Degritter ultrasonic record cleaner

Hi y’all, just a few words on what I think is a worthy alternative to the Audio Desk Systeme and KLAudio ultrasonic cleaners.

http://degritter.com/media-kit/

I’ve been a beta tester on the Degritter for the last few weeks, and am happy to offer my opinions and answer any qs for those interested.

I believe official launch is in early May, and at this stage after a couple of quibbles in day to day use, I’m planning to keep my unit, it’s been a pretty good success, and invaluable addition to day to day life as a vinyl addict.

 

• Dual water tank to wash first with cleaning fluid and then rinse with clean water.
• Smart ultrasonic frequency - dual frequencies of 80 kHz and 120 kHz with the first for larger particles and the latter for the best sparkling results.
• More transducers - 6 altogether to be precises - for more powerful ultrasonic cleaning.

Interesting. Nice to see a company willing to advance, not just at its periphery a la Klaudio, but at its core desjgn.

Dual frequency, 6 transducers and a rinse tank. 'Dual water tank' sounds like it means rinse occurs in the same tank as wash which maintains a smaller footprint using external water storage tanks. If separate wash and rinse tanks, then maybe 2 rotisseries possibly with the additional transducers in the rinse tank. If same wash and rinse tank then perhaps 3 transducers on each side or additional 2 on the bottom Might depend on whether each transducer is dual frequency or single frequency.

Heat issue could be somewhat mitigated if water capacity is increased. Or as @dminches does by using a radiator. Maybe it will have a better filter. Cleaning the working wash tank is still an issue.

Presumably one record at a time. Brian, what is your full cycle time?

 

It typically adds up to 12 minutes for wash, rinse, dry.

 

There is a big difference between Medium cycle 3:45 and Heavy 6:45. Assuming no other heat losses the Degritter 300W power into 1.4L could theoretically heat the water 5.5F/min. With losses it's likely about 3.5-4F/min, so sequential Heavy cycles are going to trigger a cooling cycle. Triggering the cooling cycle with sequential Heavy cycles is a good indication the machine ultrasonics are working.

When I watched the Fremer video which showed the new design, my impression was that it was two separate tanks - one for wash, the other for rinse. This is not difficult to manage with the pump and some valves; but some cross contamination cleaner carryover to the rinse tank is inevitable. Also, the impression I got was that the power was the same 300W.

However, the benefit of the 80kHz for heavy cleaning (pre-clean) is likely over-stated. Consider that the difference between 80kHz and 120kHz which is 1.5; but the actual wavelength difference is 19.1mm vs 12.7mm; its not that big a difference. Now consider the difference between the 37kHz/80kHz Elmasonic which is 2.2; but the wavelength difference is 41.3mm vs 19.1mm - that's a big difference. The 37-40kHz frequency is a good frequency for pre-clean while the 80-120kHz is good for final clean.

 

But, I'd think cross-contamination is inevitable regardless. For example, I still see foaming during the first rotation of my rinse cycle with a fresh tank of pure distilled water. If you say the frequencies they've selected are unlikely to offer significant improvement, though, then I likely wouldn't upgrade. Dual tanks aren't needed when I can easily swap tanks manually.

 

Here is M.Fremer's look at the new Degritter at Munich. Starts 11:35

Looks like two water tanks, one rotisserie, transducers mount on the sides.

 

Sounds cool, but my immediate concern is heat with 6 transducers. Currently with the roughly 1/3 gallon tank, I can degas and run two records through on "Heavy" before the water needs to cool. Unless the total cumulative power dissipated doesn't increase with the additional transducers, then I sure hope they increase the tank sizes. That said, when I need to do a batch of records, the cooling delays give me a good excuse to discard the water every two records and refill with fresh.

Is that what Degritter recommends?!! Changing the water every two records? I change my water on my KLaudio may be after 100 records.

 

Is that what Degritter recommends?!! Changing the water every two records? I change my water on my KLaudio may be after 100 records.

Just for clarification, that's not what @bazelio is saying. He's talking about that he needs to allow the unit to cool-off after cleaning 2-records with a Heavy cycle. The Degritter monitors the water temp and if it reaches 35C it automatically goes into a cooldown mode. As I wrote above, the Degritter with 1.4L water and 300W can heat that water. From some photos I have seen of the KLAudio internals it may have a cooling radiator. Klaudio LP200 Ultrasonic Record Cleaner - Driver Board Replacement - Audionirvana.org

 

But, I'd think cross-contamination is inevitable regardless. For example, I still see foaming during the first rotation of my rinse cycle with a fresh tank of pure distilled water. If you say the frequencies they've selected are unlikely to offer significant improvement, though, then I likely wouldn't upgrade. Dual tanks aren't needed when I can easily swap tanks manually.

Hold off on any conclusion until they actually issue the final design; more than likely it will change.

 

When I run my Elmasonic P-120H at 37 kHz for 10 minutes the temperature will go from 30C to 35C. When I do the 2nd 10 minute cycle at 80 kHz I run the pump which sends the liquid through a 3 fan aluminum radiator which cools the temperatures to 31-32C by the end of the cycle. Doing this I can clean multiple sets of LPs (5 at a time) and not worry about overheating.

 

@Neil.Antin , thank you for the correct clarification. My particular unit's cooling cycle is kicking in at 33C, and I expect the starting temp to be close to ambient which is ~24C. So 24C to 33C after roughly two heavy cycles with a ~6 minute "lid off" gap between them.

 

Just for clarification, that's not what @bazelio is saying. He's talking about that he needs to allow the unit to cool-off after cleaning 2-records with a Heavy cycle. The Degritter monitors the water temp and if it reaches 35C it automatically goes into a cooldown mode. As I wrote above, the Degritter with 1.4L water and 300W can heat that water. From some photos I have seen of the KLAudio internals it may have a cooling radiator. Klaudio LP200 Ultrasonic Record Cleaner - Driver Board Replacement - Audionirvana.org

I thought Bazelio did say that he changes the water after cleaning two records? I guess that does certainly keep the water clean!

 

I thought Bazelio did say that he changes the water after cleaning two records? I guess that does certainly keep the water clean!

Yes, due to my impatience in waiting for the cooling cycle. I said it "gives me an excuse" to change the water after two records - which I'd probably not do otherwise. But the flip side is exactly what you said - I'm generally using clean water.

 

Yes, due to my impatience in waiting for the cooling cycle. I said it "gives me an excuse" to change the water after two records - which I'd probably not do otherwise. But the flip side is exactly what you said - I'm generally using clean water.

Thanks. I was considering the Degritter when my Klaudio packs in (touch wood) since they are not made anymore, but now not so sure if it needs cooling down so often. I will often clean 10 + records in a row. Apart from that it does look like a great product.

 

Thanks. I was considering the Degritter when my Klaudio packs in (touch wood) since they are not made anymore, but now not so sure if it needs cooling down so often. I will often clean 10 + records in a row. Apart from that it does look like a great product.

You could use the Medium cycle on the Degritter to avoid such frequent cooling. But with Heavy, the Degritter runs a cooling cycle with its fan after a couple records, which seems to incur about a 5 minute delay. I just prefer to dump the tank, refill, and resume cleaning.

 

Thanks. I was considering the Degritter when my Klaudio packs in (touch wood) since they are not made anymore, but now not so sure if it needs cooling down so often. I will often clean 10 + records in a row. Apart from that it does look like a great product.

KLAudio is back in business - Klaudio-Vinyl LP Record Ultrasonic Cleaner With Dryer External Reservoir-Record Cleaning Machine|Acoustic Sounds

 

KLAudio is back in business - Klaudio-Vinyl LP Record Ultrasonic Cleaner With Dryer External Reservoir-Record Cleaning Machine|Acoustic Sounds

Thanks. Interesting that they don't seem to have brought back the integrated water reservoir version.

 

Thanks. Interesting that they don't seem to have brought back the integrated water reservoir version.

Here ya go Howie,

KLAudio returns - new KD-CLN-LP200T RCM

KLAudio is back with a new RCM: the KD-CLN-LP200T. Looks like it continues to be made in Korea. $6000 available at Acoustic Sounds who is the distributor. Sounds like AS had a hand in returning KL to the marketplace. https://store.acousticsounds.com/c/88/Record_Cleaning_Machine There is...

www.whatsbestforum.com

 

Here ya go Howie,

KLAudio returns - new KD-CLN-LP200T RCM

KLAudio is back with a new RCM: the KD-CLN-LP200T. Looks like it continues to be made in Korea. $6000 available at Acoustic Sounds who is the distributor. Sounds like AS had a hand in returning KL to the marketplace. https://store.acousticsounds.com/c/88/Record_Cleaning_Machine There is...

www.whatsbestforum.com

Thanks. Missed that. It mentioned that distilled water is not recommended. I thought the original stated you HAD to use distilled water which is what I have been using for years. Better look for my manual to check!

Edit: All the reviews of the old machine have indicated Distilled water (or RO water) is recommended. I wonder what has changed?

 

If interested I am selling mine (has cleaned 1862 records, I have a counter). Perfect working and look. Original crate. Feel free to ask.

 

I am not sure if this is the thread for this, but this is my experience with Audio Desk Systeme ultrasonic cleaners. They are a marvelous record cleaner and sure do a good job of cleaning records. My first one lasted approximately 2 years before the water pump motor stopped working and I was informed that they were unable to be repaired because they are glued together. I live in Australia and freighting it back to the manufacturers was not an option, so I'm using it as a boat anchor. I did like the job it did on the records so purchased the new improved Pro Version. Now after a further two years the motor that drives the scrubber brushes has decided to no longer work. So, I now have an anchor for the front and back of the boat. $10,000 is expensive for anchors.
I will never purchase another one and am trialing the Kirmuss system.
So, a word of warning about reliability!!!