In praise of idlers

[DasguteOhr]

Did you listen?

Yes , a friend fullfiled this expensive dream, all is trimmed lightweight and resonancefree. Baked carbon wandboard & plinith other parts mostly titanium. Extremly precision motor controller delivers excellent results, if you can even say that with a mobile app. Delivery took 19 months( 38k€)
Sounds phantastic to my ears the music tumbles out effortlessly, never heard before. cartridge from rega is a custom-made for that turntable

 

[Audiohertz2]

Looks interesting , but sorry would have to pass , visually flat and ridiculously expensive for whats presented ..!

Just saying ….

 

[PeterA]

Yes , a friend fullfiled this expensive dream, all is trimmed lightweight and resonancefree. Baked carbon wandboard & plinith other parts mostly titanium. Extremly precision motor controller delivers excellent results, if you can even say that with a mobile app. Delivery took 19 months( 38k€)
Sounds phantastic to my ears the music tumbles out effortlessly, never heard before. cartridge from rega is a custom-made for that turntableView attachment 146761

Do you have any photographs of the turntable assembled in a system? I’m curious about the relationship between the motor and the platter.

 

[PeterA]

Its why i said in absolute terms Peter , Best of Best ..

BTW , Do you consider VPI a light weight platter..( not talking entry level tables )

There are so many different models of VPI. I’m not really sure. Perhaps they are not the lightest platters, but I would not describe them as high mass either. I know my SME model 30/12 sounds a lot different from the micro Seiki that replaced it. The SME is interesting because it’s a medium weight platter with a very short stretchy belt. The speed had to be adjusted with the needle in the groove because stylus drag affected the speed.

 

[DasguteOhr]

Looks interesting , but sorry would have to pass , visually flat and ridiculously expensive for whats presented ..!

Just saying ….

The platter is made of special material, some kind of expensive ceramic material. Bearings: zirconium. Speed test tonearm works with the record clamp. Set it once and save it in the controller. There are many tweaks on this record player that I have not seen before. Very precise, accurate vtf scale are included.

@PeterA
Next time i make some some photos promise

 

[mtemur]

The platter is made of special material, some kind of expensive ceramic material. Bearings: zirconium. Speed test tonearm works with the record clamp. Set it once and save it in the controller. There are many tweaks on this record player that I have not seen before. Very precise, accurate vtf scale are included.

@PeterA
Next time i make some some photos promise

I haven’t heard this one (Naia) yet but I always feel like Regas sound plastic, light, not serious. I don’t think this would be any different. I even prefer a Lenco, Garrard or Technics 1200 instead. Even those can be more listenable.

 

[Audiohertz2]

Technics 1200 ..! now thats down right insulting …..

 

[Balle Clorin]

What are the advantages/disadvantages of BD vs DD ..?
Talking in absolute term.

belt: + cheap and simple to make, no electronics skilles needed,. - drift and drag dependant, probably higher W&F too. Belt vibrations add noise, and wear of belt makers consistent speed hard to assure.
DD: +Keep steady speed forever..not affected by drag. -old electronics can be hard to repair. (Hunting speed seem to be a myth invented by belt drive suppliers. ) can have more flutter than belt drives.

Idler: + Quick start and stop, resists drag effect . - too many to mention see Korf blog

Turntable Drives. Part III, Idler Drive and its Problems

korfaudio.com

 

[tima]

What are the advantages/disadvantages of BD vs DD ..?
Talking in absolute terms ….

Attached is a write-up by Peter Moncrieff of International Audio Review (no advertising) that covers a lot of the issues thoroughly. It is purpotedly part one of a review of the Rockport Sirius, but it is really a discussion of the role of a turntable and the drive topologies that attempt to fulfill it -- in, as you asked, an absolute sense. Its analysis of direct drive is a wee bit dated as it was written before the advent of slotless or coreless motors in a DD, but otherwise a good read. Moncrieff was a colorful character in early high-end publishing; I believe he has since passed on while his Web site continues to be available.

 

[mtemur]

Thanks, @tima, for sharing Moncrieff’s write-up. It was previously shared by another member somewhere in this forum, maybe even in this thread. The article provides important insights into the design weaknesses of each topology. I’ve shared my thoughts on direct drives before, and this write-up clearly highlights inherent flaws of DD.

I don’t know if I’m right or wrong but IMHO, whether coreless or not, a DD must have a thick, high-mass platter to minimize interactions from the motor, such as noise, electromagnetic interference, and corrective kicks. Achieving this requires a highly sophisticated motor controller—one that delivers high torque at startup and then maintains speed with a more relaxed approach. More importantly, DD manufacturers should focus on upgrading the bearing, moving beyond the simple Technics 1200 design to modern, inverted, larger-diameter, and more precisely machined bearings, ideally incorporating jewel and/or ceramic materials.

 

[Audiohertz2]

Simplicity always wins out , just not too simple ..