Lamm ML2

[PeterA]

I am not interested in being buried with any high-end. I have hope that I will be able to change equipment several times before such event.

That is simply the difference between those who have found what they are looking for and those who are still searching.

 

[microstrip]

That is simply the difference between those who have found what they are looking for and those who are still searching.

Peter,

IMHO it is not so easy as that. Due to the nature of stereo, there is no end in the search for improvements in stereo reproduction. But individuals are free to stop searching any time.

You are still searching, for example in cartridges. And fortunately participating in WBF threads about other kind of equipment other than yours. The flame still burns!

 

[bonzo75]

That is simply the difference between those who have found what they are looking for and those who are still searching.

U2 or not to

 

[assessor43]

Just wondering if you are still listening to that Technics MM cartridge. it should sound great with that setup.

 

[PeterA]

Just wondering if you are still listening to that Technics MM cartridge. it should sound great with that setup.

Yes it does sound great in this set up. I have four cartridges and only two arms, so the Technics is currently not on the table.

 

[Steve williams]

That is simply the difference between those who have found what they are looking for and those who are still searching.

Precisely my point. I have yet too hear anything better for my ears and unlike micro who is constantly searching for the magic bullet , I am content in my quest and have no desires to explore further

 

[Steve williams]

It would be interesting what other electronics compare. I know you’ve owned ARC intube land.

Like Tim my favorite electronics prior to Lamm was Audio Research. I fact I owned their behemoth Reference 600 Mklll (which had IIRC a total of 64 tubes in the amps) and I had to install a 3rd HVAC system just for my sound room

I then switched to the Lamm ML 2.1 at 18 wpm and I was in hog's heaven and thought my journey was done...I was an SET fanatic. I loved the sound of the midrange and craved more......and then Vlad released his Signature series the ML3, LL1 and the LP1 which I was one of the first to purchase and since that time my search is over. I might have been wisecracking that they will be buried with me. Rather my point was, that these will never be sold and are an integral part of my system that brings a daily smile to my face

For me and my ears, thus is what I call end game. Simply put their might be better but not in my system or for my ears.

I keep saying that we should be using our systems to play our music rather than playing our music to hear our systems. I just have zero desire to look. The Lamm electronics have given to my ears what I cherish. Sometimes the truth is right in front of us yet we still feel the desire to keep exploring and listen. To micro....I truly hope that you find what you are looking for but I have been reading your posts since day 1 and it seems you just are not happy with whatever you use. When I declared end game (save for 2 changes I "AM" going to make, one very shortly and the other in the coming year.) for me (and I bet PeterA and ddk all feel the same) it was a liberating feeling as all I care about now is listening to the music

I wish everyone well in their search but at some point there comes that inner peace with having a system that leads to aural bliss and no desire to search further

 

[PeterA]

Peter,

IMHO it is not so easy as that. Due to the nature of stereo, there is no end in the search for improvements in stereo reproduction. But individuals are free to stop searching any time.

You are still searching, for example in cartridges. And fortunately participating in WBF threads about other kind of equipment other than yours. The flame still burns!

Micro,

People can play with slightly different flavors but not be endlessly searching for improvements. Just look at the people who seem settled with their systems. They are all around this forum. Others seem restless, on a quest because they are not satisfied. I think there is a difference. They are still searching for something. There is no consensus that the nature of stereo is always improvements. Some feel strongly that things are not improving and even getting worse. Sonics are changing for sure. Are they better though, that is not clear.

I am not searching for cartridges. I have found what I like. If something comes along that I might prefer, I may try it. That is not a search. Some threads are interesting and I read them and participate for entertainment and perhaps some learning. That too does not mean searching.

Back to the ML2. Are SET amps improving over this? That is an interesting question, that I am surely not qualified to answer. Importantly, I have no real desire to find out. The nature of stereo is simply not making me investigate.

 

[Steve williams]

Back to the ML2. Are SET amps improving over this?

Bring on the ML3

 

[andromedaaudio]

I hope Lamm will be at the MOC / 22 in munich .
Does Lamm usually display there??

 

[KeithR]

Keith, I don't know if this was meant for me or Steve but over the years I have owned several ARC tube components (Ref 2, Ref2 SE, Ref5 SE) and currently own their top-of-the-line Ref 10 linestage and Ref Phono 10 (which btw is for sale at a v. attractive price.) The Ref10+RP10 as expected have excellent synergy not unlike Lamm pre and amps are synergistic.

I had the ARC 250SE monbolocks in my prior room for several months and included a comparison wih them in my review of the Lamm M1.2 Ref for TAB. I thought very highly of those specific ARC amps and still do (but bougt the Lamm.) There will be a time when I compare the M1.2 and M2.2 hybrid amps - very interested in the M2.2.

I made a comparison between the ARC Ref Phono 10 and the Lamm LP2.1 in my review of the latter for PF.

I have copius notes on the the ARC RP10 compared with the in-house Lamm LP1 Sig phono for its coming review, and also notes comparing the Ref10 linestage with the in-house Lamm L2.1 Ref for its review. Those are next year.

Fwiw in 2009 writing for Soundstage I compared the Lamm LL2.1 Deluxe with the twice-the-price Atma-Sphere MP-1 Mk.III preamp when I owned the latter unit. That was my first encounter with Lamm electronics back when I still a newbie reviewer and knew nothing, but of course the review was spot-on. Shameless tout that I am, there may be a surprise review in '22 that also talks about Lamm gear.

The Lamm Web site has a page listing many review links organized by specific component. Many of those reviews include comparisons. I'm partial to Paul Bolin, Dick Olsher and a few others.

thanks, Tim. just was wondering how the sounds are different than classic tube brands like Arc, VTL, Vac, Jadis, etc. or if folks moved from these brands to Lamm

 

[PeterA]

Keith, some have moved from big solid state brands to Lamm too.

 

[Ron Resnick]

thanks, Tim. just was wondering how the sounds are different than classic tube brands like Arc, VTL, Vac, Jadis, etc. or if folks moved from these brands to Lamm

I have no statistics, so I really should not be posting this in response. But I have the subjective sense that when people, for whatever reason, switch from ARC, VAC or VTL to Lamm, it seems like they then stay with Lamm.

I "grew up" with the Io, and I adore Jim White, and I never investigated step-up transformers, so I never ventured to try a Lamm phono stage. At the loudspeaker end I like the idea of high-power, all-tube amplifiers, so I never ventured to try the Lamm M2.2. I also adore Bea and Luke Manley. Plus I really do take great comfort in being able to drive all of these boxes festooned with tubes back to their respective factories myself, if service becomes necessary.

But I invariably love the sound of Lamm electronics in every single system in which I have ever heard them. There is no doubt in my mind that they are very special electronics which facilitate a magical connection to the music.

If I were starting from scratch, and I did not need high power to drive insensitive speakers, I would go all Lamm.

 

[Ron Resnick]

Marty, have you ever explored Lamm electronics?

 

[ddk]

Peter,

IMHO it is not so easy as that. Due to the nature of stereo, there is no end in the search for improvements in stereo reproduction. But individuals are free to stop searching any time.

You are still searching, for example in cartridges. And fortunately participating in WBF threads about other kind of equipment other than yours. The flame still burns!

IME it can be easy as that when YOU know what you want and have find it. 1998 was my aha moment with ML2 and L1, took a few more years to figure out the rest of the system but I've remained with almost the same components and definitely the same sound since 2002. Yes I added other Lamm gear since then but it's the same sound and everything else remains the same. Peter has just come to this sound, it will take a little time to fine tune things but I know from talking to him he's discovered what will last him for many years if not forever. Maintenance doesn't mean searching for something new specially with cartridges that are consumables.

This being Lamm ML2 thread I have to confess that I wouldn't have a high end system today if not for Vladimir and his ML2/L1. By 1995 I was done reading audio magazines with their mostly ignorant reviewers and high end had lost it's appeal. 23 years later I feel exactly the same, nothing else that interests me.

david

 

[andromedaaudio]

I find it always nice when people come back to an old and proven amp design after trying a lot of other gear.
A Good no nonsense design thats able to withstand the test of time.
Another proof that good circuit design matters more then having the latest modern shiny box

 

[Steve williams]

Marty, have you ever explored Lamm electronics?

Only at my house . They won’t drive his speakers except the M1.2
i think Marty has had it with tube amps as he has had a few tube explosions

 

[andromedaaudio]

But regarding peters system , one should definitively not underestimate the role of the LL1 pre amp , which was bought at the same time if im not mistaken.
I think this pre with the higher powered Lamm hybrid amps would also be a large step up.
May be the lamm hybrids and LL1 is someting for marty , only 1 small tube in the power amp if im not mistaken

 

[microstrip]

Micro,

People can play with slightly different flavors but not be endlessly searching for improvements. Just look at the people who seem settled with their systems.

Well, please point me the people in this forum who settled their systems for more than three years, excluding David and me - the Taiko Audio server must surely be considered a flavor ...

They are all around this forum. Others seem restless, on a quest because they are not satisfied. I think there is a difference. They are still searching for something. There is no consensus that the nature of stereo is always improvements. Some feel strongly that things are not improving and even getting worse. Sonics are changing for sure. Are they better though, that is not clear.

You can't assume that people are restless because they are not satisfied. Surely they get satisfaction trying different gear and making experiences. What do you mean by " the nature of stereo is always improvements? " What I say is that stereo can always be improved according to listener preference. It is part of it.

I am not searching for cartridges. I have found what I like. If something comes along that I might prefer, I may try it. That is not a search. Some threads are interesting and I read them and participate for entertainment and perhaps some learning. That too does not mean searching.

Ok. This is just semantics. "I am not searching, but keep my eyes open, just in case something better shows up".

And yes, I also did not look for a lot of gear I have listened to. Dealers and distributors suggested me to listen to it and brought it to my room.

Back to the ML2. Are SET amps improving over this? That is an interesting question, that I am surely not qualified to answer. Importantly, I have no real desire to find out. The nature of stereo is simply not making me investigate.

Thanks for making it clear. I envy you. SET's are not even my preference, but I am interested in knowing about them. Researching stereo subjects is part of my nature and I find it a fascinating subject.

 

[microstrip]

Only at my house . They won’t drive his speakers except the M1.2
i think Marty has had it with tube amps as he has had a few tube explosions

As far as I remember (I can be wrong ) he also owned the VTL Siegfried's that are very reliable.