What I mean is for some of us, we like to combine tubes and solid state in the same system. Personally, I prefer a ss amp with a tube preamp. I realize recently the lines have blurred between the two camps, with each taking on some of the characteristics of the other. I have heard sota tube cdp/dac, but also sota ss or even hybid cdp/dac. Does it matter in a mixed system where the tubes are? I was under the impression tubes should start first in the preamp. Does it matter with today's gear?
For tube/ss lovers: Where do you feel tubes should be
- Thread starter MarinJim
- Start date
Hello, MarinJim. With my rig, I have found to prefer pretty much the same as yours. Tubed pre with SS amplification. Both tube and SS for digital sources and tubed for vinyl. Based solely on my experience along my audio journey, I don't really think that you could put a time stamp on the gear as to whether it would matter or not.
I think it does. In all of my various systems and system configurations, I have found that what you and I have currently setup provides me with the optimum end result. I had one system where for the amplification only, I had a tubed top end and an SS bottom end [switching the two types of amps with each other didn't yield good results]. That particular system sounded good but it didn't last long because of me wanting to keep it simple. At the end of the day, IMO it still all boils down to one's preference(s), the type of gear one has and what it is they are trying to amplify, along with perhaps the room interaction with said system.
I think it does. In all of my various systems and system configurations, I have found that what you and I have currently setup provides me with the optimum end result. I had one system where for the amplification only, I had a tubed top end and an SS bottom end [switching the two types of amps with each other didn't yield good results]. That particular system sounded good but it didn't last long because of me wanting to keep it simple. At the end of the day, IMO it still all boils down to one's preference(s), the type of gear one has and what it is they are trying to amplify, along with perhaps the room interaction with said system.
In my bi-amped system, the amp for >500Hz is tube, and the amp for the bass is solid state. Best of both worlds, I think. However, my source components (SACD player and phono preamp) are both solid state. None of the really top end SACD players have tubed output stages. I wonder why.
Regarding CD play, what about Audio Note, Zanden, ARC, anything by Jerry Ozmet, or Wavelength? I am also looking into the Danish Audio Design DAC10 Tube Reference. I currently have GNSC modded Wadia S7i (which is supreme).
My own 'goal' and approach to this which has been consistent for the last 5-6 years:
- Start with a source whose 'voice' i quite like. I chose Zanden DAC
- Get a preamp that allows as much signal to come thru...with as much decay, detail, range, micro/macro dynamics...and apply "only" attenuation. If any voice here...then stray towards focus on purity of tonality. I chose CJ GAT.
- Get a Class A SS amp for pure, unadulterated effortless and instantaneous power to amplify the signal both overall and in terms of microdynamic and macrodynamic attack. I chose Gryphon Colosseum.
Everyone has difference combinations...this is the one for me.
- Start with a source whose 'voice' i quite like. I chose Zanden DAC
- Get a preamp that allows as much signal to come thru...with as much decay, detail, range, micro/macro dynamics...and apply "only" attenuation. If any voice here...then stray towards focus on purity of tonality. I chose CJ GAT.
- Get a Class A SS amp for pure, unadulterated effortless and instantaneous power to amplify the signal both overall and in terms of microdynamic and macrodynamic attack. I chose Gryphon Colosseum.
Everyone has difference combinations...this is the one for me.
You forgot to add the best ingredient, the speakers!
yes, i went with my fav (Wilson X1/Grand Slamms)...bought them second-hand...14 yrs old and still mint...sitting in storage for 14 years! incredible...the plastic shrink wrap on the lacquer had never been peeled off, and the feet never been put on...incredible.
Tube / SS combo is great preferably in the power amp , 4000 VA powersupply slam you will not find in tube amps i reckon
But after doeing that for about eight years now , i m gonna try tubes again , although i might regret it
Ive put my krells for sale (audiomarkt) and i ll buy convergent power after that .
The solid state pre i like best is ML 32.
(probably best i could do is buy that , and stop fooling around with tubes )
But after doeing that for about eight years now , i m gonna try tubes again , although i might regret it
Ive put my krells for sale (audiomarkt) and i ll buy convergent power after that .
The solid state pre i like best is ML 32.
(probably best i could do is buy that , and stop fooling around with tubes )
Tube / SS combo is great preferably in the power amp , 4000 VA powersupply slam you will not find in tube amps i reckon
But after doeing that for about eight years now , i m gonna try tubes again , although i might regret it
Ive put my krells for sale (audiomarkt) and i ll buy convergent power after that .
The solid state pre i like best is ML 32.
(probably best i could do is buy that , and stop fooling around with tubes )
stop fooling around with tubes?...now where is the fun in that??
To be fair, i think powerful tube amps have come a LOOOONG way in the last 10 years or so. I am told the ARC Ref 250 is a good example, as is the CJ ART, VAC Ref monos...which the owners of which i have spoken to are serious guys with decades of experience and they are absolutely ENTHRALLED with the balls of steel and purity of tonality combination.
Tube / SS combo is great preferably in the power amp , 4000 VA powersupply slam you will not find in tube amps i reckon
But after doeing that for about eight years now , i m gonna try tubes again , although i might regret it
Ive put my krells for sale (audiomarkt) and i ll buy convergent power after that .
The solid state pre i like best is ML 32.
(probably best i could do is buy that , and stop fooling around with tubes )
tannoy churchhills with 20 watts of SET power (air tight ATM-211) has slam in spades. as with any speaker it depends on the load, SS is great for moving coil speakers that are hard to drive/inefficient. I prefer tubes everywhere possible, i use a joule electra preamp (tubes) which allows me to easily hear the difference between a Pass aleph amp and an graaf OTL for instance, its the most neutral line stage ive ever heard in my system. imo, if i where to choose one place tubes have the greatest influence in the overall sound of the system, its the power amp.
I'm a big believer in tubes in the preamp stage. As for tubes in the amp stage, I think that depends more on the speaker that you are using and what type of presentation you are seeking.
I use a tube amp and a ss amp, not at the same time. The ss amp is better at swinging voltage, the tube amp gives the music more "gestalt". A question of taste, both offer something that the other doesn't.
As for tubes in the CD player or as is now becoming the trend, tubes in the power supply of the turntable, I do not have enough experience with that to comment.
I use a tube amp and a ss amp, not at the same time. The ss amp is better at swinging voltage, the tube amp gives the music more "gestalt". A question of taste, both offer something that the other doesn't.
As for tubes in the CD player or as is now becoming the trend, tubes in the power supply of the turntable, I do not have enough experience with that to comment.
Wow, great find. Speaker design improvements do not change as much as electronics over the years, IMHO.
stop fooling around with tubes?...now where is the fun in that??
Very true, but what I love about a Burmester 911 MK3 (in my example), is it has some of the important sonic characteristics of tubes, but no tube worries (replacement & noisy tubes). There is always a trade off in this mad game!
I miss my Graaf GM100, great amp, but in my old system was bested by Chapter Audio amp.
One thing you need to be careful about in using a tube pre with a ss amp is impedance matching. If the tube pre has a high output impedance and the ss amp has input impedance around 20 K, then you could possible have a mismatch eg. lost dynamics and low end extension.
Steve williams
Site Founder, Site Owner, Administrator
Are all tube buffers basically the same? And do they add other problems/complexities?
Steve williams
Site Founder, Site Owner, Administrator
I use a Musical Fidelity tube buffer because of the input impedence mismatching between my Lamm amps and the amps in the JL Audio Gotham subs
Bruce B
WBF Founding Member, Pro Audio Production Member
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