Does Everything Make a Difference?

[rblnr]

and we all started out with completely dedicated spaces. my point is more state of mind that we were not going to compromise. with anything. does not mean we all cookie cutter, but that we are not into settling. which is a lifestyle choice ultimately that is not real world for most. these investments are also anchors too. so not for most people on a number of levels.

so everything matters starts at the core of your hobby viewpoint. is that how you really, really view things? not saying non dedicated room system people don't also think everything matters, but it's different in some ways. of course, there are an infinite number of reasons not to have a dedicated room, and many have little to do with desire.....or attitudes toward everything matters. but some do.

I have a dedicated room (and in the middle of building a new one in our new house), but am not a believer in the everything matters viewpoint obviously. Agreed, that viewpoint is a state of mind, leave no tiny pebble unturned, but feeding the mindset isn’t the same as improving performance. See my feeling about rhodium outlets, et al

 

[Neoteric]

“This listening performance was made in front of a live audience!” Lol! Everything matters, if by that you mean, can it be detected? I’m sure everything you mentioned can be detected by a machine calibrated to measure it. Listening subjectively and then trying to define (and often defend) it empirically is a sucker’s game. As has been said here previously, everything makes a difference, but whether or not that difference has meaning depends on whatever the individual is processing in the moment.

 

[twitch]

I think everything could matter, but don’t forget to get into the music and forget the gear. Otherwise, it (or you) is in the way!

This is the classic example of 'Audiophile' extremes IMO. Having been in this hobby for many decades and with the proliferation of numerous 'audio forums' where 'gear' is the primary focal point of discussion, music and the enjoyment of it very often takes a back seat.

regardless, to each his own ........

 

[Mike Lavigne]

I have a dedicated room (and in the middle of building a new one in our new house), but am not a believer in the everything matters viewpoint obviously. Agreed, that viewpoint is a state of mind, leave no tiny pebble unturned, but feeding the mindset isn’t the same as improving performance. See my feeling about rhodium outlets, et al

i prefer Rhodium myself when i have compared if i have to choose, but nothing religious about it. maybe part of it is the darTZeel has a bit of tube sound. other ss might be less compatible with Rhodium. but i'm just guessing on that particular question. that's more a matter of taste/preference than better/worse. it's flavor.

 

[Ron Resnick]

Hi, Marty. It could be Ron's way of saying that his x-nfrmr buzzes in his DAC and he has an old 1980 "flip" clock that interrupts his music every minute when it flips.

View attachment 121338


Ron?

Tom

Tom, you are so right! I thought it was a scratch on my record I was hearing every 60 seconds, but it was my Lafayette flip clock radio!

 

[Rt66indierock]

This thread is terrific. But you are forgetting a few things.

• The limits of human hearing.
• The limits of human perception
• The effects of aging on hearing ability

You guys carry on.

 

[Kingrex]

This thread is terrific. But you are forgetting a few things.

• The limits of human hearing.
• The limits of human perception
• The effects of aging on hearing ability

You guys carry on.

What?

 

[Kingrex]

Tom, you are so right! I thought it was a scratch on my record I was hearing every 60 seconds, but it was my Lafayette flip clock radio!

My 8 track still flips in the middle of Peter Frampton. Bugs me every time.

 

[Kingrex]

i prefer Rhodium myself when i have compared if i have to choose, but nothing religious about it. maybe part of it is the darTZeel has a bit of tube sound. other ss might be less compatible with Rhodium. but i'm just guessing on that particular question. that's more a matter of taste/preference than better/worse. it's flavor.

Rhodium is a crap conductor. But, it has a low tarnish, so it maintains a baseline sound for many many years. You would be surprised how fast silver and copper tarnish. You have to treat silver and copper if you want to control, shall I say a drift, in what you hear.

 

[sbnx]

Yes, everything matters. I classify everything into either acoustic, mechanical or electrical noise. Many (most?) systems are too overwhelmed with acoustic noise to hear the full impact of things that influence mechanical or electric noise. As Elliot pointed out getting rid of acoustic noise is first. Then move on to all the things to lower the other types of noise. The lower and lower the noise floor the more smaller and smaller things are audible. Then when you lower other types of noise you can hear more subtle adjustments that need to be made to the speakers.

everything is audible, but not everything is good. Some products reduce noise others seem to amplify it. And some handle it in a non linear manner. Up to your ears to determine what direction to go.

as always YMMV

 

[treitz3]

Exactly.

Some folks may not know what you refer too here but hopefully they will at some point. Many here already do, thankfully.

Some things I have experienced actually lowered the noise floor, while at the same time? Introduced more noise.

Attributes and deficiencies. They can be a royal PIA. You said it best (IMO) when you stated that you let your ears determine which way to go.

Tom

 

[adyc]

This thread is terrific. But you are forgetting a few things.

• The limits of human hearing.
• The limits of human perception
• The effects of aging on hearing ability

You guys carry on.

Also the temperature and humidity in the room, whether your pets are in the room, whether you get up in the wrong side of the bed, the number of guests in the listening room (human bodies are also absorbers). Stock market up or down (well it may affect your blood pressure and affect your hearing).

 

[treitz3]

@adyc - I have actually measured temperature and humidity over the course of a few weeks and found no discernable difference.

Are you being serious or mocking on this aspect?....hard to tell from your post. Please advise and thanks.

Tom

 

[sbnx]

Also the temperature and humidity in the room, whether your pets are in the room, whether you get up in the wrong side of the bed, the number of guests in the listening room (human bodies are also absorbers). Stock market up or down (well it may affect your blood pressure and affect your hearing).

The items you listed are variable. For example, Our mood can influence how we listen from day to day. I am referencing objective things that are in the music that are repeatable. If i compare A and B today vs. tomorrow vs next week it yields the same result.

 

[Another Johnson]

@adyc - I have actually measured temperature and humidity over the course of a few weeks and found no discernable difference.

Are you being serious or mocking on this aspect?....hard to tell from your post. Please advise and thanks.

Tom

Technically, they both affect the wavelengths in the precise formula. If one had super ears, they might discern slight room effect shifts. Most would never notice, except in their personal comfort shifts.

 

[Richard Austen]

Some things matter more, perhaps, depending on the system. A big example of this was when I first explored power conditioners at my local big box chain called A&B Sound (a chain in Western Canada). They had some top Marantz surround receivers and they did demonstrations where they would let you listen and then plugged the amp into the conditioner - the noise floor dropped dramatically. People were shocked and amazed.

I asked them to do the demonstration with Bryston's preamp and power amp combination - zero change. Why? Because Bryston already has a vanishingly low-noise floor.

The walkaway is that with the AVR - you would be a big BIG believer in power conditioners being absolutely critical for good sound. Had you only heard it with Bryston you would be a big believer that power conditioners are hocus pocus snake-oil.

 

[PYP]

Some products reduce noise others seem to amplify it. And some handle it in a non linear manner. Up to your ears to determine what direction to go.

as always YMMV

and some seem to move you closer to the performance stage (or the reverse). Is this caused by a form of noise (or removal of noise), or is it something else?

 

[marty]

As long as your speaker wires are of sufficient gauge, they should be fine. (I already know in advance that we'll "agree to disagree" on that... )

http://www.roger-russell.com/wire/wire.htm

My impression is that audiophiles frequently debate tweaks where the purported benefits are not supported by measurements or blind testing (Shakti stones?), while ignoring things that would make huge improvements like room acoustics and DSP room correction products.

An accurate-sounding audio system should have a frequency response similar to the following -

https://www.researchgate.net/public..._and_Calibration_of_Sound_Reproducing_Systems

How do you know if your system's frequency response is optimal if you don't measure (REW, OmniMic)? Having subwoofers in an audio system, measuring, and calibrating everything (DSP) is par for the course for home theater audio systems, yet I don't read much about doing those things in this forum. Just submitting my outsider's perspective for your consideration. No need to break out the pitchforks & tiki torches...

Henrich
Your post raises, (or should I say re-raises) a topic that has been discussed many times over many years here on WBF. Here's an ancient post from 2010 along the same lines; namely, most/many/all? enjoyable systems have a frequency response at the listening system that is not flat, but rather simulates the famous B&K microphone curve or other similar curves such as the Harmon curve that are somewhat similar to the one you posted.

DSP- one person's experience

DSP- One person’s experience Among the very few premises to which all audiophiles would surely agree, is that good sound is often largely determined by the quality of the room in which the sound is being reproduced. Not far behind that premise is the general agreement that the nature of the...

www.whatsbestforum.com

Welcome to the "flat is not where it's at" club! One does not necessarily need DSP to get there as many roads lead to Rome. (FYI, I moved on from a DSP-based system many years ago). Enjoy the journey.
Marty

 

[Bobvin]

… many roads lead to Rome.

I thought all roads lead to Burgundy.

(Edited… all roads, not loads! That was a bad typo indeed.)

 

[tima]

Does everything really make a difference? Or do we just believe -- or do we just want to believe -- that everything makes a difference?

Do we want to believe that everything makes a different because we think we can hear a difference?

How do you tell the difference between just believing and just wanting to believe?

How do you tell the difference between hearing a difference and thinking we can hear a difference?

What a silly thread.