Play nice guys. You are already off topic, no need to get nasty with each other too. I'll leave the posts in for now but will clean up if the behavior persists. Thank you.
World Debut: Vertere Reference Tonearm
- Thread starter garylkoh
- Start date
Interesting Garry , my micro Seiki bettered my Lp12 back then , but it was a lot more table , never heard the Linn described as confused before ...
Still enjoy it today ....
Never heard a Rega better an LP-12 , tables are hard to compare unless you actually have it in your system and go thru the setup ritual for proper system setup ..
The same table in different systems will sound different ....
I had a Rega 3 outfitted with a JVC 7045 arm and either Grace F9E or AQ404 cartridge and it was no match for the LP12 which in turn was no match for the VPI.
Yep-exactly. I have a bunch of old gear from yesteryear and I post everything in my system for all to see on this forum. Both my Krell KBL and KSA-250 have been back to the Krell factory to be repaired and have the caps replaced and brought back up to spec and I have previously detailed all of that. I also have some current production items in my system like my SME 312s arm, Dynavector XV-1s cartridge, and the Mytek Stereo 192 DAC.
Interesting Garry , my micro Seiki bettered my Lp12 back then , but it was a lot more table , never heard the Linn described as confused before ...
Still enjoy it today ....
It was in direct comparison between the two set-ups I mentioned and not a statement on the Linn itself.
Myles, could you expand a little as to how you feel your VPI betters the Linn. I presume you are referring to a VPI classic 3 or 4? I haven't done an AB with my Linn vs. a VPI classic; BUT I did do one a few years ago
against a Scoutmaster, all preferred my Linn and by a wide margin. The problem with most Linn's is that they aren't set up correctly and are sitting on the wrong stand. The LP12 needs an isolation base like the
Townsend to sound its best...Put it on a flimsy table, like Linn used to recommend and the result is a little like Gary was saying....confused sounding.
IMO, the LP12 is still a very good table, BUT bettered by several that allow a superior arm to be mounted. My WTA is about as good as it gets on a Linn and IMO much better than an Ekos....However, compared to some of today's
super arms..well! This is IMO the biggest drawback with the design...one is severely limited as to arms...IME the Naim Aro and the WTA being the best options. Take your Classic VPI and you can mount almost any arm available...
that's a BIG plus, again IMHO.
Time for Linn to re-design their TT and enable the table to be paired with the likes of a Graham or Triplaner and it could regain its dominance again. Let's see, its 2013...therefore a Linn LP13
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Myles, could you expand a little as to how you feel your VPI betters the Linn. I presume you are referring to a VPI classic 3 or 4? I haven't done an AB with my Linn vs. a VPI classic; BUT I did do one a few years ago
against a Scoutmaster, all preferred my Linn and by a wide margin. The problem with most Linn's is that they aren't set up correctly and are sitting on the wrong stand. The LP12 needs an isolation base like the
Townsend to sound its best...Put it on a flimsy table, like Linn used to recommend and the result is a little like Gary was saying....confused sounding.
IMO, the LP12 is still a very good table, BUT bettered by several that allow a superior arm to be mounted. My WTA is about as good as it gets on a Linn and IMO much better than an Ekos....However, compared to some of today's
super arms..well! This is IMO the biggest drawback with the design...one is severely limited as to arms...IME the Naim Aro and the WTA being the best options. Take your Classic VPI and you can mount almost arm available...
that's a BIG plus, again IMHO.
Time for Linn to re-design their TT and enable the table to be paired with the likes of a Graham or Triplaner and it could regain its dominance again. Let's see, its 2013...therefore a Linn LP13
No I'm talking VPI HW-19.
The Linn was on a SO table. Nothing flimsy 'bout that.
Townshend NG. Made of steel. Old ones really screwed up the sound, esp. with amplifiers. Reviewed the Townshend many years ago.
'Twasn't the set up since my Linn was done by one of the best guys in the country at Innovative Audio.
How can the NAIM arm even be mentioned in the same breath as any of the other arms when you can't adjust for overhang?
Gary's right.
Myles, the SO table was recommended by Linn for years. I used one for years and only when I ditched it and went with the Seismic Sink did the Linn begin to sing. Sorry, but you never really heard what a Linn can do IF you only heard it on a SO. Not sure I agree entirely about the Naim arm, it is IME the best arm for the Linn....NOT saying it's a great arm, just the best for the Linn, along with my WTA. Agree, that there are MUCH better arms out there nowadays.
Obviously you didn't hear the issues with the Townshend.
I don't care what stand, and yes friends did, the Linn finished a poor second to the VPI. Oh and the VPI didn't only work on one ultra special base. And with the VPI, you could walk in the room without the arm jumping.
I can not understand how we want to debate VPI or Linn sound quality without referring to the precise models, systems and time you are addressing.
And in order to have a fair debate we must consider that the turntable were adequately supported, as expected by the manufacturers. If the arm would jump when you walked feedback levels would be terrible, it is not normal operation. I had several Sondeks and never had such a problem.
And yes, I regret having sold the Naim Aro toneram. I preferred it to the Ittok.
And in order to have a fair debate we must consider that the turntable were adequately supported, as expected by the manufacturers. If the arm would jump when you walked feedback levels would be terrible, it is not normal operation. I had several Sondeks and never had such a problem.
And yes, I regret having sold the Naim Aro toneram. I preferred it to the Ittok.
The Itok was nothing to write home about. Rather on the bright side.
As far as stability, the Linn was noted for its susceptibility to footfalls. Wasn't an isolated incident.
Oh and I experienced tons of issues with the Linn I had (the model escapes me but it was after the Valhalla update) including the Valhalla board and motors dying.
The best day was when I sold it and I've never regretted it or looked back.
Myles, you clearly had problems with your Linn. Unfortunately, it seems equally clear from your comments that it simply wasn't set up correctly. If you could hear footfalls something was VERY wrong.
The Seismic Sink and a good support structure beneath the table is mandatory to get the best from the table. Trust me , you could jump up and down next to mine and you would not perturb the table one bit
IMHO, the old VPI HW-19 isn't in the same league at all as a correctly set-up Linn. I haven't heard the new Classic line, BUT the HW-19, I along with several other a'phile friends used to own and the day we sold that was a good day.Clearly YMMV.
Myles,
It was all clearly said in the page 14 of the Linn Sondek turntable manual in chapter "POSITIONING THE TURNTABLE" . It explains why the conventional positioning rules can not be applied to the Sondek.
My experience considering reliability was different from yours - I owned several Valhalas and Lingo's and never had a failure. Question of luck!
I've owned three LP12s and never had a problem with footfalls (unlike the SOTA Star) and yes, WTA works very well on the Linn. the higest spec i owned was a mid-90s 'table with updated bearing, lingo Mk I and ekos arm. I now have a VPI classic I (30th anniv) with SDS and i would never think of going back to a the LP12 i had before or the current model with the keel, etc. HW's designs have come a long way, i once had a HW19 and in retrospect it was primative by current standards even compared to the LP12.
Isn't it interesting that whenever someone criticizes a Linn table, the stock answer always is its positioning? Obviously you never used like my friends a Linn with a springy floor
Even mounting it on the wall didn't help.Similar threads
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