The Fremer lays an ostrich egg thread

[DaveyF]

Yep, not to my liking at all. Have you heard their stuff?

 

[A.wayne]

No never , hence my question as to why so many are against Halcro, myth or reality ..

Maybe we should ask Fremer ....

 

[MylesBAstor]

No never , hence my question as to why so many are against Halcro, myth or reality ..

Maybe we should ask Fremer ....

B-O-R-I-N-G in spades.

Agree with Davey here.

 

[Gregadd]

I never heard Halcro. Despite claim that reviewers "hate low distortion" " Halcro was widely praised in the high end press.

http://www.halcro.com/reviews.php

 

[steve williams]

I heard Halcro many years ago after reading Jeff Fritz review praising the almost non existant THD of this amp and how good it was.

When I heard it, I found it cold and emotionally unengaging. I couldn't understand what all of the fuss was about. Certainly nothing that I would ever buy

 

[mep]

I heard Halcro many years ago after reading Jeff Fritz review praising the almost non existant THD of this amp and how good it was.

When I heard it, I found it cold and emotionally unengaging. I couldn't understand what all of the fuss was about. Certainly nothing that I would ever buy

Hmm. Could that be the purity vs. sterility dealio I have been talking about?

 

[MylesBAstor]

I heard Halcro many years ago after reading Jeff Fritz review praising the almost non existant THD of this amp and how good it was.

When I heard it, I found it cold and emotionally unengaging. I couldn't understand what all of the fuss was about. Certainly nothing that I would ever buy

Didn't hurt Halcro had a great US distributor

 

[A.wayne]

I never heard Halcro. Despite claim that reviewers "hate low distortion" " Halcro was widely praised in the high end press.

http://www.halcro.com/reviews.php

Based on that stereophile bench test , the DM88 is very load sensitive and its THD transition before clipping is very sharp , The amp would require careful attn when choosing speakers , not acceptable to me at its price point ...

 

[audioarcher]

I heard Halcro many years ago after reading Jeff Fritz review praising the almost non existant THD of this amp and how good it was.

When I heard it, I found it cold and emotionally unengaging. I couldn't understand what all of the fuss was about. Certainly nothing that I would ever buy

I've heard the Halcro amps a couple of times. First time they were driving B&W N800 speakers. Driving the B&W's I thought they were fairly balanced sounding tonally and very detailed. I remember the N800 sounding a bit bloated in the bass with other amps. So I guess it was a good pairing. The next time I heard them was driving Acoustic Zen Crescendo's at RMAF 2008 or 2009. This pairing was not good at all IMO. The sound was not very transparent and not very detailed. It was the opposite of what I was expecting. It could have been the show conditions but it sucked.

In the right system they could be very nice and in the wrong system not so much. Just like lots of other gear out there.

 

[Soundminded]

The DC300 (which I also owned before the huge step up the the PL 400) measured near perfectly; why should today's Crown amps sound (or measure) any different?

Do you think they use the same design they did 45 years ago? How many times do you think their design changed since then? Of course they sound different today than the DC300.

It's remarkable how many widely ranging opinions you read and hear about the same equipment. There are so many variables how can you take anyone's word for anything even if you believe others are telling you the truth as they hear it? Personally, I think a lot of it boils down to FR. Since I have no qualms about using an equalizer (funny how they now call some of it room correction so you don't think of it as an equalizer) much of these differences can be negated. And then there's the fact that a lot of people who think they know sound....

 

[steve williams]

Didn't hurt Halcro had a great US distributor

He has a much better line now

 

[Soundminded]

I think a good question to ask anyone who reviews audio equipment before you decide whether he or she is likely to give you good advice is to ask him or her how much time on average they listen each week to recordings of music compared to how much time they spend listening to live unamplified music. Hopefully they listen to as much or more live music than recorded music. Here's a fellow who reviews equipment for a living who had a real problem. Not only didn't he hear the difference between what he thought was a perfect reproduction of a live musical instrument to the point where his audience had to point it out to him, he didn't seem to understand what they were talking about. He explains his troubles starting at about 29:00 minutes into the interview;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_mEsuKqj5wA&feature=relmfu

He's not a beginner at this either, he's been at it a long time. Evidently that doesn't seem to matter.

 

[Bruce B]

I thought Stereophile? praised the Macro Reference....

 

[amirm]

I think a good question to ask anyone who reviews audio equipment before you decide whether he or she is likely to give you good advice is to ask him or her how much time on average they listen each week to recordings of music compared to how much time they spend listening to live unamplified music. Hopefully they listen to as much or more live music than recorded music.

Why? I am trained in hearing compression artifacts. I can easily outperform people who listen to live music far more than me. The advantage I have is what to listen for and it has nothing to do with knowing what the original music sounded like. That knowledge will not help you. We tested musicians in the past and they did not have superior skills relative to our trained listeners either.

 

[Tonepub]

I attend between 50 and 100 live performances a year, depending on the year. (this year it's closer to the 50, because of an exhausting travel schedule) I listen to recorded music 12 hours a day. How would anyone that actually spends time working have "more time to listen to live, unamplified music than recorded music?"

I do find it entertaining though that you think listening to live music is of no value.

How would one possibly know what an instrument is supposed to sound like if you've never heard them live?

 

[amirm]

I do find it entertaining though that you think listening to live music is of no value.

How would one possibly know what an instrument is supposed to sound like if you've never heard them live?

You are saying I am unfamiliar with the sound of a human voice? Or a violin? Or drums?

Or that you know said sounds precisely even though the recording has gone through such massive transformations that it doesn't sound at all like the original stage?

 

[A.wayne]

I think a good question to ask anyone who reviews audio equipment before you decide whether he or she is likely to give you good advice is to ask him or her how much time on average they listen each week to recordings of music compared to how much time they spend listening to live unamplified music. Hopefully they listen to as much or more live music than recorded music. Here's a fellow who reviews equipment for a living who had a real problem. Not only didn't he hear the difference between what he thought was a perfect reproduction of a live musical instrument to the point where his audience had to point it out to him, he didn't seem to understand what they were talking about. He explains his troubles starting at about 29:00 minutes into the interview;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_mEsuKqj5wA&feature=relmfu

He's not a beginner at this either, he's been at it a long time. Evidently that doesn't seem to matter.

Im not sure you understood what he was actually trying to say and i do agree that listening to live unamplified music is a must , its not possible nor necessary for it to be the bulk of ones listening, review the reviewer , evalute their listening space and setup , doing so will give you a view into their leanings and or possible short comings ...

Reviewers with a mediocre System and listening space raving over some new mega dollar piece , is not telling you much....

 

[Gregadd]

AmirYou are saying I am unfamiliar with the sound of a human voice? Or a violin? Or drums?

Post 116

nd I addressed that. You are not situated as those musicians. They always hear their live events. You do not. You are sitting at home with a CD or LP at hand with zero clues as to how it sounded in the studio when it was mixed and mastered. That is the nature of the audio business and one of the major reasons so many disagreements exists. With no litmus test of what is live, then it is all hypothesis.

Good news is that as humans, we can tell good sound from bad. If an amp distorts, we can tell it is doing that (at least in gross amounts) without any idea of what we are playing and its relevance to live event. So yes, we do have a reference in our mind but it is not the live presentation as you say.

Amir Post 216 It;s All Preference WBF

That can't be. When you go and shop for a speaker, there is no live band you can AB with. There is nothing you are hearing that has anything to do with the live performance. You are hundreds of edit decisions away. Yes, you can be a good judge of what is good sound potentially but let's not confuse that with knowing what the original performance sounded like to the talent or the audience. We are very far from that.

Amir It's All Prefernce Post #203

 

[amirm]

Post 116

Amir Post 216 It;s All Preference WBF

Amir It's All Prefernce Post #203

Some forums have rules where your post can't just be quotes. We may have to turn that on Greg so that we extract some meaning out of what you are posting Greg . For heaven's sake, say why you are quoting something. Are you agreeing, disagreeing, something else?

 

[Gregadd]

Some forums have rules where your post can't just be quotes. We may have to turn that on Greg so that we extract some meaning out of what you are posting Greg . For heaven's sake, say why you are quoting something. Are you agreeing, disagreeing, something else?

I thought members would be flattered that I was paying attention.