What is the benefit of very expensive DACs?

[mep]

I totally disagree with this... IMO... the Bricasti, Grace and Weiss do not belong in A+
The Benchmark, Halide and M2Tech do not belong in "A" either.

I would put each in the next lower category. The QA-9 is an "A" at best.

At least my Mytech made it into Class A. I think it sounds fantastic.

 

[Andre Marc]

I totally disagree with this... IMO... the Bricasti, Grace and Weiss do not belong in A+
The Benchmark, Halide and M2Tech do not belong in "A" either.

I would put each in the next lower category.

Agree about the Benchmark.

I think the Weiss is excellent. John Marks, John Atkinson, Michael Lavorgna, and several other
knowleagable writers feel the Bricasti is superb.

Just goes to show....

 

[Bruce B]

Agree about the Benchmark.

I think the Weiss is excellent. John Marks, John Atkinson, Michael Lavorgna, and several other
knowleagable writers feel the Bricasti is superb.

Just goes to show....

Yeah... I didn't like the Bricasti at all. I'd put in in the same level as the Berkeley... a solid "Class A".

 

[Andre Marc]

Yeah... I didn't like the Bricasti at all. I'd put in in the same level as the Berkeley... a solid "Class A".

Sphile gave the Bricasti a lot of ink. I only heard it briefly.

The Sphile ratings are not even on my radar. I can't make through 30 minutes with the MyTek.

 

[microstrip]

Guess, what..I have NO problem with introducing blind testing into the audiophile hobby. I wonder how many
companies would still be in business.

Andre,
But will you introduce it systematically in your reviews? Are you prepared to accept that all your previous reviewing work that was done sighted is not valid?

 

[mep]

Sphile gave the Bricasti a lot of ink. I only heard it briefly.

The Sphile ratings are not even on my radar. I can't make through 30 minutes with the MyTek.

How much time did you spend listening to DSD files through the balanced outputs? I can't spend 30 minutes straight listening to PCM regardless of type.

 

[Andre Marc]

I know your questions is a bit of a joke, but here is my answer.

First, blind testing is not a solitary endeavor. Kinda does not work.

Secondly, I believe blind testing is only ONE tool that can be used, but not the end all or be all.

I stand by everything I have ever written, btw.

 

[NorthStar]

The October 2013 issue of Stereophile has their recommended components. Here their recommended DACs/Ratings/MSRPs:

A+ Grace Design M903 ($1995) & NAD M51 ($1999).

Those two are worthy of further exploration. ...Anyone here?

Grace Design M903 ::

* http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/oct12/articles/grace-m903.htm
* http://www.stereophile.com/content/fifth-element-69

NAD M51 ::

* http://www.hi-fiworld.co.uk/index.php/cd-dvd-blu-ray/62-cd-reviews/504-nad-m51-dac.html
* http://www.stereophile.com/content/nad-m51-direct-digital-da-converter

 

[Bruce B]

Those two are worthy of further exploration. ...Anyone here?

I had the Grace 903 and 906 in here for a few months. The m906 was in here about a year.

I know first hand the 903 is not worthy of an "A+" rating.
Have never heard the NAD in my room, so I can not comment.

 

[microstrip]

I know your questions is a bit of a joke, but here is my answer.

First, blind testing is not a solitary endeavor. Kinda does not work.

Secondly, I believe blind testing is only ONE tool that can be used, but not the end all or be all.

I stand by everything I have ever written, btw.

Yes, it was a joke, but the main problem I see is that when you refer that you accept blind testing in high-end, where the differences are instrumentally small, you are implicitly discarding all the tools that are not that ONE. There is no half blind test technique.

 

[NorthStar]

I had the Grace 903 and 906 in here for a few months. The m906 was in here about a year.

I know first hand the 903 is not worthy of an "A+" rating.
Have never heard the NAD in my room, so I can not comment.

Then Stereophile (John Marks) made a mistake?

 

[Bruce B]

Then Stereophile (John Marks) made a mistake?

No mistake... that's just HIS preference.

I'm just telling you where "I" would rank it if I were to write the Recommended Components.

 

[asiufy]

Your response is quite vague and puzzling I can tell you that nobody purchasing the NA-11S1 would use an external DAC. There are dozens of
streamers to choose from that have far less features and less expensive that would be better suited if one was going to use an external DAC.

Secondly, calling the SA-11S3 "dull" is just a head scratcher to me. But certainly you are more than entitled to your opinion.

What's a streamer in the $3000 range then? With AES, SPDIF and/or BNC out?


alexandre

 

[asiufy]

No argument here. The difference in various topologies does not explain the prices of certain DACS, which seem to be arbitrary.

Indeed, prices for hi end gear these days is almost entirely arbitrary, not only DACs...


alexandre

 

[asiufy]

I own both an msb signature and an NAD m51 (for my surround channels) both a+. Just for kicks I could do a shootout and see how they compare.

I don't think the items on a given category are supposed to be "comparable". I mean, they're supposed to be the best (or good for that category), FOR THEIR PRICE RANGE.

So, for around $10k, it's the Bricasti and Debussy, etc.


alexandre

 

[mep]

I don't think the items on a given category are supposed to be "comparable". I mean, they're supposed to be the best (or good for that category), FOR THEIR PRICE RANGE.

So, for around $10k, it's the Bricasti and Debussy, etc.


alexandre

I don't think so. Class A rankings are given according to the sound and not the price I do believe.

 

[asiufy]

You're right, I looked up on last year's guide, and they mention a "$$$" sign next to a component they found to be particularly good value for money. That was the only place where the component's price was alluded in the guide.


alexandre

 

[MylesBAstor]

I don't think the items on a given category are supposed to be "comparable". I mean, they're supposed to be the best (or good for that category), FOR THEIR PRICE RANGE.

So, for around $10k, it's the Bricasti and Debussy, etc.


alexandre

The real problem with any and all of these "rating schemes" is that they're an arbitrary compendium from a group of reviewers. Are all the reviewers equal? That kinda makes it meaningless. It's another story say if John had listened to all of the DACs in his system and rated them.

 

[Andre Marc]

What's a streamer in the $3000 range then? With AES, SPDIF and/or BNC out?


alexandre

Bryston BDP-1/BDP-2, Olive 04HD, Oppo 105, Musical Fidelity M1 CLIC, SIM Mind, Pro-Ject Stream box, and several dozen more from Pioneer, Denon, NAD,
etc etc.

 

[NorthStar]

Halide Design DAC HD: $495 $$$ Class A (Stereophile)

* http://www.audiostream.com/content/halide-design-dac-hd
* http://www.stereophile.com/content/halide-design-dac-hd-da-converter
* http://www.computeraudiophile.com/content/438-halide-design-dac-hd-review/
* http://www.theaudiobeat.com/equipment/halide_design_dac_hd.htm
* http://www.ultrahighendreview.com/halide-design-dac-hd-usb-dac/
* http://www.soundbsessive.com/room/?p=133

** http://www.enjoythemusic.com/magazine/equipment/0412/usb_dac_shootout.htm