On hunt for new a phonostage
- Thread starter TooCool4
- Start date
I am based in the UK, and was also seriously considering buying a Lino C direct from Channel D without listening to it too middle of last year (going on a high recommendation from a WBF member and reading a couple of inline reviews).
I wanted a current / trans-impedance input for my MSL Eminent Ex cartridge.
I ended up finding and buying a one owner 2019 model second hand CH Precision P1 for a great price (well well below the RRP). No regrets. I have had no issue with the P1 at all and it sounds great (even without the separate X1 power supply).
If I hadn't had found a P1 at a great price I most probably would have bought a new Lino C, although I was also looking at the Van den Hul, 'The Grail' phono stage at the time which also seems to have good reviews for it's different models of the 'The Grail'.
Bonesy Jonesy like you I had the Van den Hul in my sights also the Sutherland in the mix too, as they are current mode phonostage. The Van den Hul is a bit pricy.
The appealing thing about the Lino C is that I can have the current mode part and as an optional extra I can have the voltage mode, like I said if the current mode don’t work with my cartridge I have option of using the voltage mode.
I will make up my mind in the next day or two, on getting the unit.
The appealing thing about the Lino C is that I can have the current mode part and as an optional extra I can have the voltage mode, like I said if the current mode don’t work with my cartridge I have option of using the voltage mode.
I will make up my mind in the next day or two, on getting the unit.
Rather than my assumptions are being wrong your intentions should have been better reflected on your prior post. Selling some Lps for the sake getting new ones and ripping them before selling as you explained later is a very logical way that nobody can object I believe.
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Well, I made up my mind. I paid and placed my order today. Just got to wait as they are built to order.
Look forward to reading your impressions 'TooCool4' on the Lino C when you have fully burnt it in.
Just to share my experience. I did not experience any significant difference with Lino C with burn in. It sounded good straight away.
I really wonder how their Seta L20mk2 sounds. It costs 10 times more than Lino C and this is not a company with big mark ups. It is supposed to be the best measuring phono on the planet. Even my Lino C measures better than anything Stereophile has ever measured and L20mk2 measures even better. Besides riaa accuracy, the noise levels are really good with Lino C. When you own a 109db efficient horn system like me, you have to be very careful about the noise.
Rob emphasizes the noise level of the L20mk2 in comparison to even the Lino C. I've listened to a friend's L20mk2 through his headphones and I caught myself ignoring the music straining to catch any noise. It likely seems odd but the lack of any "noise" was almost distracting and takes some getting used to.
Low noise is always a plus *unless* the means to achieve it are also killing the music.
with
100% with you on this one however with Lino C, I hear everything more and it is the most silent phono pre I got. I feel like it was the best deal I got with any brand equipment. I love it with my Miyabi Fuuga (2.5ohm) cartridge but I want to try a MSL ultra eminent EX (0.6ohm) as it will be an even better match.
Low noise is always a plus *unless* the means to achieve it are also killing the music.
100% with you on this one however with Lino C, I hear everything more and it is the most silent phono pre I got. I feel like it was the best deal I got with any brand equipment. I love it with my Miyabi Fuuga (2.5ohm) cartridge but I want to try a MSL ultra eminent EX (0.6ohm) as it will be an even better match.
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Only Just plugged in the Channel D Lino C 3.3 phonostage today for a quick listen, liking what I hear so far.
I have now been living with Channel D’s Lino C 3.3 transimpedance phonostage for about 2 weeks.
I had to wait for it as they are built to order, equipped with the specification you order.
It arrived double boxed. I opened the boxes to the sound of something rattling around, not a good sign. I opened the unit to find 3 screws rolling around, i figured out where they came from. By looking at that I figured one more screw must be somewhere and low and behold, I found the fourth screw. Not happy about this, I emailed Channel D and followed up with a call the following day.
Rob from Channel D answered, after he figured out where the screws came from, he was very apologetic and offered to send out replacement screws and brackets the next day if I am happy to replace them myself or send the unit back. I opted to have new brackets and screws sent out.
He did explain what had happened and yes his explanation was plausible, I did say to him I was surprised QC did not pick this up before it went out the door. He assured me this is a one off, I believe him.
Anyway, that over and done with, I got down to the fun part listening.
I plugged it in and left it for a good 30 minutes while I listened to music on the Rega Ios.
I switched over to the Lino C using the Voltage mode, the first thing that came across was the quietness, the wider / deeper soundstage. Everything sounded more believable the vocals / high frequencies were clearer, the sound was punchier.
I switched back to the Rega, so I can go from the Rega back to the Lino C using the transimpedance section of the Lino C. Wow, going to the Lino C using the transimpedance part of the phonostage was an ear opener, the music sounded more real is the only way I could describe it.
So now that I know the Lino C is better than the Rega Ios, now is the time to compare the Lino C’s Voltage mode against the Current mode.
I played tracks to compare both the Voltage / current mode. The voltage mode appeared punchier which I put down to the higher gain. Using the voltage mode, with the volume knob at 9 o’clock on the current mode I had to wind it up to 11 o’clock to get about the same volume.
Anyway comparing the 2 modes, the music coming out of the current mode was just more real / believable than the music coming out of the voltage mode. That’s not to say the voltage mode is bad, just that the current mode is that much better. I prefer the current mode sound.
To get the best from a current mode phonostage the cartridge’s internal resistance should be as low as possible, some people say in the single figure range. My cartridge has an internal resistance of 24 ohm, the Lino C should apparently work with up to 40 ohm resistance but the lower the better.
Since the current mode sounded better to me, that is what I am going to use. I only had the issue of the volume from the turntable being much lower than the rest of the other sources.
I must remember to adjust the volume knob if I am going from one source to the other, else I will get a nasty surprise.
Some days later I remembered I can change the gain setting in my pre-amp, so I have now gone into the pre-amp and turned down the gain settings by 6db on all the line-in except the turntable input so now everything matches.
One of my friends came over to have a listen to the new phonostage.
I started by playing the Lino C since it was hooked up then the Rega, he liked the Lino C.
I then played the Lino C again, now going between the current / voltage mode. I did not tell my friend which was what, he correctly identified the current and voltage modes. He preferred the current mode like I did.
Rating the Lino C
I have to say on build quality I would have to rate the Lino low and on sound quality, I rate it very high. So overall I would recommend the Lino C, but I hope in the future they keep an eye on their QC and build quality.
I have played some records using the phonostage, but not as many as I would like as I have been busy. The other reason I had not played as much is one of my drive units on my speakers is on the way out, it distorts badly when a low bass note is played and that side sounds louder.
Before I worked out the issue, I had already decided to buy new speakers.
Doing a lot of tests like changing cables round so moving left cable to right to see if the information moves, nothing moved around.
Then I worked out it was the drive unit on the way out.
I then pushed on the drive units, I noticed the suspension on one of the drive unit is gone. The faulty one moved too freely and the other gave me more resistance. When playing I can see the drive unit was out of control and moving wildly compared to the other drive unit.
I have placed an order for Peak Consult Sonora plus I have placed an order for 2 matched pair drivers for the broken Peak Consult Princess Signature, I still want to be able to sell the speakers on and it would be nicer for the next person to have matched drivers.
Since the Sonora are made to order, I must wait at least 4 weeks for them to be built and shipped. Since the replacement drives are made to order as well and they don’t have any in stock so I must also wait about the same length of time. So it looks like the replacement drive units will arrive at the same time.
I had to wait for it as they are built to order, equipped with the specification you order.
It arrived double boxed. I opened the boxes to the sound of something rattling around, not a good sign. I opened the unit to find 3 screws rolling around, i figured out where they came from. By looking at that I figured one more screw must be somewhere and low and behold, I found the fourth screw. Not happy about this, I emailed Channel D and followed up with a call the following day.
Rob from Channel D answered, after he figured out where the screws came from, he was very apologetic and offered to send out replacement screws and brackets the next day if I am happy to replace them myself or send the unit back. I opted to have new brackets and screws sent out.
He did explain what had happened and yes his explanation was plausible, I did say to him I was surprised QC did not pick this up before it went out the door. He assured me this is a one off, I believe him.
Anyway, that over and done with, I got down to the fun part listening.
I plugged it in and left it for a good 30 minutes while I listened to music on the Rega Ios.
I switched over to the Lino C using the Voltage mode, the first thing that came across was the quietness, the wider / deeper soundstage. Everything sounded more believable the vocals / high frequencies were clearer, the sound was punchier.
I switched back to the Rega, so I can go from the Rega back to the Lino C using the transimpedance section of the Lino C. Wow, going to the Lino C using the transimpedance part of the phonostage was an ear opener, the music sounded more real is the only way I could describe it.
So now that I know the Lino C is better than the Rega Ios, now is the time to compare the Lino C’s Voltage mode against the Current mode.
I played tracks to compare both the Voltage / current mode. The voltage mode appeared punchier which I put down to the higher gain. Using the voltage mode, with the volume knob at 9 o’clock on the current mode I had to wind it up to 11 o’clock to get about the same volume.
Anyway comparing the 2 modes, the music coming out of the current mode was just more real / believable than the music coming out of the voltage mode. That’s not to say the voltage mode is bad, just that the current mode is that much better. I prefer the current mode sound.
To get the best from a current mode phonostage the cartridge’s internal resistance should be as low as possible, some people say in the single figure range. My cartridge has an internal resistance of 24 ohm, the Lino C should apparently work with up to 40 ohm resistance but the lower the better.
Since the current mode sounded better to me, that is what I am going to use. I only had the issue of the volume from the turntable being much lower than the rest of the other sources.
I must remember to adjust the volume knob if I am going from one source to the other, else I will get a nasty surprise.
Some days later I remembered I can change the gain setting in my pre-amp, so I have now gone into the pre-amp and turned down the gain settings by 6db on all the line-in except the turntable input so now everything matches.
One of my friends came over to have a listen to the new phonostage.
I started by playing the Lino C since it was hooked up then the Rega, he liked the Lino C.
I then played the Lino C again, now going between the current / voltage mode. I did not tell my friend which was what, he correctly identified the current and voltage modes. He preferred the current mode like I did.
Rating the Lino C
I have to say on build quality I would have to rate the Lino low and on sound quality, I rate it very high. So overall I would recommend the Lino C, but I hope in the future they keep an eye on their QC and build quality.
I have played some records using the phonostage, but not as many as I would like as I have been busy. The other reason I had not played as much is one of my drive units on my speakers is on the way out, it distorts badly when a low bass note is played and that side sounds louder.
Before I worked out the issue, I had already decided to buy new speakers.
Doing a lot of tests like changing cables round so moving left cable to right to see if the information moves, nothing moved around.
Then I worked out it was the drive unit on the way out.
I then pushed on the drive units, I noticed the suspension on one of the drive unit is gone. The faulty one moved too freely and the other gave me more resistance. When playing I can see the drive unit was out of control and moving wildly compared to the other drive unit.
I have placed an order for Peak Consult Sonora plus I have placed an order for 2 matched pair drivers for the broken Peak Consult Princess Signature, I still want to be able to sell the speakers on and it would be nicer for the next person to have matched drivers.
Since the Sonora are made to order, I must wait at least 4 weeks for them to be built and shipped. Since the replacement drives are made to order as well and they don’t have any in stock so I must also wait about the same length of time. So it looks like the replacement drive units will arrive at the same time.
If you want to get the best out of the trans impedance / current input to see what it is really capable of you need a cartridge with a much lower internal impedance to the one you have (24 Ohms is way way to high and would normally be run off a voltage input). This is the main reason why you are having to turn up the volume knob with the current input compared to the voltage input.
I am currently using a MSL Eminent Ex (internal impedance of 1.4 Ohms) with my CH P1 and it is a fantastic cartridge for the money (especially now I have it properly set-up as of last weekend i.e. dynamic VTA and Dynamic SRA now at the ideal angles for my cartridge after using my Wally Tools).
Just my two pennies worth
Correction:- My MSL Eminent Ex's internal impedance is 1.0 Ohms not 1.4 with an output voltage of 0.4mV (perfect for a current input into a Phono Stage)
Bonesy Jones I spoke to Rob at Channel D about this and he said getting a lower impedance cartridge may or may not get me a higher volume.
For now with regards to the volume issue it’s fixed, like I said I turned down the gain of everything else so all good. The one good thing that comes out of this is I am now using the best part of the volume pot range, so not all bad.
When I change my cartridge I may look for something with a lower internal impedance.
For now with regards to the volume issue it’s fixed, like I said I turned down the gain of everything else so all good. The one good thing that comes out of this is I am now using the best part of the volume pot range, so not all bad.
When I change my cartridge I may look for something with a lower internal impedance.
One thing I missed out while talking about the Lino C is, to get even more out of the unit is you need to damp the case. The case rings like a bell if you tap the top, for me i am using HRS damping plate on top of the case to get even better performance out of the phonostage.
I have to say I use HRS on top of most things for improved sound, if you have not tried HRS damping plate go and borrow one to try out.
I have to say I use HRS on top of most things for improved sound, if you have not tried HRS damping plate go and borrow one to try out.
I am very surprised to hear that you had QC with Channel D. We bought 3 units with two other friends and all are impeccable. I did not go for the voltage input but my friends did. I already have good voltage phono. Hearing what transimpedance can do with low internal resistance cartridges I had to have this combo. Open, "natural", great sound. I suggest you at least try a cartridge like that. MSL Ultra Eminent EX is 0.6ohms and that is one I like to try too. I love my fuuga and it is great with 4 point and Lino C but it is MSL also has the potential.
Well Rob’s explanation was, they were in a hurry to get the unit built and out to me in the time frame I gave. I was in America for a work conference, and I wanted to be able to take it back with me.
Rob said they had run out of the newer brackets to go with the new internal design, someone must have used the older brackets which does not work with the new design.
He was apologetic and fixed the issue.
Like I said before, I was surprised it made it past QC. Such is life, occasional mistakes happen.
