This is a mischaracterization. Only Phil, playing at deafening volume, believed he heard some compression.
Exactly, Ked thinks he knows a situation in depth that he was not present at and then proceeds to construct a strawman to knock down...even going so far to say that you should likely change your speakers (probably because he thinks they are not good or something.) to get an amp of the type you are considering.
 
This is a mischaracterization. Only Phil, playing at deafening volume, believed he heard some compression.

The fact that the sound didn't fall apart leads me to the opposite conclusion as you -- it actually gives me encouragement that I might be able to go down to 50 watts (with good drive).


Post in thread 'Ron’s New System'


Post in thread 'Ron’s New System'
 
This is a mischaracterization. Only Phil, playing at deafening volume, believed he heard some compression.

Another thing to consider is that rooms also can run out of headroom. What might seem like compression may, in some cases, actually be room distortion at the high volume played at. I have experienced this myself, only knowing about it in hindsight after I further fixed the room.
 
Ron started out thinking vinyl would be his main source and digital for visitors and tape for special occasions


Now he seems to be playing tape mostly, digital quite often and turntable occasionally.

Actually, I play digital only for visitors.
After seven years waiting to hatch his system, he is listening and evolving his opinions. That seems pretty normal to me. I commend Ron for his openness and sharing and solicitations.

Thank you, Peter!

In my mind I don't have any ego about any of this. I am happy to be extremely transparent and expose the cacophony of my decision-making processes, and be open and honest if I make a mistake, to my ears, in this particular system, with a component selection.
 
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Sorry, my question was garbled.

I meant to ask:

How do you think the VAC 70/70 sounds compared to Jadis JA80/100/120?

How do you think the VAC 70/70 sounds compared to 845 PSET such as Absolare or MastersounD?
I think the VAC 30/30 that I had (same design, less power) was probably the closest to a decent SET amp that I have heard in a PP amp. I think it was rich but not overly ripe, had plenty of resolution and pretty awesome bass and grunt. It misses out on the SET flow a bit and the tonal palette is less organic than a good SET but better than other PP tube amps I have heard.

The Jadis amp that I have heard that I liked the best was the Defy 7 MKIII with Siltech cabling. That was also quite close in sound to my KR Audio amp at the time (VA350i) on a pair of Focal Mezzo Utopia Evos (or something like that...mid sized with midrange above tweeter and pretty sizable bass driver).

I have only heard the 845 PSET from Absolare at shows on Rockport...not my thing really. The big Mastersound amp I have not heard.

Again, I can name a couple of amps that I am sure will not run out of gas on the ribbon:

Aries Cerat Concero 65 reference, signature or LE
NAT Transmitter monos
NAT Magama new monos
KR Audio DX monos
VAC PHI 70 or 70/70 Renaissance
VAC 140/140 monos

That THRAX Sparatcus 300 sounds great but is very expensive (over 80K) and would probably be ok as well.

The only reason I would even go with this much power is that your room is fairly large.
 
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So why are you reporting headroom issues with Jadis, and then considering amps that do not have as much drive

I reported Phil's opinion at deafening volume. I personally have no headroom issue with JA100.
 
I think the VAC 30/30 that I had (same design, less power) was probably the closest to a decent SET amp that I have heard in a PP amp. I think it was rich but not overly ripe, had plenty of resolution and pretty awesome bass and grunt. It misses out on the SET flow a bit and the tonal palette is less organic than a good SET but better than other PP tube amps I have heard.

The Jadis amp that I have heard that I liked the best was the Defy 7 MKIII with Siltech cabling. That was also quite close in sound to my KR Audio amp at the time (VA350i) on a pair of Focal Mezzo Utopia Evos (or something like that...mid sized with midrange above tweeter and pretty sizable bass driver).

I have only heard the 845 PSET from Absolare at shows on Rockport...not my thing really. The big Mastersound amp I have not heard.

Again, I can name a couple of amps that I am sure will not run out of gas on the ribbon:

Aries Cerat Concero 65 reference, signature or LE
NAT Transmitter monos
NAT Magama new monos
KR Audio DX monos
VAC PHI 70 or 70/70 Renaissance
VAC 140/140 monos

That THRAX Sparatcus 300 sounds great but is very expensive (over 80K) and would probably be ok as well.

The only reason I would even go with this much power is that your room is fairly large.
Thank you!

Are you able to compare the sound of the Thrax Spartacus 300B to any of the other amps we are talking about?

Does the Thrax lean warm/weighty in the Jadis direction or does it lean neutral/more objective?
 
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Can you please clarify seriously considered?

1. Heard it at a show
2. Heard it on a system
3. heard it and compared in one system
4. heard it and compared with multiple speakers
5. Messaged random forum member about it and asked
6. Messaged forum member with tastes aligned and asked
7. Read review
8. Thought hard about it in absence of listening to it.
Loved this post! The last 2 are classic, time-tested methodologies and totally bullet-proof!
7. Read review
8. Thought hard about it in absence of listening to it.
 
Thank you!

Are you able to compare the sound of the Thrax Spartacus 300B to any of the other amps we are talking about?

Does the Thrax lean warm/weighty in the Jadis direction or does it lean neutral/more objective?
No just heard it at the show in Munich this year. At least in that system it was more on the resolved/neutral side but tonality seemed pretty accurate.
 
No just heard it at the show in Munich this year. At least in that system it was more on the resolved/neutral side but tonality seemed pretty accurate.

Everything you here is at Munich.
 
IMO, this compression is one of the big culprits in the difference between live and played back music. It is why horns will do dynamics better...not because this doesn't happen...it just happens a lot louder!

Of course, compressed recordings will impose their own will on the playback that also blunts realism.
of course all recordings are limited. Listen to some drums on the PA loudspeaker and then listen to it at home. Home systems cannot process this, which is why all recordings are limited to 30db dynamic. With an LP the needle of the cartridge would jump immediately.
 
Exactly, Ked thinks he knows a situation in depth that he was not present at and then proceeds to construct a strawman to knock down...even going so far to say that you should likely change your speakers (probably because he thinks they are not good or something.) to get an amp of the type you are considering.

No, you are mischaracterizing. I put posts up that in addition to Phil, Don and even Ron said the same about his 80w some time ago.
 
Post in thread 'Ron’s New System'


Post in thread 'Ron’s New System'
These merely are musings as of a certain date and an uncertain state of mind -- thinking out loud (er, thinking out posting) is a good way to put it.
 
Another thing to consider is that rooms also can run out of headroom. What might seem like compression may, in some cases, actually be room distortion at the high volume played at. I have experienced this myself, only knowing about it in hindsight after I further fixed the room.
Interesting, Al. I don't know, with the adjacent equipment room acting as kind of a SPL vent which almost doubles the interior cubic footage I'm skeptical it was the room.

Phil was playing so loudly I was nervous he was going to blow the drivers.
 
These merely are musings as of a certain date and an uncertain state of mind -- thinking out loud (er, thinking out posting) is a good way to put it.

But if you thought out loud with Don that 80w was already pushing it, and that Don heard clipping on Mahler 3, don’t accuse me of mischaracterization. Next time, please say “you took literally what I said a few days before which was me just in a confused state not sure of what I was posting”
 
Al, Ron seems pretty firm on Class A and massive panels with woofer towers and the supremacy of analog. He lusted after the Martin Logan Statements too. Just saying, most are quite firm in their beliefs. He will find the amps that work best for him with those given speakers.
Thank you, Peter. I think this is an accurate characterization.

The only thing I would quibble with is to substitute "preferences" for "beliefs." I have believed things (Pendragons need high power) which my preferences have proven to be incorrect.
 
and then considering amps that do not have as much drive
Simply because I feel that I don't know yet what is the lower limit of power/drive which still does most of what I want on big classical.
 
Thank you, Peter. I think this is an accurate characterization.

The only thing I would quibble with is to substitute "preferences" for "beliefs." I have believed things (Pendragons need high power) which my preferences have proven to be incorrect.

yes, 80 watts is pretty low. Sayin’ with a straight face
 

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