Japanese SET amp compete with other high end brands

[Lautreamont]

Hi everyone,

I've been delving into the fascinating world of single-ended amplifiers, with the hope of one day owning one. These amps seem like the perfect match for my high-efficiency Audio Note speakers.

During my research, I’ve noticed that many highly regarded amplifier brands come out of Japan: Sun Audio, Yamamoto, Audio Experience, Sakuma (though I realize these are probably near-impossible to obtain), and, of course, Shindo. Shindo amps are particularly challenging to find, especially here in Europe, where regulations regarding the specific lead they use make it even harder.

That brings me to my question, which might sound a bit naive. On one hand, components like Tamura and Tango transformers are celebrated for their exceptional musicality. On the other hand, some Japanese amplifier brands I’m considering, like Yamamoto, Sun Audio, and Audio Experience, are priced more modestly. It seems possible to get one of their amplifiers for under $8,000.

Can these amps compete with higher-priced brands like Lamm Industries or Audio Note? Why are they significantly less expensive? I understand that incorporating silver parts tends to drive costs sky-high, but not all models rely on silver components.

I’d love to hear your thoughts and experiences.

 

[zerostargeneral]

PADA-300B English - オーディオ・音響・PCオーディオ・アナログのAurorasound（オーロラサウンド）

オーディオ・音響・サウンドシステムのAurorasound（オーロラサウンド）/CADA・VIDA・HIFACE・BusPower-Pro

www.aurorasound.jp

Not SET but, well worth investigating.

Bargain price considering the sound and build quality.

Kindest regards, G.

 

[zerostargeneral]

My personal favourite integrated amp.

Kindest regards, G.

 

[Rensselaer]

Lamm Industries make incredible stuff that explains the incredible price. Audio Note UK, in my humble opinion, charges an incredible price to convince folks they make incredible stuff (and some of it most certainly is). I’ve heard upper end Shindo and was blown away. Too bad the materials used inside prevent sales (in the UK anyway). I have never heard Yamamoto but I believe Kedar said they sound good. I bought (unheard) a Kondo Audio Note Ongaku copy, that uses Tango transformers but copper wire, from Ken Uesugi of Otomon Labs (Sound Gate) in Japan. Some distortion heard if volume up too much, but at normal listening levels it is the best-sounding amplifier I ever owned. Cost £5500 shipped, without valves, a darn bit less than a real Ongaku. Just saying.

My System

 

[Synaxis]

Hi everyone,

I've been delving into the fascinating world of single-ended amplifiers, with the hope of one day owning one. These amps seem like the perfect match for my high-efficiency Audio Note speakers.

During my research, I’ve noticed that many highly regarded amplifier brands come out of Japan: Sun Audio, Yamamoto, Audio Experience, Sakuma (though I realize these are probably near-impossible to obtain), and, of course, Shindo. Shindo amps are particularly challenging to find, especially here in Europe, where regulations regarding the specific lead they use make it even harder.

That brings me to my question, which might sound a bit naive. On one hand, components like Tamura and Tango transformers are celebrated for their exceptional musicality. On the other hand, some Japanese amplifier brands I’m considering, like Yamamoto, Sun Audio, and Audio Experience, are priced more modestly. It seems possible to get one of their amplifiers for under $8,000.

Can these amps compete with higher-priced brands like Lamm Industries or Audio Note? Why are they significantly less expensive? I understand that incorporating silver parts tends to drive costs sky-high, but not all models rely on silver components.

I’d love to hear your thoughts and experiences.

Hello!

I personally am a huge fan of Japanese tube brands.

I would say this: don't fall into the trap of assuming lower priced gear can't be equally as good - or better - than more expensive gear.

It always comes down to your system, room, and personal preferences.

 

[No Regrets]

My personal favourite integrated amp.

Kindest regards, G.

I love your J. Sikora Reference turntable. That is the very best sounding table that I've ever had the pleasure of listening to in person! I'm curious how you enjoy it to other tables that you may have/or had?

I realize this video was supposed to be about your personal favorite integrated amp. Can you tell me which integrated amp it is?

Best wishes to you!
Don

 

[bonzo75]

I love your J. Sikora Reference turntable. That is the very best sounding table that I've ever had the pleasure of listening to in person! I'm curious how you enjoy it to other tables that you may have/or had?

I realize this video was supposed to be about your personal favorite integrated amp. Can you tell me which integrated amp it is?

Best wishes to you!
Don

That is not his, this is a system in Vietnam. He plays with the same amp the general has as well as with a Shindo 300b. He has both the Sikora and the 301, he is a dealer for Sikora and some other stuff

 

[djsina2]

I love your J. Sikora Reference turntable. That is the very best sounding table that I've ever had the pleasure of listening to in person! I'm curious how you enjoy it to other tables that you may have/or had?

I realize this video was supposed to be about your personal favorite integrated amp. Can you tell me which integrated amp it is?

Best wishes to you!
Don

HFSA01(english) - オーディオ・音響・PCオーディオ・アナログのAurorasound（オーロラサウンド）

オーディオ・音響・サウンドシステムのAurorasound（オーロラサウンド）/CADA・VIDA・HIFACE・BusPower-Pro

www.aurorasound.jp

 

[No Regrets]

That is not his, this is a system in Vietnam. He plays with the same amp the general has as well as with a Shindo 300b. He has both the Sikora and the 301, he is a dealer for Sikora and some other stuff

Oh, that makes sense.... thank you!
Best wishes to you for a very happy new year!
Don

 

[No Regrets]

https://www.aurorasound.jp/english/hfsaThank01-en

Thank you for the link!
It's no wonder why he likes that integrated as it uses one of my favorite pentode tubes... the EL-84. My custom amp shown below uses german EL-84's; Mullard rectifier, and I switch between mullard and tele's for the12ax7's. The sound is fantastic! Incredible body, harmonic textures, dynamic. No slowness, no mushiness. It's an amazing little amp!





Best wishes to all for a very happy and healthy new year!
Don

 

[Argonaut]

My custom amp shown below uses german EL-84's; Mullard rectifier, and I switch between mullard and tele's for the12ax7's. The sound is fantastic! Incredible body, harmonic textures, dynamic. No slowness, no mushiness. It's an amazing little amp!





Best wishes to all for a very happy and healthy new year!
Don

Very nice Don , that tube recipe should be most excellent on vocals in particular.

 

[No Regrets]

Very nice Don , that tube recipe should be most excellent on vocals in particular.

Thank you! Yes, indeed... very nice on vocals, as well as stringed instruments.... actually anything acoustical.
Best wishes,
Don

 

[LL21]

Hi everyone,

I've been delving into the fascinating world of single-ended amplifiers, with the hope of one day owning one. These amps seem like the perfect match for my high-efficiency Audio Note speakers.

During my research, I’ve noticed that many highly regarded amplifier brands come out of Japan: Sun Audio, Yamamoto, Audio Experience, Sakuma (though I realize these are probably near-impossible to obtain), and, of course, Shindo. Shindo amps are particularly challenging to find, especially here in Europe, where regulations regarding the specific lead they use make it even harder.

That brings me to my question, which might sound a bit naive. On one hand, components like Tamura and Tango transformers are celebrated for their exceptional musicality. On the other hand, some Japanese amplifier brands I’m considering, like Yamamoto, Sun Audio, and Audio Experience, are priced more modestly. It seems possible to get one of their amplifiers for under $8,000.

Can these amps compete with higher-priced brands like Lamm Industries or Audio Note? Why are they significantly less expensive? I understand that incorporating silver parts tends to drive costs sky-high, but not all models rely on silver components.

I’d love to hear your thoughts and experiences.

In my limited experience in Japanese high end SET/Tube (or that philosophy of ultra purists, simple circuitry) which includes owning Zanden, Robert Koda and having auditioned Shindo in our system and heard Kondo (dont know it well)...I will say this about the sound.

While each will reflect its designer's very specific approach, each of the above showed to me a completeness of musical whole. Not all designers/components from around the world do this...many others demonstrate mastery of a skill set (sheer resolution, incredible dynamic capability, mellifluous golden hue)...but somehow there seems to be a philosophy among these designers that musical whole is the end game...and all technical attributes must be corralled in a way that serves primarily a sense of musical whole.

As a result, even if you hear a Shindo that may not have ultimate resolution, there is this experience when over time, somehow you stop caring about the resolution. The musical presentation is so wonderful, complete in and of itself, and thus it is something you can easily settle into.

Yes, of course, if you have side by side shoot-outs, the inevitable search for the 'best' can well take over, and you might crave the resolution of one, or the dynamic capability of another...but eliminating the shoot out environment...and just having a single Japanese SET from the set I have mentioned leaves many owners with a sense of satisfaction because the designers has ensured that no matter the technical capabilities of the amp, the overall presentation is whole and balanced.

Regarding Lamm and Audio Note, I have not heard either, but could believe they come from a similar philosophy, particularly Lamm from my reading of his designs/work. People still rave about his original Lamm ML 2 amps of 20+ years ago, and there is a whole host of writings from those who still prefer it to the newer ML 2.1 (which has since been replaced by the ML 2.2). I could well imagine the ML 2 is sensational for a whole lot less than modern-day brand new models.

And thus, we come down to price of these many designers listed above from Japan (and Lamm I imagine)...what I have found is that even the more inexpensive or older (and thus equally well priced as second-hand) models come with that same sense of balance. They are self-contained in their own technical capabilities. While the more expensive often give you the same sense of completeness but with more resolution, more dynamic power, more nuance or sense of verve in the music, for some people, listening to the more entry-level pieces can be just as satisfying in practical terms. One person's experience.

 

[Lautreamont]

So it seems there are a lot of options going for Japanese SET amplifiers for a more fair price than the commercialized and well-established companies like Audio Note etc.

Can anyone recommend me brands to look after?

 

[dcc]

Phasemation and CSPort.

 

[Lautreamont]

Is phasemation a company that - like Lamm and Audio Note (and Shindo for that matter) - promote musical sound and romantic represantion?

 

[dcc]

I suggest that you listen to the CSPort GM70PA, the Phasemation MA-1500 and the MA-2000. They don't sound romantic at all.

 

[LL21]

Is phasemation a company that - like Lamm and Audio Note (and Shindo for that matter) - promote musical sound and romantic represantion?

Yes, Phasemation has that reputation, and I see plenty of SOTA systems with the Phasemation phono stage.

 

[bonzo75]

In my limited experience in Japanese high end SET/Tube (or that philosophy of ultra purists, simple circuitry) which includes owning Zanden, Robert Koda and having auditioned Shindo in our system and heard Kondo (dont know it well)...I will say this about the sound.

While each will reflect its designer's very specific approach, each of the above showed to me a completeness of musical whole. Not all designers/components from around the world do this...many others demonstrate mastery of a skill set (sheer resolution, incredible dynamic capability, mellifluous golden hue)...but somehow there seems to be a philosophy among these designers that musical whole is the end game...and all technical attributes must be corralled in a way that serves primarily a sense of musical whole.

As a result, even if you hear a Shindo that may not have ultimate resolution, there is this experience when over time, somehow you stop caring about the resolution. The musical presentation is so wonderful, complete in and of itself, and thus it is something you can easily settle into.

Yes, of course, if you have side by side shoot-outs, the inevitable search for the 'best' can well take over, and you might crave the resolution of one, or the dynamic capability of another...but eliminating the shoot out environment...and just having a single Japanese SET from the set I have mentioned leaves many owners with a sense of satisfaction because the designers has ensured that no matter the technical capabilities of the amp, the overall presentation is whole and balanced.

Regarding Lamm and Audio Note, I have not heard either, but could believe they come from a similar philosophy, particularly Lamm from my reading of his designs/work. People still rave about his original Lamm ML 2 amps of 20+ years ago, and there is a whole host of writings from those who still prefer it to the newer ML 2.1 (which has since been replaced by the ML 2.2). I could well imagine the ML 2 is sensational for a whole lot less than modern-day brand new models.

And thus, we come down to price of these many designers listed above from Japan (and Lamm I imagine)...what I have found is that even the more inexpensive or older (and thus equally well priced as second-hand) models come with that same sense of balance. They are self-contained in their own technical capabilities. While the more expensive often give you the same sense of completeness but with more resolution, more dynamic power, more nuance or sense of verve in the music, for some people, listening to the more entry-level pieces can be just as satisfying in practical terms. One person's experience.

The Zanden preamp and power amps are nowhere in the league of any good sets including those available in the UK for 10k. The only decent thing in Zanden line up is the phono

 

[LL21]

The Zanden preamp and power amps are nowhere in the league of any good sets including those available in the UK for 10k. The only decent thing in Zanden line up is the phono

Good to hear your experience on this. My point is that I have found Japanese designs including SETs to be wholly balanced, particularly Zanden...such that even if their technical merits in one category or another may not match other designs...the overall balance is done very well so that once one stops the shoot-out comparisons, the Japanese designs present such a balanced musical whole, one stops caring. I find Zanden, Shindo, Robert Koda and from my limited experience Kondo to fall squarely into this category.