Dartzeel Preamp Hiss

[howiebrou]

Audible noise means it isn't modulating the original signal, so I disagree that it's always inherently bad. Some beloved amplifiers are simply "noisy", and they are revered anyways. If you have modulating noise and audible noise, that matters. In general I'd say if you can't hear it anywhere near the listening position it isn't an issue so long as it isn't a hum.

Hum does mean a loop typically, so I agree there, that is usually affecting the signal. Once again, I say, try disconnecting the PSU and listen (the battery will be charged and last for a long time, then just plug it in between listens).

Will do. Fortunately there is no hum just quiet hiss now inaudible from a foot away and quieter than my Kondom1000 mk 2 and Kaguras.

 

[howiebrou]

Hiss can be from the design itself, or from a ground-loop picking up RF.

Try disconnecting the preamp cables at the amp and if it still hisses, then it's the amp itself. Best to short the inputs as well if you can.

If the hiss goes away with no preamp connected, then it's a ground-loop. This can be fixed with isolation or lifting grounds, which I don't recommend. A good transformer isolator is a Final Drive which can do balanced or SE or combinations.

Is the connection between the pre and the amp balanced or Single-ended?

Steve N.

It's balanced, thanks. I wonder if a proper power distribution like a Shunyata Denali or a regenerator might help?

 

[Folsom]

Try what I suggest first. Doing so will eliminate a lot of variables. Changing the power source adds more.

You could even see if gain affects it the same without the powercord connected, but being on.

If you try it, I'll stay on top of this thread to see what can be done - or if there is anything necessary to be concerned with.

 

[Elliot G.]

Thanks for your thoughts. Yes they might not be the perfect match but they do sound good! I guess the Dart 468 must be the best match which is why I tend to have matching amp and preamp. Unfortunately Analog Domain doesn't make a preamp.

I remember Spectral products had different input impedance and gain than many other items and so they played well together not so well in many cases with others. This is very much like the company owner LOL . I am a fan of matched amp and preamp myself along with a full cable system. When this doesn't occur and you are not happy its hit and miss as to what to fix or change. I see many looking for a component or a tweek to "fix" the issues that they themselves have created.

 

[microstrip]

It's balanced, thanks. I wonder if a proper power distribution like a Shunyata Denali or a regenerator might help?

According to Stereophile the A weighted signal to noise ratio of the NHB18 is around 80 dB, the Audio Research REF6 or the Pass Laboratories XP-22 are around 100 dB, I would not expect miracles in this hiss aspect.

BTW, I have found in the past that the sound of the old NHB18 in balanced mode was inferior to the balanced mode. This aspect was also significantly improved in the latest version.

 

[howiebrou]

According to Stereophile the A weighted signal to noise ratio of the NHB18 is around 80 dB, the Audio Research REF6 or the Pass Laboratories XP-22 are around 100 dB, I would not expect miracles in this hiss aspect.

BTW, I have found in the past that the sound of the old NHB18 in balanced mode was inferior to the balanced mode. This aspect was also significantly improved in the latest version.

I presume you mean balanced was inferior to rca?

 

[howiebrou]

I remember Spectral products had different input impedance and gain than many other items and so they played well together not so well in many cases with others. This is very much like the company owner LOL . I am a fan of matched amp and preamp myself along with a full cable system. When this doesn't occur and you are not happy its hit and miss as to what to fix or change. I see many looking for a component or a tweek to "fix" the issues that they themselves have created.

Noted and i certainly don't want to create a forced marriage situation!

 

[howiebrou]

Try what I suggest first. Doing so will eliminate a lot of variables. Changing the power source adds more.

You could even see if gain affects it the same without the powercord connected, but being on.

If you try it, I'll stay on top of this thread to see what can be done - or if there is anything necessary to be concerned with.

Yes i will. I'm just happy to listen to music but will try unplugging the power supply and see if anything changes but like i said the hiss is pretty much inaudible now.

 

[Sencha]

Hey Howie, are you planning on trying the 468’s?

 

[howiebrou]

Hey Howie, are you planning on trying the 468’s?

I certainly hope so as that would be the natural partner with the preamp. It could be dangerous though....

 

[XV-1]

I certainly hope so as that would be the natural partner with the preamp. It could be dangerous though....

Do it Howie. You know you want to

 

[Sencha]

I’ve never had the pleasure to hear the 458’s never mind the 468’s. They are waaaaay out of my price range but would love to hear how you get on with them.

 

[howiebrou]

I’ve never had the pleasure to hear the 458’s never mind the 468’s. They are waaaaay out of my price range but would love to hear how you get on with them.

They are also a bit out of my price range but with a snip here and a snip there and some creative accounting, there might be a way but first i need to be convinced!

 

[Sencha]

Knowing what the little 108 can do Howie I don’t think it will take much convincing but you never know.

 

[dandylinpsst]

Hey Howie :
I have the same problem as you.
My system :dartzeel NHB18 mkii+boulder 2060+rockport aquila
MY old pre-amp is boulder 1011.It is really dark and silence.
but nhb18 mkii will let speaker make big "hiss".
I can’t understand the dead quiet Michael Fremer review.

I will pay attention to your solution.

 

[howiebrou]

Update. I just got in a home demo Trinity Golden Reference Preamp to compare with the Dartzeel. The Trinity is dead quiet so given that everything else is the same, it must just be how the Dart is. The Dart is, i remind you, not loud but it is audible for a short distance away.

More concerning, and i was warned, is that the Trinity is much more highly resolving than the Dart without being analytical, which is often the case. The Dart still sounds lovely and i could happily live with it, especially given i love its looks and wanted one for about a decade. But the Trinity is really something else. I am not sure if i like its looks that much but it is an incredible preamp that just sounds right. Even my 11 year old son and 10 year old daughter immediately asked me (without knowing which was playing) why one seemed muffled and less detailed (that was the Dart).

Unfortunately the Trinity is not cheap at all. MSRP is 53k Euros plus 20k Euros for the optional PSU. On sound alone it wins, unfortunately, as i so much wanted there to be no discernible difference.

 

[Elliot G.]

Have you tried an L1/X1 with an M 1.1 ?
Just asking since you are in the price range

 

[howiebrou]

Have you tried an L1/X1 with an M 1.1 ?
Just asking since you are in the price range

Not yet. I am hoping too but i sometimes worry the CH path is long and tortuous and i will end up with 16 chassis! It is certainly on my short list, thanks.

 

[microstrip]

I presume you mean balanced was inferior to rca?

Yes. Balanced was inferior to RCA or BNC. I mistype the sentence, unfortunately I can't edit it anymore ...

 

[howiebrou]

Yes. Balanced was inferior to RCA or BNC. I mistype the sentence, unfortunately I can't edit it anymore ...

Does anyone actually use the 50ohm BNC on the new one or is balanced the way to go now? I thought the 50hm was a hark back to Playback designs but no longer competitive?