The last turntable and the last CD
- Thread starter Big Dog RJ
- Start date
Exactly right gentlemen who support vinyl!
As I have said many times before:
1. I don't need to be told what to say or not what to say, that is my opinion, unless it was my wifey ranting over something, as she is the boss so I'd have to listen to her.
2. I still do indeed love my digital source, and certainly get a great deal of satisfaction listening to it. It's just that I have far too many so called "high quality" cd's that are not upto par.
3. This is not North Korea, or is it?
There was a member on this forum who clearly stated that it is losing people of good character. Referring to that whenever someone states something based on their findings, there are a few out there who want to put on their boxing gloves straight away and start a bout... Frankly I don't fancy these types of members, as we have enough craziness going on in this world. We really don't need another bout... Just last week a very young girl (age 17 still in high school), was stalked and killed in a neighborhood park about 4 suburbs away from where I live. It saddens me to the core... I think of my own daughter who is just 13...
Rediscovering vinyl on a good TT is something that has made me very happy and also appreciate better digital, and quality cd recordings. I just hated vinyl before, and couldn't even think of ever going back since dumping it 21 years ago. But now I have come full circle, thanks to this forum because I can clearly see that nearly every member here with vast experience has an analogue source somewhere in the chain. That is good to know and something that I learnt.
So a very big thanks to Al for helping me to discover the "good quality" recordings on cd, which I have but never knew that existed until I played it! Also a big thanks to all those vinly lovers, I now understand what a good TT delivers and the emotions/musicality you get out of it that is endless pleasure.
And of course no thanks to North Koreans!
Cheers, RJ
As I have said many times before:
1. I don't need to be told what to say or not what to say, that is my opinion, unless it was my wifey ranting over something, as she is the boss so I'd have to listen to her.
2. I still do indeed love my digital source, and certainly get a great deal of satisfaction listening to it. It's just that I have far too many so called "high quality" cd's that are not upto par.
3. This is not North Korea, or is it?
There was a member on this forum who clearly stated that it is losing people of good character. Referring to that whenever someone states something based on their findings, there are a few out there who want to put on their boxing gloves straight away and start a bout... Frankly I don't fancy these types of members, as we have enough craziness going on in this world. We really don't need another bout... Just last week a very young girl (age 17 still in high school), was stalked and killed in a neighborhood park about 4 suburbs away from where I live. It saddens me to the core... I think of my own daughter who is just 13...
Rediscovering vinyl on a good TT is something that has made me very happy and also appreciate better digital, and quality cd recordings. I just hated vinyl before, and couldn't even think of ever going back since dumping it 21 years ago. But now I have come full circle, thanks to this forum because I can clearly see that nearly every member here with vast experience has an analogue source somewhere in the chain. That is good to know and something that I learnt.
So a very big thanks to Al for helping me to discover the "good quality" recordings on cd, which I have but never knew that existed until I played it! Also a big thanks to all those vinly lovers, I now understand what a good TT delivers and the emotions/musicality you get out of it that is endless pleasure.
And of course no thanks to North Koreans!
Cheers, RJ
You're welcome RJ! I am glad we had a fruitful discussion.
I am also happy for your new found fondness of the analog medium. I was never quite sure what the audiophile fuzz was about until I heard the resolution of analog on two top turntables on the very best recordings/pressings. On average I still prefer my Redbook CD playback, but that is a personal preference. And given the fact that most of the music/performances I listen to are available in that format only, I am beyond thrilled to hear a resolution and effortless musicality from this medium that I had not thought possible until quite recently. And it's not just me. Many times the alleged upper limits of Redbook CD resolution have been declared by the audiophile community, and time and again, if you can believe the reviews and testimonials over the years, the medium has surprised the naysayers with the extraction of ever higher resolution and musicality from it. As far as the problems with lousy digital mastering are concerned, I am much less touched by them since the music that I most prefer to listen to (classical, classical avantgarde, jazz) is mostly well or quite well mastered, unlike rock/pop. And mediocre mastering is found in the analog domain also, and has existed well before the days of loudness wars etc.
First of all, congratulations on rediscovering vinyl. On your response above, the post you are referring to was [thankfully] edited, and having read the unabridged version, I found it vile at best. So suggest you ignore it and move on.
On a more positive note, I just had lunch at the only restaurant I have ever been to featuring high end audio, and your beloved Macintosh at that - Chelsea's Kitchen in Phoenix AZ but can't attach a picture from the iPhone... Will try again
I actually thought you were open minded but it appears that I was unfortunately mistaken.
To say that people who receive immense pleasure from their CD's are robots and have metal parts in their auditory systems is, with all due respect, truly insulting, ignorant, pretentious, judgmental, and elitist.
I gladly call myself a robot but haven't had the auditory metal implants yet. That's scheduled for next month.
Question for you RJ and other analogue religious believers. Why do people that prefer analogue adopt this holier than thou, I know the truth attitude?
I just don't get IT. eek:
Best.
I actually thought you were open minded but it appears that I was unfortunately mistaken.
To say that people who receive immense pleasure from their CD's are robots and have metal parts in their auditory systems is, with all due respect, truly insulting, ignorant, pretentious, judgmental, and elitist.
I gladly call myself a robot but haven't had the auditory metal implants yet. That's scheduled for next month.
Question for you RJ and other analogue religious believers. Why do people that prefer analogue adopt this holier than thou, I know the truth attitude?
I just don't get IT. eek:
Best.
I listen to digital and enjoy it. It sounds really good but it really doesn't compare with my analog set up. The differences are very obvious and it's hard to go back to CDs. I'm probably 90/10 vinyl to cd. In all fairness, I have a lot more money invested in vinyl playback as well. In the end it doesn't matter what other people think or say, only matters what you prefer.
Same here, though I don't even have my CDP hooked up anymore. I used it only for component break in now. As they say, "To each, his (their) own."
Funny, Frank and I have very similar analog front ends.
Thanks for that, I have moved on! Just as I was and then someone quotes something I said, and starts the argument again. I posted this thread not to ARGUE! Just please everyone move on and enjoy your music dam it!
Sorry if I have offended any digital lovers, that was not my intention. Yes I agree sometimes I say things that are out of context, hereafter I will make it a point to be more mindful, ok?
Remember, this forum is about the music and we can certainly learn from this website. I have certainly learned a lot from Al and Johnny, loyd and a host of others like Bonzo, so I intend to keep it that way and not end up in a fluf!
Cheers to all, RJ,
Sorry if I have offended any digital lovers, that was not my intention. Yes I agree sometimes I say things that are out of context, hereafter I will make it a point to be more mindful, ok?
Remember, this forum is about the music and we can certainly learn from this website. I have certainly learned a lot from Al and Johnny, loyd and a host of others like Bonzo, so I intend to keep it that way and not end up in a fluf!
Cheers to all, RJ,
Nah, I thought at the time that it was just a careless comment understandable from over-enthusiasm for analog. I couldn't really get upset by it. As RJ says, and has shown by his comments about a few great CDs that he discovered, he has moved on.
Yet when it comes to the facts, there is nothing digital in the output of a DAC. There are no steps, just analog waveforms. This can easily be demonstrated by connecting an oscilloscope to the DAC's output.
Yes, and as I have heard in your system, with the best LPs it sounds absolutely fantastic.
Hello gentlemen and good evening to you all.
When a member of this forum speaks highly of a rediscovered medium and shares his observations with us all, this is good. It's good when someone speaks of any medium that the end result is pleasure and shares his/her pleasures. What isn't pleasant is bickering. Let's all please take a step back and relax, perhaps listen to a bit of music on your own favorite medium and share with the rest of the forum what your own personal observations are.
In the meantime, if you do not have anything but argument toward this particular discussion, please bow out of it or start your own thread on what you would like to discuss. Above all, please remember that the TOS (http://www.whatsbestforum.com/showthread.php?1207-Terms-Of-Service) states that cordial discussion is a key requisite to remaining on this forum. Our goal is to have a friendly place where everyone shares ideas and information without the level of bickering and angst that other forums tend to create.
Please, let's lighten the tone of some of the posts.
Tom
When a member of this forum speaks highly of a rediscovered medium and shares his observations with us all, this is good. It's good when someone speaks of any medium that the end result is pleasure and shares his/her pleasures. What isn't pleasant is bickering. Let's all please take a step back and relax, perhaps listen to a bit of music on your own favorite medium and share with the rest of the forum what your own personal observations are.
In the meantime, if you do not have anything but argument toward this particular discussion, please bow out of it or start your own thread on what you would like to discuss. Above all, please remember that the TOS (http://www.whatsbestforum.com/showthread.php?1207-Terms-Of-Service) states that cordial discussion is a key requisite to remaining on this forum. Our goal is to have a friendly place where everyone shares ideas and information without the level of bickering and angst that other forums tend to create.
Please, let's lighten the tone of some of the posts.
Tom
Oh please Tom.
I was not the one making "absolutist" statements. I didn't start the bickering.
People should take responsibility for what they say.
Do you agree with the above or not?
I was merely quoting from a previous post.
Is this what this forum is becoming?
Politically correct to ad nauseum.
Is that light enough for your tastes?
And yes, please delete this post so you can return to your pretty, fabricated, artificial Pleasantville world.
I was not the one making "absolutist" statements. I didn't start the bickering.
People should take responsibility for what they say.
Do you agree with the above or not?
I was merely quoting from a previous post.
Is this what this forum is becoming?
Politically correct to ad nauseum.
Is that light enough for your tastes?
And yes, please delete this post so you can return to your pretty, fabricated, artificial Pleasantville world.
To be fair, Tom didn't say in his post who started the bickering.
Yet instead of starting counter insults, I tried to counter the questionable statements of the original poster with facts and arguments, even though I used strong language where I deemed it necessary, such as "nonsense".
It turned out to be a fruitful discussion, resulting in the original poster revisting the CD issue.
I have tried to be fair in every respect, and have pointed out multiple times on this thread that I think that analog at its very best is still superior to digital. I believe this to be true, even though on average I personally prefer digital (quite apart from the fact that most of the music/performances I listen to is not available in analog anyway). I respect it when other people have different personal preferences.
With this question I can agree. I also don't think that analog and digital fans should be judged by the moderators with different standards when it comes to their argumentative behavior, and I sincerely hope they are not.
Oh! Dear me, now see what I've gone and done. I do take full responsibility for my words, thoughts, comments, quotes etc. And anything thar offended anyone, I am truly sorry for my comments, I didn't mean to upset anyone. Although I stand at 6'3 &120Kg, I wouldn't hurt a fly... ask my wife she'll tell you. Unless I was playing rugby. ..
Just as Al stated, I was truly over enthusiastic about this crazy lp thing... I'm sometimes like a kid in a candy store when it comes to music. I kid you not! Once on a flight to Hong Kong, I delayed the whole flight because I went chasing after sacd's.
When I finally boarded the flight, everyone just starred at me wondering what this idiot was upto. If only they knew that I was at the music store buying cd's...
I have done some pretty crazy things for my audio madness, just ask the wife and she'll tell you about it. On many occasions I wonder how lucky I truly am to have someone like her who tolerates all my nonsense!
I really didn't intend for this thread to go off the rails, once again I apologize if I have caused any harm.
Thanks to all who supported and I have learnt a hec of a lot from all. Keep smiling and please enjoy your music. Life is very short indeed, you must live and love life!
Cheers, RJ
Just as Al stated, I was truly over enthusiastic about this crazy lp thing... I'm sometimes like a kid in a candy store when it comes to music. I kid you not! Once on a flight to Hong Kong, I delayed the whole flight because I went chasing after sacd's.
When I finally boarded the flight, everyone just starred at me wondering what this idiot was upto. If only they knew that I was at the music store buying cd's...
I have done some pretty crazy things for my audio madness, just ask the wife and she'll tell you about it. On many occasions I wonder how lucky I truly am to have someone like her who tolerates all my nonsense!
I really didn't intend for this thread to go off the rails, once again I apologize if I have caused any harm.
Thanks to all who supported and I have learnt a hec of a lot from all. Keep smiling and please enjoy your music. Life is very short indeed, you must live and love life!
Cheers, RJ
Last edited:
Don't worry, RJ, it all turned out well, and I enjoyed the opportunity to express my thoughts about analog vs. digital. It's all good, mate!
RJ, I do not think you have done anything wrong to be sorry or apologize. You just shared your love of listening to music via specific medium, vinyl in this case. If you personally think/feel analog is better, that is fine, it is your taste, your system, your music. It almost happens all the time when someone shares his personal views saying analog is better or digital is better, then comes trouble. I got used to it. Long live vinyl!
Hey Thanks for that gentlemen, much appreciated. I am glad to know that all is well.
Just a small question to Al and other digital users;
I have come across 2 other CD's which I had not played on my Mac gear, and it is just standard CD format and sounds way better than some of the SACD's I have. They are from Liz Wright, albums Salt and Orchard. They sound fantastic! Now my question is, how would I know that these are good recordings before I get home? The store demos are awful...
I remember when I was using the other CD players, such as Cayin, Arc & Cary which had tubes in them, didn't sound that "lively" compared to the MCD series sacd players. So then when I finally bought the Mac SACD player, I went nuts about SACD and went off buying far too many SACD's not knowing that I had some very good recordings on standard CD.
I can tell by the label such as Blue Note, Verve etc, but there are some that are SACD and not that good compared to standard CD. Is there any way of knowing the quality before I purchase? Any tips or hints would be helpful.
Much appreciated, cheers, RJ
Just a small question to Al and other digital users;
I have come across 2 other CD's which I had not played on my Mac gear, and it is just standard CD format and sounds way better than some of the SACD's I have. They are from Liz Wright, albums Salt and Orchard. They sound fantastic! Now my question is, how would I know that these are good recordings before I get home? The store demos are awful...
I remember when I was using the other CD players, such as Cayin, Arc & Cary which had tubes in them, didn't sound that "lively" compared to the MCD series sacd players. So then when I finally bought the Mac SACD player, I went nuts about SACD and went off buying far too many SACD's not knowing that I had some very good recordings on standard CD.
I can tell by the label such as Blue Note, Verve etc, but there are some that are SACD and not that good compared to standard CD. Is there any way of knowing the quality before I purchase? Any tips or hints would be helpful.
Much appreciated, cheers, RJ
RJ,
Thank you. A request.
In the future, please be careful how you characterize people when making generalizations about your audio preferences.
And Tom, thank you for allowing this conversation to move forward.
Respectfully.
RJ, here are my thoughts on the very valid points you raise.
A SACD reissue doesn't necessarily imply it will sound better than RB. All depends on how the RB and SA's were recorded, mastered, etc. Look at the reviews of some hi rez computer downloads. Same issue.
How do you know before bringing it home? Absent reading a credible review comparing the quality of SA v RB , you don't. Same anomaly exists in ALL formats.
I will say that in general and from my personal experience, SA's may initially sound less dynamic, spacious, and "alive" (too smooth) when compared to their RB counterparts. However, I find on repeated comparisons, they are (more often than not) more refined and, dare I say, more analogue and organic (easier on the ears) from a sonic perspective.
Regarding "reliable / quality" SA's, Pentatone and Channel Classics have always sounded exceptional in my system. Same goes for the Mercury Living Presence series.
Have any SACD's you might want to sell? I may be interested. I mainly listen to jazz and classical.
Best.
Thanks for your message mate, much appreciated.
Yes, there are quite a few SACD's that I do have from Chesky, Supreme Jazz, Opus and Telarc. Mostly jazz and blues such as Ella, Duke Ellington, Errol Garner to Eric Bibb. However, I have not come across the same LP versions, rather something quite different and very expensive. Some of these audiophile vinyl pressings on 180g or 200g go for around $100 each Lp!
It's probably cheaper in the US, I don't know but over here in Australia they are classified as "imports" and the cheapest ones go for around $80 on 180g per Lp.
Therefore, unless I find a similar version of what I'm after, would I be able to sell off a few. The few 100 or so that I got rid of at cash Converters were just normal Cd's that were very old and bought during the early 90's.
I'll keep an eye out and definitely let you know mate.
Cheers, RJ
Yes, there are quite a few SACD's that I do have from Chesky, Supreme Jazz, Opus and Telarc. Mostly jazz and blues such as Ella, Duke Ellington, Errol Garner to Eric Bibb. However, I have not come across the same LP versions, rather something quite different and very expensive. Some of these audiophile vinyl pressings on 180g or 200g go for around $100 each Lp!
It's probably cheaper in the US, I don't know but over here in Australia they are classified as "imports" and the cheapest ones go for around $80 on 180g per Lp.
Therefore, unless I find a similar version of what I'm after, would I be able to sell off a few. The few 100 or so that I got rid of at cash Converters were just normal Cd's that were very old and bought during the early 90's.
I'll keep an eye out and definitely let you know mate.
Cheers, RJ
Similar threads
