State-of-the-Art Digital

[PeterA]

Here you go . . .

I liked (for digital) SGM Extreme + MSB Select II at MikeL.

I liked (for digital) SGM Extreme + Lampizator Pacific at Audioquattr.

I liked (for digital) Innuous + MSB Premier at KeithR and at Alma Music and Audio.

Before I heard the above I thought SpiritofMusic’s EDP CD player sounded okay to good.

Ron, are you referring to the digital audition at Mike's as the same visit during which you compared his three amplifiers? I recall that was a fairly lively discussion.

 

[PeterA]

You heard 4 digital systems. Wow impressed

You are forgetting the ones in his various cars, the one in his phone. I heard Al M's system with Ron. I'm sure there are others.

 

[Al M.]

I heard a direct comparison between the Vivaldi stack and the Yggy in a familiar system. I only very slightly preferred the Vivaldi, though two of my friends much preferred the Yggy in this same system. Perhaps the Yggy DAC should be on Ron's list. Don't ask me which version of each we compared, as these things change frequently and I can't keep up.

I really liked the dCS Rossini when I auditioned it at a local dealer.

It was the Yggdrasil version 1 I believe, though it could also have been the Yggdrasil Analog 2 that I now have as well and that is better. I do think it was the Vivaldi 2.0 upgrade, and with the Upsampler. Yet it was without the external Vivaldi Clock, which by many is viewed as essential to the comprehensive Vivaldi performance.

Regardless, Ron did hear the Yggy (version 1) in my system, but as I think both you and I agree, he probably wouldn't recognize the sound of my system as it has become so much better and more natural in the meantime, and without gremlins, digital or otherwise.

In terms of performance in absolute terms, the Yggdrasil Analog 2 is worthwhile to consider -- and its performance is simply outrageous for the low price --, even though it will probably not compete with some of the uber DACs. The question though is how it would fit into Ron's system in terms of tonal balance. In my digital only system, the tonal balance is now very satisfying, and much better than when Ron heard it. Yet I have optimized everything around the digital source; I do not know if and how much of a discrepancy there would be with Ron's turntable set-up. Yet if that question stands for the Yggy, it would stand just the same for the Vivaldi.

I did hear the MSB Premier with Powerbase in another (also digital only) system, and tonal balance was comparable to mine. Yet it is obviously hard to gauge similarities or differences of the digital components themselves across different systems, each optimized in itself.

 

[bonzo75]

Ked, you still have only heard that exact ONE Pacific DAC, is that right?

I seriously suspect that this unit has a fault or a flaw because I know more than 10 People who upgraded their own GG1 and GG2 to Pacific and NONE of them considers their GG1 or GG2 anywhere near their Pacific. Most of them had their GG1/GG2 at the same time as their Pacific and could directly compare.

For me, the Pacific is in another league above the already excellent GG1/GG2.
The pacific is much more transparent and yet very musical and organic: just plain wonderful!

Please listen to another Pacific unit before you continue to spread your wisdom so vocally

I have compared with various electronics and GG and with various speakers one Pacific. I have additionally heard one in Scotland, and one at audioquattr's. Going by the way people report on this thread I should also add the ones in Munich

 

[jfrech]

I have not heard recent dCS components.

dCS Vivaldi has to be on your list. I'm with Microstrip, Peter and others who prefer it...
The Nagra HD Dac is also very very good and it's in with the dCS Vivaldi as the top tier of digital...

 

[Zero000]

I have compared with various electronics and GG and with various speakers one Pacific. I have additionally heard one in Scotland, and one at audioquattr's. Going by the way people report on this thread I should also add the ones in Munich

The Munich ones are 3/10.

What Lucasz needs to do is put some in a few of the good rooms at Munich.

 

[Barry2013]

IME the DCS products are the most analogue sounding digital components.
The recently announced Rossini V2 Dac looks very good value

 

[Al M.]

To follow up on my post above, I forgot to mention I was one of those who preferred the Yggy over the Vivaldi; resolution is very comparable (timbral micro-detail, separation of instruments), which is an outrageous feat for the Yggy given its low price. Yet again, the Vivaldi was without is external clock, which many find essential.

As for tonal balance, I should also refine my observations: the Yggy has somewhat more body in lower midrange and mid bass, while the Vivaldi presents a more generous deep bass (in my own system this would be inconsequential since I adjust the subs). But as I said, this is without the external Vivaldi Clock, the effects of which on tonal balance I do not know.

 

[howiebrou]

Ron, there are a number of dacs that i would rate highly if you are looking for an organic, rich, analog sound (in no particular order):
1. Total Dac D1 Direct or D1 Twelve
2. Lampizator Pacific
3. Metronome C8+
4. Zanden 4 box dac

I am not a fan of DCS nor Esoteric but i have not heard them in a while. The Scarlatti was absolutely awful imo.

 

[christoph]

I have compared with various electronics and GG and with various speakers one Pacific. I have additionally heard one in Scotland, and one at audioquattr's. Going by the way people report on this thread I should also add the ones in Munich

But directly compared have you only to that exact one (dubious) PAC, right?

IIrc you liked the PAC at Audioquattr's place even better than his analog...

 

[bonzo75]

But directly compared have you only to that exact one (dubious) PAC, right?

IIrc you liked the PAC at Audioquattr's place even better than his analog...

Yes, as mentioned. Much better once the 242 and 101d went in, But then the problem was the pass phono or something in the analog chain of that set up. But since I did not get to compare to a digital, I did not comment, as unlike most on this thread, I do not comment without compares. But given what I heard, I felt no reason to think it better than the GG short of a compare. The three Pacs I heard did not make me think the one I compared with was dubious. I completely accept the Lampi gain can differ, but there are many other aspects of the GG sound. The Pac is a different dac. The GG and big 7 come from a similar family

 

[christoph]

The Munich ones are 3/10.

What Lucasz needs to do is put some in a few of the good rooms at Munich.

Could it be that you just didn't like the Speakers (AudioNEC) or the Amps (Jadis) in Munich?

I hope it must be that, otherwise I would have made a terrible mistake because I bought that exact Pacific demo unit after the show
Oh wait. Back home I compared the Pacific to my GG1.9 (latest spec) before I packed the GG in it's flightcase

I really don't understand Kedars and your "Pacific witch hunt"
Could it be sour grapes?

 

[Blue58]

OK, OK that’s enough Lampi chat, time to let the Aries Cerat boys have their ten penneth before the post descends to Zu talk.

 

[howiebrou]

OK, OK that’s enough Lampi chat, time to let the Aries Cerat boys have their ten penneth before the post descends to Zu talk.

LOL.

 

[ddk]

Innuous Statement + Lampizator Pacific

Innuous Statement + MSB Select

SGM Extreme + Lampizator Pacific

SGM Extreme + MSB Select

What are some other state-of-the-art combinations of streamers and DACs?

How does one decide?

How did you decide?

Try an iPad with an Apple Airport in a direct comparison with any of the above and see how much you gain if any sonically by spending tens of thousands more and having to deal with constant complications and never ending upgrades that are simple to do inside the Apple eco system. Yes there are differences in hifi values but musically computer sources all share the same inherent qualities and short comings no matter what you spend, IMO.

david

 

[Elberoth]

MSB pushes pretty good on trying to be at the cutting edge.

They certainly are, although (measured) performance wise, I doubt they surpass the current crop of ESS 9038Pro based DACs, some of which cost as little as $400.

IMO it is important to separate state of the art sound, from state of the art performance.

 

[vess]

OK, OK that’s enough Lampi chat, time to let the Aries Cerat boys have their ten penneth before the post descends to Zu talk.

Hi guys, I was abut to pass, but you called for it. Pinkfaun 2,16x or 432EVO Master into Kassandra LE ... I guess difficult to listen to for most ... as Kassandra LE is rare beast, but it's well worth the effort. Just ask.

My .02c
Sincerely , Vess

 

[vess]

They certainly are, although (measured) performance wise, I doubt they surpass the current crop of ESS 9038Pro based DACs, some of which cost as little as $400.

IMO it is important to separate state of the art sound, from state of the art performance.

Well said, I am talking about SOTA performance

 

[KeithR]

Ron must be be extremely bored with his house/room renovation if he's starting threads about high end digital

 

[jfrech]

To follow up on my post above, I forgot to mention I was one of those who preferred the Yggy over the Vivaldi; resolution is very comparable (timbral micro-detail, separation of instruments), which is an outrageous feat for the Yggy given its low price. Yet again, the Vivaldi was without is external clock, which many find essential.

As for tonal balance, I should also refine my observations: the Yggy has somewhat more body in lower midrange and mid bass, while the Vivaldi presents a more generous deep bass (in my own system this would be inconsequential since I adjust the subs). But as I said, this is without the external Vivaldi Clock, the effects of which on tonal balance I do not know.

Hi, The Vivaldi Clock adds space, textures and resolution. Things unravel better, in it's own space so to speak and just the fineness of the resolution increases. All of this draws you into the music and a better emotional connection. It's one of those things you hear from the first note and just can't go back to no clock in a Vivaldi set up...