No Linnies here?

[DaveyF]

Linn LP12 owner here. The poor girl is getting a little long in the tooth, OTOH, she can still compete pretty well (up to a point). Although I do agree with audioarcher, it's about time Linn got off their duff and came out with a new TT. Only problem is it would probably cost more than a Ferrari and only be good for about a year before you had to upgrade it
BTW, has anybody heard the new Palmer...it's supposed to be a world beater.

 

[TBone]

I owned an Intek, a Wakonda, an Axis and an LP12 - all great products until I switched to a naimfan

Well, I don't even know what Intek or Wakonda even means, so it's obvious I'm no Linnie.

Curious, how is an Axis and/or LP12 replaced ... per a Naim Fan?

tb1

 

[flez007]

Well, I don't even know what Intek or Wakonda even means, so it's obvious I'm no Linnie.

Curious, how is an Axis and/or LP12 replaced ... per a Naim Fan?

tb1

For a Rega deck of course

 

[TBone]

For a Rega deck of course

Well, in beer terms ... some figure that Rega is just Linn Lite ...

tb1

 

[class a]

Linn LP12 owner here. The poor girl is getting a little long in the tooth, OTOH, she can still compete pretty well (up to a point). Although I do agree with audioarcher, it's about time Linn got off their duff and came out with a new TT. Only problem is it would probably cost more than a Ferrari and only be good for about a year before you had to upgrade it
BTW, has anybody heard the new Palmer...it's supposed to be a world beater.

Heard the Palmer w/a D'Agostino 2 channel amp & a pair of Wilson Sasha speakers. Very impressive. The dealer also sells used vinyl so I was able to audition some albums on the system before purchasing. At home I have a 26 year old Linn LP12 and I'm very happy w/it.

 

[DaveyF]

Heard the Palmer w/a D'Agostino 2 channel amp & a pair of Wilson Sasha speakers. Very impressive. The dealer also sells used vinyl so I was able to audition some albums on the system before purchasing. At home I have a 26 year old Linn LP12 and I'm very happy w/it.

class a, thanks. I am thinking that the Linn is getting a bit past it. OTOH, I do agree with you that it is still a very good sounding TT. Trouble is when you add up all the expense of upgrading into Radikal, Ekos SE, Keel etc., you might as well go for something like the Palmer or even a TW.

 

[TBone]

class a, thanks. I am thinking that the Linn is getting a bit past it. OTOH, I do agree with you that it is still a very good sounding TT. Trouble is when you add up all the expense of upgrading into Radikal, Ekos SE, Keel etc., you might as well go for something like the Palmer or even a TW.

Well, that certainly becomes a alternate consideration, but remember ... you're no longer a Linnie then.

You know, as much as I smack around & joke about Linn, and I do frequently, I have the greatest admiration for the company.

Yet, I also appreciate how the word "Linn" evokes instant emotional audiophile stupidity.

Case in point, when at the Bryston display 2 years ago at an Audio Show, I mentioned that "word" to Brian Russell, who I consider far more of a inhouse-blowhard than any form of knowledgeable audiophile ... and his reaction in front of a favorable crowd ... "Linn is crap".

Yeah, OK Brian, pretend some more ...

tb1

PS. In fairness to the Bryston camp, I consider James Tanner a true gentleman with a much better understanding of all things audio.

 

[Tonepub]

The LP-12 isn't my only table, and it isn't my favorite, but I still really enjoy playing records on it, just as I would driving a BMW 2002tii.

It doesn't have to be the "best" to be fun.

 

[class a]

You don't have to upgrade a Linn to the max to be satisfied. Many enjoy the sound at different levels of upgrade. The nice option you can take any Linn in and have it upgraded to your satisfaction. They also hold their value if you want to sell. How many pieces of electronics on your rack can hold their value? I know some of my stuff is pennies on the dollar (AVRs, Surround Processors, CD players etc.)

 

[TBone]

You don't have to upgrade a Linn to the max to be satisfied. Many enjoy the sound at different levels of upgrade. The nice option you can take any Linn in and have it upgraded to your satisfaction. They also hold their value if you want to sell. How many pieces of electronics on your rack can hold their value? I know some of my stuff is pennies on the dollar (AVRs, Surround Processors, CD players etc.)

Agreed, but perhaps you need to upgrade to the max to be considered a "real" Linnie?

tb1

 

[class a]

Agreed, but perhaps you need to upgrade to the max to be considered a "real" Linnie?

tb1

Well I am planning on a Lingo next year. But that's the last upgrade....wellllll maybe a Keel or a Woodsong Plinth.

 

[Cascais]

I acquired an LP12 in the late 1980s but didn't hear what all the fuss was about; then I bought an Oracle Delphi III (which I am still using) and goodbye Linn. However I used an Ikemi CDp for a couple of years that was a fine piece and got me into the higher end of digital. My brother-in-law is still using that one which is now 13 years old and going strong. It has a great transport which was an in-house design. Linn seems to be left behind now, like the British motor industry.

 

[TBone]

I acquired an LP12 in the late 1980s but didn't hear what all the fuss was about; then I bought an Oracle Delphi III (which I am still using) and goodbye Linn. However I used an Ikemi CDp for a couple of years that was a fine piece and got me into the higher end of digital. My brother-in-law is still using that one which is now 13 years old and going strong. It has a great transport which was an in-house design. Linn seems to be left behind now, like the British motor industry.

Damn, as an analog devotee, I used to hate 16/44 with a passion. Still do to some extent, but ...

The Ikemi was a revelation to me when introduced. It was the first digital player I had heard that actually reproduced the higher frequencies correctly. And not only that, it introduced "transparency" to my digital lexicon; gone was the low level hash and screaming highs which plagued digital reproduction for decades. Finally, I could hear "into" the music, ironically like a good turntable. In that light, it's remains one of the very best HDCD players I've ever heard.

The Linn proprietary transport is underrated. Most audiophiles didn't consider it as an in-house built device. When it comes to in-house transports, most point to the CEC or Teacs, even the Pioneer transport got more press. It also had a "sound" all it's own, one you could easily hear on comparison to other Linn's with OEM transports.

Funny though, although I had had a variety of digital in my system pre-Ikemi, none had approached my turntable. I'd come to the conclusion that digital (16/44) had peaked after decades of listening to failed players. Then came the CD12, and everything changed.

The CD12, and more directly, the Ikemi forced me into re-evaluating both digital & analog. Finally I had a player that would push me into further system refinement (esp. vinyl rig). However, it was only after I got into needle-dropping, that the Ikemi proved an even more valuable tool. On an absolute basis (meaning best software) my turntable easily betters the Ikemi in nearly every sonic department, but this is where this saga got twisted ... because I could actually prove (to myself & others) that analog is superior to digital by playing back an LP-CDR. Initially it made no sense, especially considering the cheap and compromised Sony consumer recorder I was using to archive my LPs.

It makes far more sense to me today.

tb1

 

[Cascais]

TBone, I used to read your posts in praise of the Ikemi years ago on another forum. I agree that it is a little wonder, especially the transport, designed in house by Linn, one of the few proprietary transports. Today I own an EMM Labs XDS1 that has one of those expensive, highly praised, TEAC transports which are supposed to be 'silky and smooth.' The Linn transport on the Ikemi is quieter and smoother, IMO. I have never heard the CD12, and come to think about it, never hear much about Linn CD players any more. Have I been missing something?

 

[TBone]

TBone, I used to read your posts in praise of the Ikemi years ago on another forum. I agree that it is a little wonder, especially the transport, designed in house by Linn, one of the few proprietary transports. Today I own an EMM Labs XDS1 that has one of those expensive, highly praised, TEAC transports which are supposed to be 'silky and smooth.' The Linn transport on the Ikemi is quieter and smoother, IMO. I have never heard the CD12, and come to think about it, never hear much about Linn CD players any more. Have I been missing something?

The CD12 is perhaps the most romantic player I've heard to date, because it certainly seducing me. It changed my entire perception of what 16/44 could accomplish. I'd never heard anything quite like the CD12 then, and since. The Ikemi is much drier tonally in comparison to the 12, but it's a very resolute, albeit lean, player from top to bottom. In cartridge terms, it's much more Lyra than Benz.

Linn replaced the Ikemi with the Majik CDP, a real nice player which did not include the Linn transport. I'm not certain it needed to, considering it outperformed everything I put it up against with relative ease. It's a better player than the Ikemi in terms of overall resolution and color, but lacked the Ikemi instrumental impact ... a character that I associate with the Linn transports based machines. It was kinda strange that Linn discontinued it relatively quickly after introduction but they obviously had other digital agendas. They made the Akurate SACD/CD player which did include the Linn transport, and which I also auditioned. It also was a very nice sounding player, certainly a little darker than the Majik but again, more dynamic slam. I considered it too expensive, because past SACD capability, it didn't have nearly enough digital flexibility. Hence Linn's move to computer based digital audio systems, which do sound wonderful ... albeit quite different from their dedicated optical based players. Although the Linn community has praised the sound of Linn's new digital products as "far" superior to past digital devices, I'm not nearly as convinced. At this point (I need to develop more experience) I consider 'em more "different" than better.

I've been a big fan of Ed Meitner for decades. Some of the best digital I've ever heard.

tb1

 

[Cascais]

The CD12 is perhaps the most romantic player I've heard to date, because it certainly seducing me. It changed my entire perception of what 16/44 could accomplish. I'd never heard anything quite like the CD12 then, and since. The Ikemi is much drier tonally in comparison to the 12, but it's a very resolute, albeit lean, player from top to bottom. In cartridge terms, it's much more Lyra than Benz.

Linn replaced the Ikemi with the Majik CDP, a real nice player which did not include the Linn transport. I'm not certain it needed to, considering it outperformed everything I put it up against with relative ease. It's a better player than the Ikemi in terms of overall resolution and color, but lacked the Ikemi instrumental impact ... a character that I associate with the Linn transports based machines. It was kinda strange that Linn discontinued it relatively quickly after introduction but they obviously had other digital agendas. They made the Akurate SACD/CD player which did include the Linn transport, and which I also auditioned. It also was a very nice sounding player, certainly a little darker than the Majik but again, more dynamic slam. I considered it too expensive, because past SACD capability, it didn't have nearly enough digital flexibility. Hence Linn's move to computer based digital audio systems, which do sound wonderful ... albeit quite different from their dedicated optical based players. Although the Linn community has praised the sound of Linn's new digital products as "far" superior to past digital devices, I'm not nearly as convinced. At this point (I need to develop more experience) I consider 'em more "different" than better.

I've been a big fan of Ed Meitner for decades. Some of the best digital I've ever heard.

tb1

I went from the Ikemi to Ed Meitner's creations, the EMM Labs CDSA and finally the XDS1, both sounding fuller with more weight than the Linn, and both better with standard red-book CD than SACD. But I would love to hear the CD12 and compare it to the XDS1. The CD12 made jaws drop with its $20,000 price tag but there are lots of players out there that cost more than that today. And I used to think that digital was digital, period. The main Linn dealer in Portugal recently went out of business so Linn has a very low profile in this country.

 

[MylesBAstor]

The CD12 is perhaps the most romantic player I've heard to date, because it certainly seducing me. It changed my entire perception of what 16/44 could accomplish. I'd never heard anything quite like the CD12 then, and since. The Ikemi is much drier tonally in comparison to the 12, but it's a very resolute, albeit lean, player from top to bottom. In cartridge terms, it's much more Lyra than Benz.

Linn replaced the Ikemi with the Majik CDP, a real nice player which did not include the Linn transport. I'm not certain it needed to, considering it outperformed everything I put it up against with relative ease. It's a better player than the Ikemi in terms of overall resolution and color, but lacked the Ikemi instrumental impact ... a character that I associate with the Linn transports based machines. It was kinda strange that Linn discontinued it relatively quickly after introduction but they obviously had other digital agendas. They made the Akurate SACD/CD player which did include the Linn transport, and which I also auditioned. It also was a very nice sounding player, certainly a little darker than the Majik but again, more dynamic slam. I considered it too expensive, because past SACD capability, it didn't have nearly enough digital flexibility. Hence Linn's move to computer based digital audio systems, which do sound wonderful ... albeit quite different from their dedicated optical based players. Although the Linn community has praised the sound of Linn's new digital products as "far" superior to past digital devices, I'm not nearly as convinced. At this point (I need to develop more experience) I consider 'em more "different" than better.

I've been a big fan of Ed Meitner for decades. Some of the best digital I've ever heard.

tb1

Didn't you find the CD12s bass discontinuous with the rest of the frequency spectrum with the CD12? That particularly annoyed me

 

[TBone]

Didn't you find the CD12s bass discontinuous with the rest of the frequency spectrum with the CD12? That particularly annoyed me

No, not at all. A bit warm (warmest Linn digital player ever) , certainly romantic, but always fast & deep. I've actually never heard that negative attribute about the CD12 before; perhaps it was the system in which you heard it?

The one thing about Linn digital, especially with their first generation pulse-power supplies, they could (and often did) negatively interact with the rest of the system if you didn't isolate it properly. The Ikemi was a prime example; I've heard it sound totally grey & lifeless one day, and then in the exact same system, using dedicated conditioning, I've heard better expensive transports & dacs. However, although I've heard this power-supply interact within quite a few systems, generally it adds more of a grainy hazy quality to the mix, not so much a discontinuation of the lower frequencies, although that said, every time I've heard the Ikemi perform in such negative fashion, I generally unplugged the unit instead of critically condemning it .

Also, as a HDCD player, I've heard nothing comparable to CD12 ... amazing transparency & dynamic power ... I walked away thinking that I'd totally underestimated 16/44 for decades.

I went from the Ikemi to Ed Meitner's creations, the EMM Labs CDSA and finally the XDS1, both sounding fuller with more weight than the Linn, and both better with standard red-book CD than SACD.

I've heard the CDSA vs the Ikemi, but not the XDS1. I thought the CDSA had superior detail retrieval and was easily more open, but it wasn't really a fair trial ... for some reason the Ikemi didn't respond well in that particular system even though it contained dedicated power line conditioning. As far as SACD, the Ikemi has routinely bettered it within my system, but not on an absolute level.

tb1