Todd's AG Trio G3 System -- it's about time

[LL21]

your analysis is right. This was a later recorded version. 1 has a very low cost analog source compared to the other two, and back then was with 4 watts. Now he has a 10 watt amp

Thanks. Always interesting to compare even if headphones and videos, rather than in person.

 

[Maril555]

Compare and contrast:

Carlo’s, your version sounds very good
And so is Leif’s

 

[sbnx]

I like this recording. Quiet. Well balanced. Yo-Yo-Ma

listen with headphones

 

[Carlos269]

Carlo’s, your version sounds very good
And so is Leif’s

Thank You. It is very interesting to hear how different these systems sound, with the same recording. One of the objectives when I set out to design, assemble and implement my vision of the ultimate horn based system was to overcome the limitations typically associated with multi-way horn systems. As I have entered a phase of comparative analysis it brings attention to areas where the planning and execution has succeeded in addressing those sonic elements.

 

[Maril555]

Compare and contrast:

Carlo’s, your version sounds very good
And so is Leif’, but different presentations for sure

 

[Carlos269]

Carlo’s, your version sounds very good
And so is Leif’, but different presentations for sure

Agree.

 

[Lagonda]

Hi Sbnx,

I am fascinated by how audiophiles make decisions in this subjective hobby of ours. Yeah, she's got some weird ass, new esoteric turntable with a digital clock... I wonder if they sell more than 10 - 15 of these in NA... yet check out around 6:30 minute mark:

. They make it clear that there is "better synergy"... for her at least...

On another note, the Trio is virtually a new design. And with little information and no measurements out there and a large price tag, being science and engineering minded, how were you convinced that the new Trio is well engineered?

Sell,sell,sell, $50 K $, 100 K, 250 K ! This hobby of ours has truly gotten ridiculous ! Sometimes i am ashamed to fall for all the B S !

 

[Uwiik]

Hi all, I am back!! Sorry for disappearing for such a long time, deepest apology to @christoph for ignoring his PM for DAC due to my recent problem, I ran into some massive problems on my investment in Dubai and got a massive headache from it, all good now.

I got the chance to attend Indonesian high end audio show last month and the manager of AG was there. Even he agreed that Ongaku and G3 is better than iTron, the dang dealer demoed the setup with Kondo G1000 pre amp and off course I was astonished and I must must must must dig deeper into my bank account to sell my G70 and buy the G1000, never thought an audio could sound that good, G1000 is truly amazing. The Kondo and G3 based setup even beat a system in the next room that cost more than double (hint…CH Precision based system with speaker that costs 3 times the G3)….

There is delay on the construction of my new audio room in my new house, so everything will be hopefully done by April 2024, crossing fingers.

All in all, with all due respect, I don’t think iTron is the endgame amp for G3, I think Ongaku is. We tried pairing the G3 with FM Acoustic and to my ear the Ongaku+G1000 still beats the FM by a million miles.

Pictures for teasers!!! Enjoy!!!

 

[christoph]

Hi all, I am back!! Sorry for disappearing for such a long time, deepest apology to @christoph for ignoring his PM for DAC due to my recent problem, I ran into some massive problems on my investment in Dubai and got a massive headache from it, all good now.

I got the chance to attend Indonesian high end audio show last month and the manager of AG was there. Even he agreed that Ongaku and G3 is better than iTron, the dang dealer demoed the setup with Kondo G1000 pre amp and off course I was astonished and I must must must must dig deeper into my bank account to sell my G70 and buy the G1000, never thought an audio could sound that good, G1000 is truly amazing. The Kondo and G3 based setup even beat a system in the next room that cost more than double (hint…CH Precision based system with speaker that costs 3 times the G3)….

There is delay on the construction of my new audio room in my new house, so everything will be hopefully done by April 2024, crossing fingers.

All in all, with all due respect, I don’t think iTron is the endgame amp for G3, I think Ongaku is. We tried pairing the G3 with FM Acoustic and to my ear the Ongaku+G1000 still beats the FM by a million miles.

Pictures for teasers!!! Enjoy!!!
View attachment 122288 View attachment 122289 View attachment 122290 View attachment 122291 View attachment 122292 View attachment 122293

No need for an apology at all

Glad all is good again and please say hello to Lukasz

 

[Uwiik]

No need for an apology at all

Glad all is good again and please say hello to Lukasz

I did…I overheard when he was talking about you to another person and that was the reason I recognized him ….My dealer will do the deal for Horizon DAC on my behalf, can’t wait!!

 

[LL21]

Hi all, I am back!! Sorry for disappearing for such a long time, deepest apology to @christoph for ignoring his PM for DAC due to my recent problem, I ran into some massive problems on my investment in Dubai and got a massive headache from it, all good now.

I got the chance to attend Indonesian high end audio show last month and the manager of AG was there. Even he agreed that Ongaku and G3 is better than iTron, the dang dealer demoed the setup with Kondo G1000 pre amp and off course I was astonished and I must must must must dig deeper into my bank account to sell my G70 and buy the G1000, never thought an audio could sound that good, G1000 is truly amazing. The Kondo and G3 based setup even beat a system in the next room that cost more than double (hint…CH Precision based system with speaker that costs 3 times the G3)….

There is delay on the construction of my new audio room in my new house, so everything will be hopefully done by April 2024, crossing fingers.

All in all, with all due respect, I don’t think iTron is the endgame amp for G3, I think Ongaku is. We tried pairing the G3 with FM Acoustic and to my ear the Ongaku+G1000 still beats the FM by a million miles.

Pictures for teasers!!! Enjoy!!!
View attachment 122288 View attachment 122289 View attachment 122290 View attachment 122291 View attachment 122292 View attachment 122293

Great stuff and welcome back! Good to hear all is well again. Looking forward to reading more about your adventures with AG G3 and most interesting to hear about your strong preference for Ongaku over iTron and even FM and CH. I could imagine agreeing with you If I had been able to hear the Ongaku/G1000 vs the Emm Labs MTRX Ref Monos which were being played with the G3 when I heard it.

 

[christoph]

I did…I overheard when he was talking about you to another person and that was the reason I recognized him ….My dealer will do the deal for Horizon DAC on my behalf, can’t wait!!

Big congrats

 

[Uwiik]

Great stuff and welcome back! Good to hear all is well again. Looking forward to reading more about your adventures with AG G3 and most interesting to hear about your strong preference for Ongaku over iTron and even FM and CH. I could imagine agreeing with you If I had been able to hear the Ongaku/G1000 vs the Emm Labs MTRX Ref Monos which were being played with the G3 when I heard it.

Even AG’a own guy admitted that Ongaku sounded better than iTron… that’s quite something

 

[Kozak170]

I must must must must dig deeper into my bank account to sell my G70 and buy the G1000!!

For the passive mode with G3, Before digging your bank account and buing Kondo G1000, I suggest you to test the Japanese Bakoon Products. They are much cheaper than Kondo and with that unique SATRi circuit developed by Nagai-san over 30 years, they can be considered the best solid state option for horns.The Bakoon amps sound more like a really good SET but with so much better speed and better bottom end. My friend who has trio g2 compared 20w Bakoon amps (7511mk4 x2 + 7610 pre) to kondo Neiro and Ongaku and preferred Bakoon by a wide margin. Also, in this forum, those who had Bakoon experience with AGs, preferred Bakoon to their very good SETs.

 

[Hear Here]

For the passive mode with G3, Before digging your bank account and buing Kondo G1000, I suggest you to test the Japanese Bakoon Products. They are much cheaper than Kondo and with that unique SATRi circuit developed by Nagai-san over 30 years, they can be considered the best solid state option for horns.The Bakoon amps sound more like a really good SET but with so much better speed and better bottom end. My friend who has trio g2 compared 20w Bakoon amps (7511mk4 x2 + 7610 pre) to kondo Neiro and Ongaku and preferred Bakoon by a wide margin. Also, in this forum, those who had Bakoon experience with AGs, preferred Bakoon to their very good SETs.

3 years ago I decided to move away from SETs to power my AG horns and bought or borrowed a dozen amps to try at home to see which suited my speakers / room the best.

Included was a Bakoon amp because other AG owners (or at least one other owner) had raved about this amp on a forum. I found it sounded very good, but certainly not the top contender and also it got ridiculously hot in use. It was probably adding to my electricity bill far more than my 845 mono SETs! Although I was not expecting this, I chose a Class D Purifi Eigentakt-based amp, although the GamuT D200 may have beaten it if it wasn't for an unacceptable thump on powering up and down. Both were rather surprising top dogs in my test as I was expecting maybe a Class A amp (I tried Accuphase and Sugden) would be my first choice.

 

[LL21]

Even AG’a own guy admitted that Ongaku sounded better than iTron… that’s quite something

Very interesting!

 

[Kozak170]

3 years ago I decided to move away from SETs to power my AG horns and bought or borrowed a dozen amps to try at home to see which suited my speakers / room the best.

Included was a Bakoon amp because other AG owners (or at least one other owner) had raved about this amp on a forum. I found it sounded very good, but certainly not the top contender and also it got ridiculously hot in use. It was probably adding to my electricity bill far more than my 845 mono SETs! Although I was not expecting this, I chose a Class D Purifi Eigentakt-based amp, although the GamuT D200 may have beaten it if it wasn't for an unacceptable thump on powering up and down. Both were rather surprising top dogs in my test as I was expecting maybe a Class A amp (I tried Accuphase and Sugden) would be my first choice.

I think you have experienced Korean Bakoon, they are good, but not as good as Japanese Bakoon, and of course they have some differences, for example, Japanese bakoon uses R-core transformer in the power supply, but the korean type uses toroidal one.

 

[Ron Resnick]

Even AG’a own guy admitted that Ongaku sounded better than iTron… that’s quite something

(That would be my personal preference as well.)

But this report is very puzzling as AG has moved decidedly away from tubes.

To whom at AG are you referring?

 

[the sound of Tao]

(That would be my personal preference as well.)

But this report is very puzzling as AG has moved decidedly away from tubes.

To whom at AG are you referring?

Ron I think he might be the ex head of marketing at AG… with a fairly recent redeployment to the mailroom and packing and dispatch.

 

[Mike Lavigne]

But this report is very puzzling as AG has moved decidedly away from tubes.

there is no conflict. you are not looking at the whole picture. if you look closely at what AG is actually doing, they are appealing to two separate markets.

(1) traditional audiophile--- a choice of the internal I-tron direct current amps, with or without a separate preamp, or a passive crossover and choose your amps. could be anything. and you can seamlessly switch from the I-tron to your passive amplification choice. if you have both. the I-tron is relatively modest in price compared to most tube amps being considered. so owning both is not prohibitive.

(2) other than traditional audiophile----they have the direct current I-tron on board amplification and also a complete built in streamer module including volume control you can do from your phone. both the I-tron and streamer are resident inside the speaker chassis. and this is with the Spacehorns with active internal amplification. so the customer who wants the ultimate lifestyle product with super simple seamless operation can get satisfied. like the big Goldmund active speakers with resident digital sources and volume control. big bucks. analogous to the Steinway player piano product. same customer.

my guess is that the decision to invest in all this new tech for the G3 was based on that expanded business case of those additional sales from that 'other' market and what it would take to compete in it.

with the super slick look of the all in one chassis G3 AG it can be a terrific architectural piece for an interior designer. that is a significant market. where tube amps are not part of the picture.

the I-tron is certainly a totally legit musical choice. but it's not everyone's cup of tea. I was intrigued by what I heard from the I-tron at Axpona 2022. but most audiophiles are not ready for that and most of those traditional horn lovers prefer tubes.