The Colibri “Master Signature”

kodomo

Well-Known Member
Apr 26, 2017
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All my cabling is cardas clear and my current 4 point is also wired with cardas clear. However, this one was already on its way to my dealer so I could not choose. It is with silver crystal cable. If the results are as expected, I can upgrade the tonearm wire later.
 
Likes: Marcus

bonzo75

Member Sponsor
Feb 26, 2014
11,694
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London
Kevin of vox Palladian had it on his kuzma stabi M last Munich, Sujay has it with the kuzma 9 inch, and Tima had it with kuzma (think 12 inch?)

So the chances for your variability are either due to phono or pre, or the fact that the cart quality is variable and you might have to send it back and forth a couple of times
 

kodomo

Well-Known Member
Apr 26, 2017
390
311
63
The recommended tonearm effective mass range for colibri mss is 10gr to 16gr. The 4 point 11inch me and Tima has has 18gr effective mass so the resonance falls on about 7hz which is not ideal. The 9 inch is 13gr and the resonance falls onto about 8hz, close to 9hz (depending on the mounting hardware) which is ideal.

The phono pre I have is quite adjustable and is a surprisingly natural sounding pre. The values are fitting as well.

So, first I will look into those who do not match ideally, the tonearm and cartridge. If that is not enough, then I will send the cartridge back to VdH along with my notes and will wait for him to make further adjustments.

I already decided to get the Grail phono preamp so phono preamp will change anyway.
 

tima

Industry Expert
Mar 4, 2014
851
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63
The recommended tonearm effective mass range for colibri mss is 10gr to 16gr. The 4 point 11inch me and Tima has has 18gr effective mass so the resonance falls on about 7hz which is not ideal. The 9 inch is 13gr and the resonance falls onto about 8hz, close to 9hz (depending on the mounting hardware) which is ideal.

The phono pre I have is quite adjustable and is a surprisingly natural sounding pre. The values are fitting as well.

So, first I will look into those who do not match ideally, the tonearm and cartridge. If that is not enough, then I will send the cartridge back to VdH along with my notes and will wait for him to make further adjustments.

I already decided to get the Grail phono preamp so phono preamp will change anyway.
I am told that Mr. AJ should be able to make / modify a low compliance MSS specifically for the 4Point 11" (and 14" I presume). I have that in process. And fwiw, there are MS/MSS with effective mass spec'd at 8-14gram.

I look forward to your comments on the Grail.
 

shakti

Well-Known Member
May 9, 2015
497
253
63
Cologne, Germany
It took a while until I found the new "classifieds" section of the WBF. This section has replaced the "Buy & Sell" area of the Forum and is now placed as a new header.

Assuming that I am (may be) not the only one searching for the former "Buy & Sell" area, I do a hint here as well:
I just posted my "back up" African Grenadine Master Signature , 0 hours on it. May be someone is interested.
priced for a quick deal :)

You will find the offer under the new "Classifieds" tab.
 
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kodomo

Well-Known Member
Apr 26, 2017
390
311
63
I have tried the 9" 4 point and yes it worked better with the cartridge, but I did not like the 9" 4 point itself. Also there were some other problems that stayed even with the 9" arm, so the cartridge has to be reinspected and readjusted. So, I sent the cartridge back and mounted my standart length 4 point with vta tower back on.

I asked A.J. Van den Hul to match the cartridge to my standart 4 point arm. I will let you people know how it sounds when it is back. I am still determined to make this cartridge sing in my system :)
 

sujay

Member Sponsor
May 5, 2012
393
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Singapore
I have tried the 9" 4 point and yes it worked better with the cartridge, but I did not like the 9" 4 point itself. Also there were some other problems that stayed even with the 9" arm, so the cartridge has to be reinspected and readjusted. So, I sent the cartridge back and mounted my standart length 4 point with vta tower back on.

I asked A.J. Van den Hul to match the cartridge to my standart 4 point arm. I will let you people know how it sounds when it is back. I am still determined to make this cartridge sing in my system :)
Hi, my master signature has just returned from VDH.at least from initial listening I can hear a perceptible reduction in the high frequency energy though it still show through in some recordings. Other than that, it continues to be the best cart I have used.
 

kodomo

Well-Known Member
Apr 26, 2017
390
311
63
Though it's not a 4-point thread, could you comment on the differences from the 11" and what you did not like with the 9" arm?
Well, to start with the obvious, the lack of vta tower. These cartridges are very very sensitive so my thinl old pressings and the new 200gr ones do not play well with the same vta. I really did not like the way the vta is adjusted on 9". Further than that lack of horizontal and vertical damping is also another thing. 11" is also much more robust and feels more solid.
 
Sep 7, 2016
250
260
63
Netherlands
My Colibri Master Signature had about 250+ hrs so i sended it to VDH.
I asked for adjusting it for my tonearm. I picked it up at VDH a few days a go.
From the first moment it sounded beautifull. I really liked this cartidge before but not on all records.
Most because of the lots of energy in the highs.
Well that part is really different now. It is smooth now everywhere still with superb detail.
Very fast, dynamic and the best soundstage to me of all my carts.

One thing i didn't know and what mr. A.J. van den Hul told me personally when i picked it up;
Start with VTF at 1.5 for first 100h than to around 1.42 and after 200-250hrs to 1.35gr.
Even to 1.25-1.3gr after 300hrs can give improvements.
 
Sep 7, 2016
250
260
63
Netherlands
I very much like The Grail SB phono stage. I have it on loan since a week and tested it with different cartidges.
It is quiet flexible and the current MC input works great.
All MC's are sounding good/optimal without any adjustment (because of the current input). And it is very silent.
The Colibri MS is the best pairing with this phono from the carts i have. It still is very good (for sure for the money) on other MC's.

It has great dynamics and good sounstage. Bass is fast and has enough bloom and better layered. I prefer the bass to my Pass XS.
Higher mids and highs are better imo with Pass xs. Also soundstage is a bit better to me with the Pass.
Only the MM input is much less good imo than the Pass xs.
Even on tone the pairing Colibri MS with The Grail i like it better than my TM phono. Allthough the Mayer is much more transparent and not optimal for the Colibri.
I think overall for the price the VdH Grail is a very good phonostage.
 

kodomo

Well-Known Member
Apr 26, 2017
390
311
63
I very much like The Grail SB phono stage. I have it on loan since a week and tested it with different cartidges.
It is quiet flexible and the current MC input works great.
All MC's are sounding good/optimal without any adjustment (because of the current input). And it is very silent.
The Colibri MS is the best pairing with this phono from the carts i have. It still is very good (for sure for the money) on other MC's.

It has great dynamics and good sounstage. Bass is fast and has enough bloom and better layered. I prefer the bass to my Pass XS.
Higher mids and highs are better imo with Pass xs. Also soundstage is a bit better to me with the Pass.
Only the MM input is much less good imo than the Pass xs.
Even on tone the pairing Colibri MS with The Grail i like it better than my TM phono. Allthough the Mayer is much more transparent and not optimal for the Colibri.
I think overall for the price the VdH Grail is a very good phonostage.
This is the message I wanted to read! My colibri is being retuned and I was mixed up between choosing grail sb, allnic, nagra vps etc. So now grail sb gets another vote and from a similar system. So happy to hear this :)
 

kodomo

Well-Known Member
Apr 26, 2017
390
311
63
I very much like The Grail SB phono stage. I have it on loan since a week and tested it with different cartidges.
It is quiet flexible and the current MC input works great.
All MC's are sounding good/optimal without any adjustment (because of the current input). And it is very silent.
The Colibri MS is the best pairing with this phono from the carts i have. It still is very good (for sure for the money) on other MC's.

It has great dynamics and good sounstage. Bass is fast and has enough bloom and better layered. I prefer the bass to my Pass XS.
Higher mids and highs are better imo with Pass xs. Also soundstage is a bit better to me with the Pass.
Only the MM input is much less good imo than the Pass xs.
Even on tone the pairing Colibri MS with The Grail i like it better than my TM phono. Allthough the Mayer is much more transparent and not optimal for the Colibri.
I think overall for the price the VdH Grail is a very good phonostage.
Your colibri ms is 1.1mV too, right?
 

VinylSavor

Active Member
May 15, 2018
92
156
33
Lindau, Germany
www.vinylsavor.com
Hi!

Even on tone the pairing Colibri MS with The Grail i like it better than my TM phono. Allthough the Mayer is much more transparent and not optimal for the Colibri.
I am not surprised. The Colibris have a too high output impedance for the built in MC step up. My phonos work best with cartridges of 10 Ohms or less output impedance. For higher impedance cartridges the built in transformer can be rewired or replaced by a better matching one.


Thomas
 

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