Sme 3012 R

I know this old arm is good but I don’t know why David,Rockitman,Tang,Ron,Mike
Use or will use having top tonearm like Sat,EliteAxiom,Black Beauty,Durand

Why 3012 is so special?
I never had and I don’t understand
Only to know for my curiosity
Regards
Gian

 

Is this the cable u guys are looking for? I've had this from a long forgotten SME arm, maybe 1980..
View attachment 43473

Should we create an auction section in WBF?

 

Should we create an auction section in WBF?

I’m not bidding against David, if it was not for him, i would not even know about this cable/arm .

 

SOLD.....

More TT stuff coming as I'm cleaning out the audio stuff.

 

Is this the cable u guys are looking for? I've had this from a long forgotten SME arm, maybe 1980..

View attachment 43472
View attachment 43473

Hmm, I have one of those in Storage somewhere too --better dig it up

BruceD

 

I don't know if I will need to adjust overhang between the Atlas and Opus1 since they were exactly the same on my Black Beauty (which also is a fixed headshell - more or less).

I will absolutely have to change VTF!

If I switch arms, I will absolutely swap armboards. Would I do this as a way of changing cartridges? Not sure. I was originally thinking that I would use the 3012R for the Atlas (so I could have precise VTF) and the Opus1 on the Black Beauty (which it works very well with) but I will have to try my Opus1 on the 3012R and see how it sounds.

I'm still getting used to the 3012R's operational mechanics (the arm rest lock is a little strange and the arm feels so flimsy) as well as the sonics. I looked into my bag of tricks and found an SME phono cable (can't recall why I ever bought that but I did) and no longer have a cable issue per se. I feel like I'm hearing a little bit of a metallic signature that is probably the cable, but overall I'm digging the sound very much. I'm probably hearing my Atlas more accurately than with the Black Beauty (given the VTF issue I had) so some of what I'm noticing might be that. The sound is VERY clean and clear though; piccolos and other high frequency instruments are coming through nicely, bass is clean with good punch and transients are super. Piano is fantastic.

Best $2k I've ever spent me thinks.

I did buy a couple other phono cables to try (including the one rockitman recommended) and am looking forward to comparing. Also looking forward to trying the Opus1 and getting my dB Systems protractor to fine tune.

The one thing that you can't do easily at all with this arm is adjust arm height. That is a major PITA. You would hate this arm Peter since you couldn't adjust for LP thickness.

Otherwise the design is very interesting. It has a nice mechanism for adjusting course VTF, but by comparison the fine VTF is a bit frustrating - but overall WAY less frustrating than my Black Beauty and seems to sound as good. It might even be better but it's hard to know since prior to this past Monday I've only listened to the Etna (which I've now given back to the person who loaned it to me). While I did put my Atlas on the Black Beauty for a couple days before switching over to the SME, I did not have the VTF dialed in properly so in some ways I'm hearing two changes at once (Atlas + SME).

Dear Ian,

My advise is to keep fine tuning it. Be bold. Use the reference record that you know best. Don’t worry about the high is too high or analytical. If the voice you know is raspy let it be raspy. Don’t try to make it sounds beautiful to your ears. I was given a few records and a full day training listening session with instruction on what, where and how to listen to these pieces of music as recorded. When I tune the setup closest to that point, all other recordings just sound excellent with more degree of differences in the music itself without sounding homogeneous. I am only a beginner. It takes me a long time to fine tune but It is a lot of fun learning. I even messed up my setup of my AtlasSL just to see if I could get it back to the point ddk has setup. Now it sound even better...hehe, because he didn’t have time to play with vtf at that time.

My Opus and AtlasSL sound best on 3012R. It will be difficult for you to realize how good the SME is comparing to your Black Beauty because you don’t have two arms on the same tt. The cable only took me two days to be fully burned and it won’t sound funny any more. The Piccolos you are using will alter sound. They make the sound stage more engulfing or immersive too imo.

Btw, the card trick Christian using, you can use a normal desk of cards. But it would be easier to cut them into strips about one and a half inch width so they won’t stick out too much when stack up to support arm stem. Easy peasy adjusting arm height Ian.

Kind regards,
Tang

 

Dear Ian,

My advise is to keep fine tuning it. Be bold. Use the reference record that you know best. Don’t worry about the high is too high or analytical. If the voice you know is raspy let it be raspy. Don’t try to make it sounds beautiful to your ears. I was given a few records and a full day training listening session with instruction on what, where and how to listen to these pieces of music as recorded. When I tune the setup closest to that point, all other recordings just sound excellent with more degree of differences in the music itself without sounding homogeneous. I am only a beginner. It takes me a long time to fine tune but It is a lot of fun learning. I even messed up my setup of my AtlasSL just to see if I could get it back to the point ddk has setup. Now it sound even better...hehe, because he didn’t have time to play with vtf at that time.

My Opus and AtlasSL sound best on 3012R. It will be difficult for you to realize how good the SME is comparing to your Black Beauty because you don’t have two arms on the same tt. The cable only took me two days to be fully burned and it won’t sound funny any more. The Piccolos you are using will alter sound. They make the sound stage more engulfing or immersive too imo.

Kind regards,
Tang

Tango how many hours did the cable play during those two days for it to be completely broken in? Are you saying that you are altering the set up that David made after he left? So now do you have it sounding better than it did when David was there? Do you listen to the SAT arm anymore or your other turntables?

 

Tango how many hours did the cable play during those two days for it to be completely broken in? Are you saying that you are altering the set up that David made after he left? So now do you have it sounding better than it did when David was there? Do you listen to the SAT arm anymore or your other turntables?

Hi Peter,

It took only two days (about 12 hours.) for my cable to settle meaning the negatives were gone but the cable kept improving a little. Yes I intentionally messed up ddk setting on AtlasSL. I want to see if I could get back to where it was by myself. Of course, I have written down notes on his setup as a back up . Turn out that it sounds better now. I lowered down the vtf about 0.1 gram. The AtlasSL could sound no where near analytical if you put more weight on. Having done that I consequently had to change the vta too. With AtlasSL lowering down the height opens up sound more. I also finetuned the azimuth to get a balance sound. Christian and I seem to be having fun playing with carts and setting ever since we had the AS in our system. You are right about the importance of clarity and resolution. I said before the AS surprised me a lot on this regard. The other tts I have didn’t..even the EMT. I learn more about the arms carts I have in the past few weeks than the whole time I had before that because this clarity makes me hear differences more. I just finished tuning my GFS/ SAT. Right now I only listen to what are on my AS. Watch out Peter, I will catch up with you soon on this cart setup thing .

Kindest regards,
Tang

 

Hi Tang,
Have you tried 3012 with MSL Signature Platinum?
Thx

 

Hi Tang,
Have you tried 3012 with MSL Signature Platinum?
Thx

Although the Opus has better high extension and more holographic sound of woody instruments, The Platinum pretty much share sound signature with Opus. The SME is working terrific with my Opus. So I would think it performs the same with the Platinum. I haven’t tried it on though.

Kind regards,
Tang

 

Thanks Tang!

 

Not sure what's going on. Normally this thread is ALWAYS in the new posts tab. I will change that

After living with the arm with SPU Classic GM E over the weekend, I am very impressed. Its a very natural sounding tonearm and brings out the SPU's strengths more than any other tonearm I have tried. It's a keeper.

 

Not sure what's going on. Normally this thread is ALWAYS in the new posts tab. I will change that

After living with the arm with SPU Classic GM E over the weekend, I am very impressed. Its a very natural sounding tonearm and brings out the SPU's strengths more than any other tonearm I have tried. It's a keeper.

View attachment 43511

I am glad you like it.
Btw, This is a really good picture. It has the mood.

Tang

 

I am glad you like it.
Btw, This is a really good picture. It has the mood.

Tang

Tang. better than I had hoped for. Thanks to David, yourself, Micro and co for peddling its good sound on this thread. SPU Royal GM mkII will be next cartridge.

Will wait a few weeks for David's protractor to become available and then put a few normal carts on it - Yes - including the Atlas SL at some stage. I will move the Thales SimplicityII with AtlasSL to the TW Acustik table - then move the Atlas to the 3012-R. That will give an apples with apples idea on how each tonearm plays with the AtlasSL.

more pics everyone of your 3012-R in action

cheers

 

Dear Ian,

My advise is to keep fine tuning it. Be bold. Use the reference record that you know best. Don’t worry about the high is too high or analytical. If the voice you know is raspy let it be raspy. Don’t try to make it sounds beautiful to your ears. I was given a few records and a full day training listening session with instruction on what, where and how to listen to these pieces of music as recorded. When I tune the setup closest to that point, all other recordings just sound excellent with more degree of differences in the music itself without sounding homogeneous. I am only a beginner. It takes me a long time to fine tune but It is a lot of fun learning. I even messed up my setup of my AtlasSL just to see if I could get it back to the point ddk has setup. Now it sound even better...hehe, because he didn’t have time to play with vtf at that time.

My Opus and AtlasSL sound best on 3012R. It will be difficult for you to realize how good the SME is comparing to your Black Beauty because you don’t have two arms on the same tt. The cable only took me two days to be fully burned and it won’t sound funny any more. The Piccolos you are using will alter sound. They make the sound stage more engulfing or immersive too imo.

Btw, the card trick Christian using, you can use a normal desk of cards. But it would be easier to cut them into strips about one and a half inch width so they won’t stick out too much when stack up to support arm stem. Easy peasy adjusting arm height Ian.

Kind regards,
Tang

Hi Tang,

Thank for your enthusiastic words of encouragement. I somehow missed this until just now.

It's great that you are taking charge of adjusting your own setup. I had decided a while ago that I didn't want to have to depend on anyone other than myself for cartridge setup, but that doesn't mean I still don't have a lot to learn! And yes, learning is fun!

I am using the card trick, but am finding it a little tricky to make sure they don't 'fall out'. While I have same long & thin deck as Steve, I still like your idea of cutting the cards, modifying them to suit the purpose better. I am also getting better at raising/lowering the VTA. Yesterday I had some good results and will continue to experiment.

I do love how this arm allows me to have more confidence in VTF, VTA, azimuth. I suppose one day I will go back to my Black Beauty to see if I'm missing anything.

 

Hi Peter,

It took only two days (about 12 hours.) for my cable to settle meaning the negatives were gone but the cable kept improving a little. Yes I intentionally messed up ddk setting on AtlasSL. I want to see if I could get back to where it was by myself. Of course, I have written down notes on his setup as a back up . Turn out that it sounds better now. I lowered down the vtf about 0.1 gram. The AtlasSL could sound no where near analytical if you put more weight on. Having done that I consequently had to change the vta too. With AtlasSL lowering down the height opens up sound more. I also finetuned the azimuth to get a balance sound. Christian and I seem to be having fun playing with carts and setting ever since we had the AS in our system. You are right about the importance of clarity and resolution. I said before the AS surprised me a lot on this regard. The other tts I have didn’t..even the EMT. I learn more about the arms carts I have in the past few weeks than the whole time I had before that because this clarity makes me hear differences more. I just finished tuning my GFS/ SAT. Right now I only listen to what are on my AS. Watch out Peter, I will catch up with you soon on this cart setup thing .

Kindest regards,
Tang

Tang, what VTF are you currently set at on your AtlasSL?

Also, when you fine tune VTF, are you doing it by sliding the smaller weight or do you rotate the knob at the back of the larger weight?

 

Tang. better than I had hoped for. Thanks to David, yourself, Micro and co for peddling its good sound on this thread. SPU Royal GM mkII will be next cartridge.

Will wait a few weeks for David's protractor to become available and then put a few normal carts on it - Yes - including the Atlas SL at some stage. I will move the Thales SimplicityII with AtlasSL to the TW Acustik table - then move the Atlas to the 3012-R. That will give an apples with apples idea on how each tonearm plays with the AtlasSL.

more pics everyone of your 3012-R in action

cheers

I also echo thanks for all the 3012R champions here!

Btw, in case it matters to you, the stylus guard for the AtlasSL will not fit due to the shape of the SME headshell.

When my house cleaners were here last Thursday I removed the headshell and hid it in a closet.

 

Tang, what VTF are you currently set at on your AtlasSL?

Also, when you fine tune VTF, are you doing it by sliding the smaller weight or do you rotate the knob at the back of the larger weight?

The larger weight is to balance the tonearm only. Once you achieve a balanced, perfectly level tone arm, you adjust the small counter weight to set force. It's remarkably accurate.

 

The larger weight is to balance the tonearm only. Once you achieve a balanced, perfectly level tone arm, you adjust the small counter weight to set force. It's remarkably accurate.

Do you have to do it that way? It is easier to make very fine adjustments with the larger weight.

 

I do love how this arm allows me to have more confidence in VTF, VTA, azimuth.

What are you using to check the azimuth?

 

Tang, what VTF are you currently set at on your AtlasSL?

Also, when you fine tune VTF, are you doing it by sliding the smaller weight or do you rotate the knob at the back of the larger weight?

My vtf is at 1.8 something. My Ortofon scale is only one decimal point. You are using 1.72 right? At my current setting, I have most presence, musical connection and goose bumps. Ian I really recommend you to get Hilary Hahn Retrospective. The first disc is direct to disc. Play second side second song. You will hear such un-homogeneous clapping. The kind of claps that will give you a big smile. The violin she plays will hold your soul and move it along her bow. The GFS is not going to be able to produce this kind of violin with tonal width and spectrum, the resonance of wood together with the bow strings. Both AtlasSL and Opus 1 you have can do this beautifully. This is one of the record I used to fine tune the cart setting.

I used the small weight as Jeffrey said.

Kind regards,
Tang