Munich HighEnd 2024

[morricab]

Davis + Jadis was also quite good…lively, organic and fun

 

[TooCool4]

View attachment 130642

What a complete let down. Not impressed at all and ugly to boot.

 

[D.Duttilleux]

Living Voice/SJS/Kuzma: Beautiful tone, good dynamics, coherence and superb soundstage…but not resolved/transparent enough and somewhat shut in highs. Pains me to write this given my love for LV in the past…

The R80s...



With SS Ellipticors... kinda nonsensical, but pretty good high-end drivers.

For about 30% of the price of a single Ellipticor woofer you can buy a pair of these:




for a 96dB @ 8 Ohm MTM.

 

[TooCool4]

I have listened to Aries Cerat two times and it was not good. I will check this room today again but I am not hopeful to get better sound.
My guess is those AC horn speakers should be in better room , better room means the speaker load the room in it’s best way. The AC room was so much big and it was not good for AC speakers.
The other problem was the speaker position, I think the speaker position was far from ideal.
Placing speakers 45 degrees to room walls are not my favorite.
The harmonics was also off , I do not why but I guess it relates to electronics or AC filters not speakers.
This horn speakers was not like highly dynamic vintage horns, I do not why .

I will listen more to this room and back you if I get better impression.

View attachment 130519

I think if I want listen to AC horns for right judgment I should listen to AC in right condition, not all but most of negative judgments are related to setup not audio equipments.

I also think the sound is better after 11AM maybe because of the systems warm up.

I believe AC quality in Munich show is not good.

I had heard so much about Aries Cerat, so had to check them out the first time I came across them. My first impressions, what a pile of big dogs do do. The room was very busy on Saturday, could not really get the correct position to get a good sound. Did not stay in the room long as there are far more interesting systems to listen to.

I thought I’ll give the system a second try. I had a similar impression on my first listen to Techdas Air Force Zero, on second listen the following day it sounded much better. They had corrected the errors of the previous day.

I went back to Aries Cerat’s room on Sunday, fewer people around and I could get to sit in a better position, I can now say it’s no longer “a pile of big dogs do do” it’s now a pile of small dogs do do. What a waste of my time I could have spent elsewhere.

Another system, equally as big and as ridiculous; the ESD Acoustic – Super Dragon in the room above sounded much better.

 

[Elliot G.]

I would suggest breaking in speakers ( and other products) prior to the show. Munich is about commerce (not only) and you'd expect manufacturers and distributors to put best foot forward. IMO

That’s not the issue it’s an excuse. Even burned in gear when it’s shipped and shaken needs to settle.
I’ve said this many times and it seems people just don’t want to get the fact that not everyone can set up and position a high end system.
The break in may explain why every room sounds better as the show rages on but it doesn’t explain that many systems just are not any good.
1) failing to plan results in planning to fail.
these rooms need work every single one so when you go into rooms with nothing done but put gear in it the odds are it won’t be great . Almost all the Hifi Deluxe rooms have the exact same sound and almost everyone has nothing done to the spaces. They all are harsh and highly reflective.
2) all the list of every little excuse are just that. Every show exhibitor has them yet done consistently get a good result while most do not. This is not the room or any other excuse.
No plan no experience no expertise leads to no sound quality
3) Lots of great products, beautifully made however this skill set is not system set up. Most musicians do not tune and maintain their instruments either!
4) lack of recognotion and respect for those who can perform this system magic during set up.
by some stupid cable or accessory sure get someone to set your gear up nah i’m good! laughable gentleman yet it’s true
5) Every show same old story, sane old wives take with lists of excuses but it still comes bavk to
the team, the plan, the gear and the system set up master.

 

[fbhifi]

That’s not the issue it’s an excuse. Even burned in gear when it’s shipped and shaken needs to settle.
I’ve said this many times and it seems people just don’t want to get the fact that not everyone can set up and position a high end system.
The break in may explain why every room sounds better as the show rages on but it doesn’t explain that many systems just are not any good.
1) failing to plan results in planning to fail.
these rooms need work every single one so when you go into rooms with nothing done but put gear in it the odds are it won’t be great . Almost all the Hifi Deluxe rooms have the exact same sound and almost everyone has nothing done to the spaces. They all are harsh and highly reflective.
2) all the list of every little excuse are just that. Every show exhibitor has them yet done consistently get a good result while most do not. This is not the room or any other excuse.
No plan no experience no expertise leads to no sound quality
3) Lots of great products, beautifully made however this skill set is not system set up. Most musicians do not tune and maintain their instruments either!
4) lack of recognotion and respect for those who can perform this system magic during set up.
by some stupid cable or accessory sure get someone to set your gear up nah i’m good! laughable gentleman yet it’s true
5) Every show same old story, sane old wives take with lists of excuses but it still comes bavk to
the team, the plan, the gear and the system set up master.

Elliot, I think you’ve nailed it. To take $500k in equipment from one place to another, put it in a foreign, unforgiving, if not highly problematical room and make it sound good in less than 48 hours takes real talent- Some cats got it and some cats ain’t.

 

[Kingrex]

The R80s...

View attachment 130957

With SS Ellipticors... kinda nonsensical, but pretty good high-end drivers.

For about 30% of the price of a single Ellipticor woofer you can buy a pair of these:

View attachment 130961


for a 96dB @ 8 Ohm MTM:

View attachment 130962

But who is talented enough to make a crossover.

 

[AudioLibertarian]

As I said, if the darTZeel meters are reasonably accurate

No, trying to find the name. The small WLM were very good too!

Brad,

By any chance have you checked how was the listening height by these new stand mounted WLM monitors. From what I ve heard from recordings and by the impressions by few other visitors , these indeed might be a more "affordable"option to the Lorenzo LM-3. I might explore a possibility of purchasing a pair.

 

[heihei]

Alsyvox sounded, IMO, considerably less realistic than Diptyque. No planars will give you the slam of big cones or horns.

Agree to a degree, as I noted in the Diptyque thread. Wonder how Diptyque with a REL 6-pack would sound!!

 

[TooCool4]

Can anyone PLEASE visit the Peak Consult exhibit?

I did visit Peak Consult’s room and they had the big Dragon Legacy playing. Since I had listened to the Dragon Legacy before, I spend all my time in that room talking to Pir and Lennart.
I was hoping they would be playing one of the smaller speakers.

I visited the Triode Japan room, in which they were playing the Peak Consult Sinfonia. It sounded amazing, detailed full bodied, good bottom end room filling sound, but then Peak have never fail to impress.

 

[matthias]

That’s largely Munich, once you get past the newbie factor of big things with high prices. Apart from the WE Silbatone room, and the occasional surprise of which can be one every year

Yes, this room is like the soul of HE Munich, I sorely missed it. i could sit there for hours and listen to the music.
Particularly the fans of these speakers gathered sunday afternoon up to the end of the show. Hopefully next year again.

 

[matthias]

Aries Cerat.
Best i ve heard AC so far at a show

As much as I like the brand and the the efforts to bring this enormous system to Munich the best AC at a show was last year Munich and Munich 2022. Both Aurora set-ups were musically superior to this years set-up.
BTW, the Aurora is my favorite AC speaker.

 

[andromedaaudio]

I made a stop on my way back in Neurenberg.
Beautifull old walled medieval city.
Munchen show has picked the right date .
Very nice spring weather.

 

[andromedaaudio]

As much as I like the brand and the the efforts to bring this enormous system to Munich the best AC at a show was last year Munich and Munich 2022. Both Aurora set-ups were musically superior to this years set-up.
BTW, the Aurora is my favorite AC speaker.

I thought this years system showed great potential.
I d love to have heard some large Orchestral works on that system, the music choice didnt help.
I think with the right room and some measuring /adjusting you can get something spectaculair out of it

 

[andromedaaudio]

For the rest it was nice talking to Ken Stevens CAT Brandon the sales rep of Wadax and Luke manley of VTL.

I skipped the whole ground floor again this year , thats why i probably missed the new design of Vivid unfortunately
Munchen MOC takes 3 full days to see it all

 

[matthias]

And for me, HifiDeluxe only works because it remains open for 2 hours after the main show closes.

Yes, it is smart to open later and close later than the main show

 

[matthias]

The best thing about Munich is getting home and listening to your own system to remind you that taking time and care to build a system in tune with your room and tastes is worth its weight in gold!

So true !!!

 

[matthias]

Diptyque/Kora. Just superb and end game probably for those not obsessed with not picking

They were this year much better than the years before. Worthy contenders in this speaker category.
I also like the minimalist visual appearance.

 

[Verdier]

That’s not the issue it’s an excuse. Even burned in gear when it’s shipped and shaken needs to settle.
I’ve said this many times and it seems people just don’t want to get the fact that not everyone can set up and position a high end system.
The break in may explain why every room sounds better as the show rages on but it doesn’t explain that many systems just are not any good.
1) failing to plan results in planning to fail.
these rooms need work every single one so when you go into rooms with nothing done but put gear in it the odds are it won’t be great . Almost all the Hifi Deluxe rooms have the exact same sound and almost everyone has nothing done to the spaces. They all are harsh and highly reflective.
2) all the list of every little excuse are just that. Every show exhibitor has them yet done consistently get a good result while most do not. This is not the room or any other excuse.
No plan no experience no expertise leads to no sound quality
3) Lots of great products, beautifully made however this skill set is not system set up. Most musicians do not tune and maintain their instruments either!
4) lack of recognotion and respect for those who can perform this system magic during set up.
by some stupid cable or accessory sure get someone to set your gear up nah i’m good! laughable gentleman yet it’s true
5) Every show same old story, sane old wives take with lists of excuses but it still comes bavk to
the team, the plan, the gear and the system set up master.

That's all true. In your opinion, where did it sound good?

 

[matthias]

Thrax active speakers: incredible speed, dynamics, presence and tone was pretty good too. But perhaps a bit too insistent for long listening sessions

They might be promising but sounded shut in. The music came directly from the speakers, they were unable to fill the room. I couldn't listen to them longer then a few minutes, after that they were fatiguing.