EMI noise.
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