TAS Best DACs >10K...really?

marty

Well-Known Member
Apr 20, 2010
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Really? This list includes some very unmusical sounding and uber expensive DACs
We all know what's conspicuously missing. The question is, why?
 

microstrip

VIP/Donor
May 30, 2010
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Really? This list includes some very unmusical sounding and uber expensive DACs
We all know what's conspicuously missing. The question is, why?

I did not find any "unmusical DAC" in the list, although I like some of them more than others.

Considering those missing we just have to read the magazine policy to make editor choice lists - it is public and well known by TAS readers.
 

Mike Lavigne

Member Sponsor & WBF Founding Member
Apr 25, 2010
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Really? This list includes some very unmusical sounding and uber expensive DACs
We all know what's conspicuously missing. The question is, why?
it's an advertising 'fluff-piece'. for their advertising customers. Lampi does not advertise. neither do many other dac makers. where is Totaldac? or Playback Designs? or Merging Technology? or many others?

not sure anyone takes it too seriously. i know i don't.
 

Elliot G.

Industry Expert
Jul 22, 2010
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www.bendingwaveusa.com

Really? This list includes some very unmusical sounding and uber expensive DACs
We all know what's conspicuously missing. The question is, why?
Well first the products would have to be reviewed and if they haven’t they will never make a list .
Was your choice ever reviewed by the magazine ?
 

microstrip

VIP/Donor
May 30, 2010
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it's an advertising 'fluff-piece'. for their advertising customers. Lampi does not advertise. neither do many other dac makers. where is Totaldac? or Playback Designs? or Merging Technology? or many others?

not sure anyone takes it too seriously. i know i don't.

Yes, it is surely a form of advertising - the same as similar lists of every audio magazine. And it results - someone posted a link in WBF, we are talking about it. :oops:
 

Al M.

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Sep 10, 2013
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Well first the products would have to be reviewed and if they haven’t they will never make a list .
Was your choice ever reviewed by the magazine ?

Exactly. Why the MSB Reference DAC and not the MSB Select II, which is actually above it on the product ladder? Because the former was reviewed, the latter was not.
 
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godofwealth

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Feb 8, 2022
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Since the days when Harry Pearson was at the helm, TAS has sadly deteriorated into an audio rag that’s largely caters to advertisers. Back then in the 80s, I remember TAS as being fun to read. Reviews could be scathing. HP used to himself roast components he didn’t like, and pulled no punches. He was highly opinionated and that made it interesting. The musical reviews were great — Sid Marks wrote an amazingly long series on the classic RCA Living Stereo LPs. There were many interesting pieces on recoding styles, interviews with recording engineers like Kenneth Wilkinson who recorded many of Decca’s great recordings as well as Lyritas. All that’s gone now. It’s a sign of the times. All flash, with no substance.
 
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caesar

Well-Known Member
May 30, 2010
4,300
775
1,698
I did not find any "unmusical DAC" in the list, although I like some of them more than others.

Considering those missing we just have to read the magazine policy to make editor choice lists - it is public and well known by TAS readers.

personal tastes of musicality aside, this list is posted on the internet and comes up on google searched.

The number of TAS readers is a very small pittance compared to those who will see it online and be mislead by the incomplete list
 

Gregadd

WBF Founding Member
Apr 20, 2010
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Greater than $10k. Not a very challenging parameter.
 

thomask

Well-Known Member
Dec 9, 2018
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I do not understand why Ideon Absolute is not included in the list although it got rave review from TAS. :cool:

As I had done home audition of it, I believe that it deserve to be included in the list.
 

caesar

Well-Known Member
May 30, 2010
4,300
775
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I do not understand why Ideon Absolute is not included in the list although it got rave review from TAS. :cool:

As I had done home audition of it, I believe that it deserve to be included in the list.

Those mother fuyers have the agenda of their favorites they want to push :)
 
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Lee

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Feb 3, 2011
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divertiti

Well-Known Member
Jan 12, 2021
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Really? This list includes some very unmusical sounding and uber expensive DACs
We all know what's conspicuously missing. The question is, why?
1. All audio publication (any publication really) list-icles of recommended products are essentially paid advertising spots, just like almost every post on this forum by dealers and distributors are to promote their product. The answer is almost always money.

2. Audio is an incredibly fluid and subjective pursuit by nature, "unmusical" to one person is musical to another. A piece that's deemed "unmusical" in one system could bloom in another. It's a matter of both taste and synergy. Blanket opinions stated as objective fact at this level of audio doesn't make sense.
 

msimanyi

Active Member
Jan 13, 2023
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I agree with @divertiti. I take any of those lists with a grain of salt, treating them as products to possibly consider, research online (hello WBF!) and if I find users posting experience I factor in those opinions. After all that, if I'm still interested I try to find a local retailer.
 

Gregadd

WBF Founding Member
Apr 20, 2010
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1. All audio publication (any publication really) list-icles of recommended products are essentially paid advertising spots, just like almost every post on this forum by dealers and distributors are to promote their product. The answer is almost always money.

2. Audio is an incredibly fluid and subjective pursuit by nature, "unmusical" to one person is musical to another. A piece that's deemed "unmusical" in one system could bloom in another. It's a matter of both taste and synergy. Blanket opinions stated as objective fact at this level of audio doesn't make sense.
Take a deep breath.
Yes manufacrurers.dealers,distributors and reviewers want to make npney.
Truth is often the first casualty of the profit motive.
There is such a thing as ouch a thing as objective truth. There iare those that know it and are not afraid to speak it.
OTOHVas the saying goes,"Once burned twice shy
Wen accepting advice know the person's ibas and conflicts of interest. The person shuld have some knowledge and experince with the products under consideration.
As always, to thine own ears be true.
..
 

Lee

Well-Known Member
Feb 3, 2011
3,249
1,778
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Alpharetta, Georgia
1. All audio publication (any publication really) list-icles of recommended products are essentially paid advertising spots, just like almost every post on this forum by dealers and distributors are to promote their product. The answer is almost always money.

2. Audio is an incredibly fluid and subjective pursuit by nature, "unmusical" to one person is musical to another. A piece that's deemed "unmusical" in one system could bloom in another. It's a matter of both taste and synergy. Blanket opinions stated as objective fact at this level of audio doesn't make sense.
There is some correlation but not always. For instance, TAS regularly includes products from manufacturers that don't advertise.
 
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divertiti

Well-Known Member
Jan 12, 2021
208
190
113
Take a deep breath.
Yes manufacrurers.dealers,distributors and reviewers want to make npney.
Truth is often the first casualty of the profit motive.
There is such a thing as ouch a thing as objective truth. There iare those that know it and are not afraid to speak it.
OTOHVas the saying goes,"Once burned twice shy
Wen accepting advice know the person's ibas and conflicts of interest. The person shuld have some knowledge and experince with the products under consideration.
As always, to thine own ears be true.
..
Same to you my friend, breathing is good for you. It's pretty difficult trying to decipher what is being written here. One can debate philosophically whether objective truth exists in general, but I was talking specifically about audio. In audio, objective truths are extremely hard to quantify. Everything is subjective to the person, their musical taste, historical reference points, hearing profile, ear shape, bio-chemistry and dopaminergic responses. Heck, even the same person's taste could change 180 degrees during their life time of audio pursuits.

There is some correlation but not always. For instance, TAS regularly includes products from manufacturers that don't advertise.
Advertising and product placements are typically not 100% overlapping. They are two separate streams of revenue for publications, and some brands would choose to do one but not the other.
 
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Pokey77

Well-Known Member
Feb 16, 2022
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it's an advertising 'fluff-piece'. for their advertising customers. Lampi does not advertise. neither do many other dac makers. where is Totaldac? or Playback Designs? or Merging Technology? or many others?

not sure anyone takes it too seriously. i know i don't.
'or Playback Designs? or Merging Technology?' That's what I was thinking too.
 

Gregadd

WBF Founding Member
Apr 20, 2010
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I respectfully disagree. Objective truths abound in audio. It the subjective impression that causes trouble. Each has or own and all are equally valid. We goastray when we try to generalize from rhe specific.
 
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olivier

VIP/Donor
Nov 27, 2016
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Well i think this is the problem with all "best-of-reviews", no one has all existing gear at the same time at the same place...and it can´t be reviewed by a massive group of people at the same time to eliminate the subjective factor
So gear which is available will be reviewed by a small group of persons. It is simply not possible to create an objective tier list.
 
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