Bayz Audio Counterpoint 2.0 >>>>Rhapsody.Audio

Rhapsody

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Jan 16, 2013
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Rhapsody.Audio
Hi gds,

Regarding the Counterpoint pricing -

The Counterpoint's manufacturing process including every component of the finished product as you move up in size from the granite bases with protruding adjustable spikes in the Counterpoint footers, to the almost twice the size of the specially manufactured carbon fiber tubes, to the larger size of the BRS (Bay Radial Speaker) tweeter all are more challenging regarding manufacturing.

It is not as simple as just saying make it twice the size, there is a lot involved in the manufacturing of the much larger and heavier Counterpoint.

Also if you hear the Courante and the Counterpoint then the price difference is easily understood mostly in scale of the sound.

The Counterpoint's price is easily justified with ANY competitor at it's price point regarding sonic performance and a bargain compared to many speakers at 2X or 3X it's price.
 

Zoltan Bay

Industry Expert
Mar 7, 2020
61
54
85
67
Dear Zoltan
Your design is a paradigm shifter an industry disruptor. Good for you! I certainly look forward to hearing about your new models. And maybe hearing them in Warsaw next year.

I designing electronics now according to my original profession, we'll be maybe with the new electronics in Warsaw next year. This has arisen in this year too.
 

infinitely baffled

VIP/Donor
Jul 2, 2015
1,259
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Scotland
I designing electronics now according to my original profession, we'll be maybe with the new electronics in Warsaw next year. This has arisen in this year too.
Any general hints on the power amplifier design?
I like the practice of speaker manufacturers offering complementary amplifiers, optimised for their speaker's requirements.
 

Zoltan Bay

Industry Expert
Mar 7, 2020
61
54
85
67
Hi gds,

Regarding the Counterpoint pricing -

The Counterpoint's manufacturing process including every component of the finished product as you move up in size from the granite bases with protruding adjustable spikes in the Counterpoint footers, to the almost twice the size of the specially manufactured carbon fiber tubes, to the larger size of the BRS (Bay Radial Speaker) tweeter all are more challenging regarding manufacturing.

It is not as simple as just saying make it twice the size, there is a lot involved in the manufacturing of the much larger and heavier Counterpoint.

Also if you hear the Courante and the Counterpoint then the price difference is easily understood mostly in scale of the sound.

The Counterpoint's price is easily justified with ANY competitor at it's price point regarding sonic performance and a bargain compared to many speakers at 2X or 3X it's price.

Thank you Bob! The cost, as well as the surface, increases quadratic.........
 
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Zoltan Bay

Industry Expert
Mar 7, 2020
61
54
85
67
Any general hints on the power amplifier design?
I like the practice of speaker manufacturers offering complementary amplifiers, optimised for their speaker's requirements.


I strongly disagree with this, you should not optimize one device for another because it will not properly work with the other devices. Devices must be able to work perfectly with other devices too.
 
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infinitely baffled

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Jul 2, 2015
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Fair enough
 

gds7368

VIP/Donor
Jan 9, 2015
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420
Hi gds,

Regarding the Counterpoint pricing -

The Counterpoint's manufacturing process including every component of the finished product as you move up in size from the granite bases with protruding adjustable spikes in the Counterpoint footers, to the almost twice the size of the specially manufactured carbon fiber tubes, to the larger size of the BRS (Bay Radial Speaker) tweeter all are more challenging regarding manufacturing.

It is not as simple as just saying make it twice the size, there is a lot involved in the manufacturing of the much larger and heavier Counterpoint.

Also if you hear the Courante and the Counterpoint then the price difference is easily understood mostly in scale of the sound.

The Counterpoint's price is easily justified with ANY competitor at it's price point regarding sonic performance and a bargain compared to many speakers at 2X or 3X it's price.
Excellent info. Looking forward to hearing them. Thank you!
 
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Zoltan Bay

Industry Expert
Mar 7, 2020
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Here is a video with the Bayz Counterpoints playing and also a nice description of the speakers.


A comment:

?Peter Breuninger? Zoltan Bay

Stay home, stay safe! Listen to music, tweak your system and watch and listen to AVshowrooms videos! We are going to start publishing the Floridia Audio Expo Videos soon. But before that check out what may be the best sounding video we ever made!
 
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Bayz-Audio

Member
Mar 18, 2020
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www.bayz-audio.eu
Where in Denmark are you located ?
Just noticed you are from Denmark so you will know about Herning. You have MBL today according to your profile picture?
I live in Denmark you are very welcome to contact me about potential demo or anything else. +4530152080 (anyone)
 

Lagonda

VIP/Donor
Feb 3, 2014
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Denmark
Just noticed you are from Denmark so you will know about Herning. You have MBL today according to your profile picture?
I live in Denmark you are very welcome to contact me about potential demo or anything else. +4530152080 (anyone)
I will definitely come and have a listen when this virus thing passes.
For now i am staying home, like the
Queen told us to ! ;)
 

Beachman

Well-Known Member
Mar 20, 2020
30
31
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Infinitely baffled: apologies for the late response. For the foreseeable future, the Counterpoint will remain the flagship of Bayz Audio.

While our lead over our competitors is protected by our patent on the Bayz Radial Speaker (patented in the EU, US, Japan, China, and India), the Counterpoint and Courante are constantly being improved. Our current versions are "v2" so to speak.
 
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infinitely baffled

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sbo6

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May 18, 2014
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Round Rock, TX
Beautiful speakers, kudos for the creativity and superb engineering! The woofers' cancelling and the lightweight enclosure to mitigate resonances remind me of what Vivid Audio does and IME is very effective. Next time I'm in N.Y. I will certainly check them out. Congrats!
 

Rhapsody

VIP/Donor
Jan 16, 2013
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Brooklyn NY
Rhapsody.Audio
Beautiful speakers, kudos for the creativity and superb engineering! The woofers' cancelling and the lightweight enclosure to mitigate resonances remind me of what Vivid Audio does and IME is very effective. Next time I'm in N.Y. I will certainly check them out. Congrats!

Look forward to meeting you in the future!
 
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musicfirst1

VIP/Donor
Mar 8, 2015
504
309
395
Canada
www.musicfirstdistribution.ca
I have been the owner of the new Courante 2.0 loudspeaker for less than a week. As of this writing, they have approximately 60 hours on them.

In addition to the Courantes, I have also heard the Counterpoint 2.0s under show conditions at AXPONA in 2019 for approximately 30 minutes during an uncharacteristic slow time on Thursday for both the show and especially the room, which was understandably packed for the rest of the show.

Please realize that all of the comments below are based on only 60 hours of break-in.

The Courantes continue to break-in and the woofers continue to show daily improvements in both the dynamics and bass control as well as the coherency between the mid-bass drivers and the remarkable Bayz Radial Speaker (BRS).

The preliminary impressions thus far are that, together with its bigger brothers, the Courante 2.0s offer the best dynamics, resolution, musicality, and presence as compared to all other speakers we’ve ever heard.

For me, the biggest thing separating reproduction from the real thing has been the dynamic characteristics of tweeter designs over the years. My first high end speaker was the ESS Heil AMT 1Bs which I bought as a young man in the 1970s, with the legendary Heil Air Motion Transformer tweeter; and while the speaker was flawed in other ways, the dynamic characteristics of that very special tweeter went unmatched for decades. That is until now - and not only has it been matched by the BRS, but easily exceeded, and by a large margin.

One of the most stunning aspects of the BRS is how closely it dynamically couples to the mid-bass drivers. Female vocals and the top 2-3 octaves of the piano are reproduced much better than any previous tweeter implementation before, conventional or otherwise, not only dynamically, but also with unrivaled image density and palpability from around 100Hz all the way past the limits of anyone’s hearing.

With my admittedly limited experience with the Counterpoints, the bigger speakers seem to improve the bottom extension significantly. In addition, the presence, resolution and top to bottom dynamics, already a hallmark of the Courantes, are taken up several levels. The image on the bigger Counterpoints is also larger, with improved micro layering, image density, dimensionality and significantly improved image height.

However, it is the music lover in me that is truly excited. After searching and hearing all of the ‘who’s who’ of speaker designs and contenders for world’s best of the past 45 years; I feel that the Bayz audio designs have broken away from the rest of the pack and represent a true sea-change in music reproduction, regardless of the type of speaker design. And all of this is not at the expense of musicality, but rather in the service of it! No other speaker is as beguiling musically—inviting the listener into the performance and engaging with and immersing them with the artists' intent—while still providing all of the above world class attributes.

I have been a fan and follower of the greatest speaker designers of our time; Arnie Nuddell, Dr. Oscar Heil, Andrew Jones, and Franco Serblin to name but a few. Now, those with careful ears must certainly add Zoltan Bay to that distinguished list, and I, for one, nominate moving him to the very top of it.

If you want to hear something truly special, dramatically better and different from ALL the rest, you MUST hear what these speakers can do: either at a show, at a friends, at Bob's or at my place, before your next purchase. And even if they are outside your budget, just to re-calibrate your ears as to what's possible.

Because material science and components will continue to improve, the state of the art in speakers will move as well. After owning literally dozens of speakers throughout the years, there will no doubt be other designs that will entice me down the road; however, I am quite certain that for me, most, if not all of these designs, will come from the brilliant mind of Zoltan Bay.

I will keep all of you posted.

Kerry Legeard
Music First Distribution
Ontario Canada
03/31/2020
 
Last edited:

John57

Well-Known Member
Sep 29, 2015
237
39
260
Melbourne, Australia
I have been the owner of the new Courante 2.0 loudspeaker for less than a week. As of this writing, they have approximately 60 hours on them.

In addition to the Courantes, I have also heard the Counterpoint 2.0s under show conditions at AXPONA in 2019 for approximately 30 minutes during an uncharacteristic slow time on Thursday for both the show and especially the room, which was understandably packed for the rest of the show.

Please realize that all of the comments below are based on only 60 hours of break-in.

The Courantes continue to break-in and the woofers continue to show daily improvements in both the dynamics and bass control as well as the coherency between the mid-bass drivers and the remarkable Bayz Radial Speaker (BRS).

The preliminary impressions thus far are that, together with its bigger brothers, the Courante 2.0s offer the best dynamics, resolution, musicality, and presence as compared to all other speakers we’ve ever heard.

For me, the biggest thing separating reproduction from the real thing has been the dynamic characteristics of tweeter designs over the years. My first high end speaker was the ESS Heil AMT 1Bs which I bought as a young man in the 1970s, with the legendary Heil Air Motion Transformer tweeter; and while the speaker was flawed in other ways, the dynamic characteristics of that very special tweeter went unmatched for decades. That is until now - and not only has it been matched by the BRS, but easily exceeded, and by a large margin.

One of the most stunning aspects of the BRS is how closely it dynamically couples to the mid-bass drivers. Female vocals and the top 2-3 octaves of the piano are reproduced much better than any previous tweeter implementation before, conventional or otherwise, not only dynamically, but also with unrivaled image density and palpability from around 100Hz all the way past the limits of anyone’s hearing.

With my admittedly limited experience with the Counterpoints, the bigger speakers seem to improve the bottom extension significantly. In addition, the presence, resolution and top to bottom dynamics, already a hallmark of the Courantes, are taken up several levels. The image on the bigger Counterpoints is also larger, with improved micro layering, image density, dimensionality and significantly improved image height.

However, it is the music lover in me that is truly excited. After searching and hearing all of the ‘who’s who’ of speaker designs and contenders for world’s best of the past 45 years; I feel that the Bayz audio designs have broken away from the rest of the pack and represent a true sea-change in music reproduction, regardless of the type of speaker design. And all of this is not at the expense of musicality, but rather in the service of it! No other speaker is as beguiling musically—inviting the listener into the performance and engaging with and immersing them with the artists' intent—while still providing all of the above world class attributes.

I have been a fan and follower of the greatest speaker designers of our time; Arnie Nuddell, Dr. Oscar Heil, Andrew Jones, and Franco Serblin to name but a few. Now, those with careful ears must certainly add Zoltan Bay to that distinguished list, and I, for one, nominate moving him to the very top of it.

Because material science and components will continue to improve, the state of the art in speakers will move as well. After owning literally dozens of speakers throughout the years, there will no doubt be other designs that will entice me down the road; however, I am quite certain that for me, most, if not all of these designs, will come from the brilliant mind of Zoltan Bay.

I will keep all of you posted.

Kerry Legeard
Music First Distribution
Ontario Canada
03/31/2020
A devoted review and thank you for sharing with us your experiences so far to date. Can you share with us the electronics used. Especially amplification. Are you having an experience or preferences for amps best suited to the Bayz designs?
 

musicfirst1

VIP/Donor
Mar 8, 2015
504
309
395
Canada
www.musicfirstdistribution.ca
A devoted review and thank you for sharing with us your experiences so far to date. Can you share with us the electronics used. Especially amplification. Are you having an experience or preferences for amps best suited to the Bayz designs?
Laufer Teknik 32 Core Memory Player - Mutec MC3+ USB Smart Reclocker x 2 - Mutec REF10 Master Clock - Metrum Acoustics Adadio NOS DAC Pre - Audionet MAX Monoblocks - Siltech Princess 35th Silver Anniversary Interconnect and Ear To Ear PCs and Speaker Cables - Torus Power TOT MAX on Server DACs and clocks- Entreq Poseidens, Hallographs and Schumann Resonators throughout - Entire system running on 240 volts AC balanced power. Each amplifier and the Torus TOT MAX are fed by 20 amp dedicated circuits using 8-3 shielded Romex from the panel box to a Furutech GTX-D R duplex outlet.Reference Tracks KOB Flamenco Sketches for Imaging; Patricia Barber Ode to Billy Joe for Mid-bass detail. Natalie Merchant Live (Gulf of Araby and Ophelia) for Tweeter torture test.

The Audionet MAX Monoblocks (on loan from a friend) are monsters @ 700wpc into 4 ohms, and the best SS amps I've heard, with the exception Audionet's own Heisenbergs. The Max's will drive speakers with efficiencies into the low 80s, and I'm sure the Courantes at 90db, nor the Counterpoints at 94db don't need all that power, but the amps are epic! I love them, not because of the power, but because they are, to my ear, the best of the best SS (I'm sure the power has more than a little to do with the incredible performance). Having said this, I have not heard Zoltan's amps (except briefly at AXPONA), but sure would love to hear more of them..;-)
 
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Zoltan Bay

Industry Expert
Mar 7, 2020
61
54
85
67
Beautiful speakers, kudos for the creativity and superb engineering! The woofers' cancelling and the lightweight enclosure to mitigate resonances remind me of what Vivid Audio does and IME is very effective. Next time I'm in N.Y. I will certainly check them out. Congrats!

Thank you! I think Bob will be excellent host of you, if the pandemic is over.
 
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