To those recommending Verity, which of their models are sub $50k, and have you actually heard them? For reference, the speakers they demoed at this year's RMAF are $675k. One other question - why oh why with the rear firing woofers?
KeithR's "Dream Speaker" Search
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YG with all MSB gear sounded way better than Wilson setups and Magico, at a show I went to. I think YG might be onto something. But no, they didn’t “show me what 800w sounds like in my face” like some jerk did with the Wilsons... so maybe their woofer won’t come flying at me, not an issue for me.
MSB at RMAF 2017 w/YG was one of the best rooms at the show.
YG has a very coherent sound like Verity, closer to the purity of a good single driver... Both make their own drivers too, probably not a coincidence.
Whenever I have heard YG’s ( at least in the last few years, before that they were very unimpressive), I hear a certain sophistication in the SQ. I am not bothered by any particular aspect of the sound, no ringing tweeter, no boomy bass, no missing mid bass, etc., Correctly set up and with the right ancillary gear, YG’s are some of my favorite speakers.
Wilson’s can be excellent too, but they need different care and set up, plus I find them to be slightly less sophisticated sounding as to the YG’s. ( the older Wilson models with the titanium domes are a non starter for me). I think if you need larger bass impact, and your room can accommodate that, then the larger Wilson’s are probably the better option over the YG’s. With some loss of exactitude/precision compared to the YG’s. End of the day, no right, no wrong, IME.
Wilson’s can be excellent too, but they need different care and set up, plus I find them to be slightly less sophisticated sounding as to the YG’s. ( the older Wilson models with the titanium domes are a non starter for me). I think if you need larger bass impact, and your room can accommodate that, then the larger Wilson’s are probably the better option over the YG’s. With some loss of exactitude/precision compared to the YG’s. End of the day, no right, no wrong, IME.
I heard these, I think they were in the low 6-figure range.
http://www.verityaudio.com/en/loudspeakers/exr-serie/lohengrin-ii
These may be $50k-ish, IDK... they do have lower models too
http://www.verityaudio.com/en/loudspeakers/exr-serie/sarastro-iis
Both are in the same series, I'd hope they sound similar!
On the rear firing woofer, If the xo point is low enough it doesn't really matter. I don't think anyone would be able to tell where the woofer is on the Lohengrin speaker blind.
In any case, I thought the higher efficiency and cohesive sound would appeal to Keith. The demo at RMAF 2017 was a standout and in the top few of the show for sure!
Although I skipped this year's RMAF, the three preceding shows had one thing in common: YG had the best sound of show for me. I tend to walk around carrying my own CDs (redbook) to see what MY music sounds like - and I carry at least 200 in a book - all genres. Some systems produced stunning dynamics, others, wonderful female vocals (the single most tested range at ANY show). However, in most rooms, I spent between 10 seconds (in the door, U-turn, out the door) and 3 minutes (listening fatigue sets in very quickly with me). I have spent no less than 30 minutes, and up to 3 hours, in various YG rooms, simply because their speakers just seem to get it "right" in terms of tonality, imaging, scale, frequency response, etc., more consistently than did the others. In the sub-$50k range, though, the Acoustic Zen Crescendos (yes, they are transmission line) sounded great, IF they are properly fed.
Acoustic Zen Crescendo sounded really good when i heard it with big SETs. It was one of my price/performance champs from Munich 2016 (see my report in Positive Feedback from that year).
I agree, the latest YG models such as the Hailey 1.2 are the most coherent of speakers & their tweeter is much improved over older models. They do a lot of things very well like staging, resolution, imaging and tight, fast bass. But to my ears. Magico has better tone and texture, and sounds more natural. The S5 Mk2's which i'm most familiar with are also very coherent sounding. The S Mk2 series has benefited from years of ongoing development, and trickle-down technology from the M series. And although Magico don't make their own drivers, they're designed in-house and made to Magico's specifications. Whilst in the case of the M series tweeters, a lot of the machining is done in-house. I guess it comes down to a matter of personal taste.
Haven't heard YG, but one thing is for sure, indeed you can't fault Magico for lack of coherence.
Gamut audition:
I went to see Michael Vamos, Gamut importer, locally in Hollywood at his apartment home. He did not have the RS7i in stock for demo, but suggested the RS3i monitor as he felt if I liked it, the 7 would completely blow me away. When I arrived, he did have the $160k Zodiac floorstander as well, but didn't think it fair for me to hear it
They are beautiful speakers - pictures don't do them justice. He explained that un-laquered finishes were much harder to make and the Danes were experts at it (I previously owned Dynaudios and felt their veneers superb). The wood on the Gamut cabinet is from 21 compressed layers and minimal stuffing is used inside the cabinet - in fact, there is a "L" and "R" speaker which is unusual with the same exact driver complement. I sat in the one and only "Lobster" chair which is manufactured by the cabinet maker.
Gamut sound is quite unique. In many ways it took some time for me to process it. For the first half hour on some vinyl cuts I brought (Blake Mills, Max Richter, Nils Frahm) I could only think one thing: warm! The system was setup on a Pear Audio analog rig into Gamut's own preamp and mono amplifiers. Gamut uses very minimal circuitry - a simple pair of Mosfets per channel in the amps. We switched to digital where I put in my trusty demo cd and cranked it up so I could get a better glimpse. Michael told me my ARC Ref 75SE would be the perfect tube complement.
Gamut is some of the most dynamic sound I've heard in a cone loudspeaker - this surprised me as they are a bit less efficient than my Devores. The sound was big as well -voices really hung in space in front of you. Like Dynaudio, I'd be surprised if the monitors didn't indeed go all the way down to the mid-30s. Bass seem taut and articulate. I still however was bothered by the lack of clarity that I'm used to at home - and have no mistake for detail or imaging as that wasn't it. I just felt the soundstage and images within it were somewhat hazy and non-distinct.
Fast forward an hour and the warm, somewhat indistinct sound faded away. Your brain really relaxes with this speaker like no other and you totally forget about all of it - I believe this is because Gamut is designed based solely on phase and timing. I left my audition feeling that there was something very right in this - although I still couldn't shake the perceived flaws in the sound. I would be interested in re-visiting with another audiophile to confirm these thoughts on timing, but would prefer to do it on the larger speakers.
Overall though, I didn't find the Gamuts to excel with my music preferences (particularly electronica). I found the sound in many ways, more dynamic old-school Sonus Faber - which certainly has its fans, but never has been a favorite of mine. As they say, horses for courses.
I went to see Michael Vamos, Gamut importer, locally in Hollywood at his apartment home. He did not have the RS7i in stock for demo, but suggested the RS3i monitor as he felt if I liked it, the 7 would completely blow me away. When I arrived, he did have the $160k Zodiac floorstander as well, but didn't think it fair for me to hear it
They are beautiful speakers - pictures don't do them justice. He explained that un-laquered finishes were much harder to make and the Danes were experts at it (I previously owned Dynaudios and felt their veneers superb). The wood on the Gamut cabinet is from 21 compressed layers and minimal stuffing is used inside the cabinet - in fact, there is a "L" and "R" speaker which is unusual with the same exact driver complement. I sat in the one and only "Lobster" chair which is manufactured by the cabinet maker.Gamut sound is quite unique. In many ways it took some time for me to process it. For the first half hour on some vinyl cuts I brought (Blake Mills, Max Richter, Nils Frahm) I could only think one thing: warm! The system was setup on a Pear Audio analog rig into Gamut's own preamp and mono amplifiers. Gamut uses very minimal circuitry - a simple pair of Mosfets per channel in the amps. We switched to digital where I put in my trusty demo cd and cranked it up so I could get a better glimpse. Michael told me my ARC Ref 75SE would be the perfect tube complement.
Gamut is some of the most dynamic sound I've heard in a cone loudspeaker - this surprised me as they are a bit less efficient than my Devores. The sound was big as well -voices really hung in space in front of you. Like Dynaudio, I'd be surprised if the monitors didn't indeed go all the way down to the mid-30s. Bass seem taut and articulate. I still however was bothered by the lack of clarity that I'm used to at home - and have no mistake for detail or imaging as that wasn't it. I just felt the soundstage and images within it were somewhat hazy and non-distinct.
Fast forward an hour and the warm, somewhat indistinct sound faded away. Your brain really relaxes with this speaker like no other and you totally forget about all of it - I believe this is because Gamut is designed based solely on phase and timing. I left my audition feeling that there was something very right in this - although I still couldn't shake the perceived flaws in the sound. I would be interested in re-visiting with another audiophile to confirm these thoughts on timing, but would prefer to do it on the larger speakers.
Overall though, I didn't find the Gamuts to excel with my music preferences (particularly electronica). I found the sound in many ways, more dynamic old-school Sonus Faber - which certainly has its fans, but never has been a favorite of mine. As they say, horses for courses.
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Keith, are you still considering Gamut, I thought that was not an option. Or, like Ron asks, have you illuminated your thinking and are re-considering these speakers. OTOH, maybe you have eliminated them after all??
Jeez, I am becoming the grammar police here, Yikes!!
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