But that implies that someone who doesn't subscribe to your audio philosophies is irrational. Or is that the point?
Reviewing the Furutec Demag
- Thread starter Gregadd
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But that implies that someone who doesn't subscribe to your audio philosophies is irrational. Or is that the point?
But that implies that someone who doesn't subscribe to your audio philosophies is irrational. Or is that the point?
Rationalism vs. Empiricism
First published Thu Aug 19, 2004; substantive revision Wed Aug 6, 2008
The dispute between rationalism and empiricism concerns the extent to which we are dependent upon sense experience in our effort to gain knowledge. Rationalists claim that there are significant ways in which our concepts and knowledge are gained independently of sense experience. Empiricists claim that sense experience is the ultimate source of all our concepts and knowledge.
Rationalists generally develop their view in two ways. First, they argue that there are cases where the content of our concepts or knowledge outstrips the information that sense experience can provide. Second, they constuct accounts of how reason in some form or other provides that additional information about the world. Empiricists present complementary lines of thought. First, they develop accounts of how experience provides the information that rationalists cite, insofar as we have it in the first place. (Empiricists will at times opt for skepticism as an alternative to rationalism: if experience cannot provide the concepts or knowledge the rationalists cite, then we don't have them.) Second, empiricists attack the rationalists' accounts of how reason is a source of concepts or knowledge.
Not a whole lot different from objective vs subjective.
Gary I have not listened to vinyl in a while.
I suggest you try former member of the Manhattan Transfer, Laurel Masse Easy Living cuts 3,4.5 on Side 1. Should not be that hard to find.
Jimmy accomplished what JATP was trying to do.
Jimmy Smith It's Neessary Live at Jimmy Smiths' Supper Club cuts 3&4 SIde 1. http://www.orinjj.force9.co.uk/JimmySmith/pages/70s/nec.html
Why would any of that bring out the difference Greg?
Gary, perhaps Mike can suggest the LPs that made the biggest difference.
Gary, perhaps Mike can suggest the LPs that made the biggest difference.
I am not sure. Question is, how is the performance of a cartridge impacted by a magnetic field? Since the cartridge works by translating the mechanical movement to electrical current using a coil and a magnet, it would seem that residual magnetic field would create baseline current that would not normally be there. So as with the CD, perhaps it only matters when the signals are at their lowest level. If so, you want to have something that is quiet and clean but with low level signals.
An interesting hypothesis about how it may work. I have used both Lps as a reference. The music is good too.
Mike, thanks for your experience on this.
Did anything change/improve when you tried the demag on the Clarity vinyl LP?
Just to add my understanding is that the newer type compounds should be quieter as they are meant to have less static buildup-issues.
Thanks again
Orb
I am a lawyer. The DC Court of Appeals issued me a license.
I don't get to make the facts. When my clients' come to me the die is already cast. That is why I am immune to public criticism,
They have the burden of proving it's efficacy. It was important that I present thier argument. It's thier product.
These are the standard arguments made and I think it was important to present them. A computer expert like yourself certainly can do a search faster than I. Just as I can find legal precedent faster than you.
So you are unlicensed where I live. No wonder
.Didn't know you represent Asian companies. Aren't you on the wrong coast to attract such clients?
(OK, so most Japanese companies have their headquarters in NJ. -- shoot me ).Would you do that in a legal case? If I came to you and said my brother will say I am innocent. Will you put my brother on stand before talking to him and make sure he is really going to say that? I thought lawyers never asked a question they did not know the answer to. No?
My partner knows more lawyers than all of the people in US combined. I ask him why: he says they have a logical mind that he really appreciates. And that they think through things as part of their job. I have also had the pleasure of working with superb lawyers during my stay at Microsoft. The type of lawyer you "partner" with to solve problems not call when you are in hot water over something. I have learned so much from that interaction. So when I poke my finger in your eye, it all in good fun but also, in spirit of the great respect I have for the profession when we are not talking ambulance chasers.
Fureuech presented a written statement. So I have called witnesses and cross examined them based on that statement. The better course would be to talk to them. How would I interview Furetech? In criminal cases surprise is allowed. You can't take depositions and witnesses have no obligation to talk to you. Inevitably you have to ask questions you do not know they answer to. It goes without saying I do not have the resources of Microsfts lawyers.
Ethically it would be the clients call and I woudl have to call him.
I'll send you a bill for that legal advice.
garylkoh
WBF Technical Expert (Speakers & Audio Equipment)
Thanks Greg. I've managed to find the Jimmy Smith still sealed and a promo of the Laura Masse. They may not arrive in time for next week, but your recommendations have always been fantastic music and great recordings.
Admitting a typical moving coil cartridge we can have two effects - modulation of tracking force because of interaction with the LP magnetic field or spurious signals induced in the coils by the LP magnetic field. The second can be easier to see in an analyzer - just do not drop the stylus in the groove, keep it at .5 mmm from the surface and look at the noise spectra in both cases.
The first one may be more difficult to see, perhaps using an old grooveless LP as those used to set the anti-skating will make things visible, or using a AM demodulator and a 10 kHz signal, as it was used to measure reel-to-reel tape flutter.
Unhappily I do not have access to a Furutech demagnetizer.
For the CDs I would look at the voltage correction signals of the optical readout servos also using an analyzer.
Any music you like. But if the listening to before / after demagging is not done blind, I'm not interested in anyone's opinion.
--Ethan
I think Gary said it would be ABX. If not you don't mind if the rest of us examine it?
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I've sure you have expereinced that your favorite recordings change as your system changes. These two seem to remain favorites no matter what.
I take the same stand... I have first hand experience on how knowing in other words seeing affect our recollection of perception...
In all of this it seems that many are willing to believe in such products and that could be fine if we weren't trying to split hairs trying to find way to prove that they work ... If the difference are indeed there .. Remove the knowledge and see what happens ...
But of course you see the irony don't you? Stereo reproduction is an attempt to effect human perception. It is that very perception that you say is unreliable. It's not the human perception that has failed. It's our attempt to influence. it.
As far as the Furetech demag is concerned. Magnetism and it's effects can be measured. It puzzles me that instead of all this name calling someone did not just measure it.
As far as the Furetech demag is concerned. Magnetism and it's effects can be measured. It puzzles me that instead of all this name calling someone did not just measure it.
Greg
I lost you there.. Human perception is fallible .. Consistently ... It fails upon influences some, strictly psychological... Indeed our attempt to fool it fail sometimes it doesn't fail all the time , even on a lowly phone we are able to recognize voices ...
However much we would like to think of it as being different, Sound reproduction falls under the law of physics. I am always reminded in audiophile discussions about something I read back in Terminales (Final year of High School in French School System) in which someone says that "while everything is affected by everything , the flap of a butterfly wings doesn't affect the orbit of Jupiter" .. We are in those insignificant levels of magnetism there .. not anything that will make a difference .. We can however be led to believe we did hear such ... Oh yes! We can be influenced to think we heard differences .. A good portion of the High End Industry is based on these very premises ...
I lost you there.. Human perception is fallible .. Consistently ... It fails upon influences some, strictly psychological... Indeed our attempt to fool it fail sometimes it doesn't fail all the time , even on a lowly phone we are able to recognize voices ...
However much we would like to think of it as being different, Sound reproduction falls under the law of physics. I am always reminded in audiophile discussions about something I read back in Terminales (Final year of High School in French School System) in which someone says that "while everything is affected by everything , the flap of a butterfly wings doesn't affect the orbit of Jupiter" .. We are in those insignificant levels of magnetism there .. not anything that will make a difference .. We can however be led to believe we did hear such ... Oh yes! We can be influenced to think we heard differences .. A good portion of the High End Industry is based on these very premises ...
